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sjbricker

Need help with Exterior Gate Finish

Steven
10 years ago
last modified: 10 years ago
I built a custom home which was finished in 2012. One of the main features is a “floating” master bedroom which also creates a covered entry way to the house. The front gate acts both as the front door as well as a security gate for the house.

In less than a year, the finish of the front gate has begun to rust looks awful. The gate is made with McNichols plain steel and then powdercoated. Unfortunately the powder coating has failed. I have been working with the powder coaters, my architect and my builder. No one has a good solution to salvage the existing gate. The powder coater will not guarantee the finish and said the finish will likely fail again. The fabricator of the fence, after much discussion willingly took a sample of the same McNichols material and tried to spray galvanize it and then powder coat it but that did not “take”. The powder coater recommended a plastic dipping which is a thermoplastic powder coating. Unfortunately he does not apply this finish. Everyone agrees that a new gate fabricated in stainless steel would be the best solution. I priced this out and it would cost me anywhere from $6,000 - $8000 for material and labor.

Other things to consider: The fabricator will pay to strip the existing rust/powder coat off the fence. Also, the powder coater will re-powdercoat the fence one time at no additional cost. That said, they advised the same thing will likely happen again and I will be in the same situation 6-8 months from now with this option.

As a homeowner and not a professional architect or builder, I am reaching out to the Houzz community for suggestions to leverage my existing gate or the best long term solution.

Comments (15)

  • PRO
    Kathryn Scott Design Studio Ltd
    10 years ago
    What a dilemma! Where is your house located? Is it by the ocean or subject to salt air? Salt air is very hard on a house, causing a lot more maintenance.

    I have used a product called Rust Mort to inactivate the rust on old interior radiators (it is a car body product), however, since your gate is outside that can only act as layer under a new layer of paint. You may have to consider a exterior grade enamel paint like is used on ironwork instead of powder coating. all the rust will have to be sanded and removed before priming and painting though.
    Steven thanked Kathryn Scott Design Studio Ltd
  • PRO
    JudyG Designs
    10 years ago
    I’m sorry. So disappointing when something fails,,,particularly after such a short time. I checked the website and McNichols doesn’t offer a warranty, which is so surprising.

    I have no answer for you; but for comparison, I have a set of powder-coated aluminum outdoor furniture which has been on my deck for over 12 years and I live 100 yds from the ocean. It looks brand new.

    Alluminum vs steel? Good luck...
    Steven thanked JudyG Designs
  • Steven
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    Kathryn and iamjudy, Thanks for the feedback. The house is located in Houston, Texas. I am not sure what to do.
  • PRO
    ASVInteriors
    10 years ago
    That is surprising they made something in what seems to be carbon steel. It should have been stainless steel. If it wasn't they must know it would have been bound to rust? And then, what was the point of selling it? Do you have more background? Or was this as much a surprise to them as it was to you. By their actions it seems as if it was.
    Steven thanked ASVInteriors
  • PRO
    DMH DESIGN
    10 years ago
    My experience has been that stainless is the way to go near marine environments. We always specify marine grade door hardware for ocean view projects. Here is some feedback from a publication that is right in your wheel house. http://oceanhomemag.com/hardware-coastal-home/. Happy Houzzing.
    Steven thanked DMH DESIGN
  • Steven
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    It sounds like I may need to bite the bullet and move forward with a stainless steel gate. It is a shame that time and money were spent on this gate which functions perfectly yet aesthetically is an eyesore with the rust and corrosion that has accumulated.
  • Steven
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago
    The fabricator told me they would fabricate a new gate for $2,700 in labor. That seems unreasonable considering they provided a solution that did not perform to begin with.
  • PRO
    Scott Design, Inc.
    10 years ago
    Please clarify...$2700 for another plain steel gate?
  • qam999
    10 years ago
    Actually, plain steel is preferred for powder coating and stainless steel is considered problematic. If the powder coating is done right, and there are no major issues with the underlying mertal, you could not possibly be getting such bad results and severe failure in less than a year. It's hard to be sure, but I tend to think it is the coater where you should focus your attention. It is the coater's job to degrease, clean, sand, and otherwise prepare the surface for coating. Perhaps McNichols applied some sort of protective coating that is causing an adhesion failure. I suggest going to a 3rd party expert for consultation on how to do this right. Once you have a plan, if it involves powder coating again, use test samples and then perform adhesion and corrosion tests on the samples before you commit yourself.

    Stainless steel may or may not solve your problem, especially given that you may have to take the native color and finish of the SS, i.e., not coated.

    http://www.paintcenter.org/rj/mar04x.cfm

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powder_coating

    http://www.psppowdercoating.com/index-4.html

    http://www.tomburn.co.uk/images/Upload/file/Home%20Page/Mild%20Steel%20in%20an%20external%20environment.pdf

    http://www.glazinginnovations.co.uk/technical-system-finishes.php

    http://www.pcoating.com/Content/problemsGeneral.aspx
  • Steven
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    Scott Design - This is the response from the fabricator, "If we build the same thing as the existing with all materials provided by you, it will be $2,700 for the labor."

    soberg - I thought the same thing that surely the powder coater did not prepare the gate properly prior to powder coating. Either that or the powder coating was not applied properly. The powder coater is willing to strip the existing gate and powder coat it again. The issue is that he will not guarantee the work nor will he give me assurance this is not likely to occur again.

    The fabricator suggested we add a primer layer before powder coating. I had him do this and here is the feedback from the fabricator:

    "Got bad news from the Galvanizer. The mesh is too tight to hot dip (they tried it). The gate sections are too big to metalize. This puts us back to the question of what to do and how to do it. Big picture is that we can remove the gate and Melvin (the powder coater) can powder the whole thing again but there is no guarantee that it won't rust in the future. The second option is to add an additional primer layer before the powder coating. This adds a second level of protection but still no guarantee that it won't rust in the future. At this point, the only way to prevent rust is to remake the gate in all stainless steel or aluminum. Powder coating could be added to either of those metals to achieve the same look. Unfortunately, this does add the expense and time of remaking the gate."

    After I received this feedback, I asked them about the cost to fabricate a new gate if I bought the stainless material. The $2,700 figure was in the response above.
  • PRO
    Prosperity Contracting
    10 years ago
    For a long term solution i would recommend using absolutely no hardware at all. Go all glass. Trackless hydraulic raising door. There beautiful and have a bit of class that is quite rare.
  • PRO
    Scott Design, Inc.
    10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago
    I'm assuming the issue of rust or product failure was addressed initially during the design phase with your architect and in your contract warranty with the builder? If so, they should be willing to take on the financial requirement to correct the situation or find another solution for you.

    However, I agree with soberg...ask your builder to go to a third party. If they also recommend a thermoplastic coating, then your builder should send your rusty gate out to have it prepped, thermoplastic-coated and reinstalled at no cost to you (if the cost to apply a thermo coat is more than a powder coat you may need to pick up the additional cost).

    If no one guarantees long term rust-free results, then ask your architect to look into other options without a charge back to you for his time.

    Everyone involved should be held accountable for this failure...whether due to a breakdown in communication, lack of product performance knowledge, limited skills or services. Whatever you do...do not get involved with piece meal participation. Do not buy the materials or determine who to use. It just brings you into the "who is responsible for what" mess. You invested in a professional team. They need to step up to the plate and provide a solution without expecting you to give them a "get-out-of-jail-free" card. No one is perfect (including the client) and mistakes will be made. It's the solutions and level of responsibility people are willing to take that separate the men from the boys.
  • Steven
    Original Author
    10 years ago
    Scott Design - that is really how I felt but until now hearing it from another professional, I realize I need to really hold everyone accountable. Thank you for your advise. I will post on here what ends up happening.
  • PRO
    Scott Design, Inc.
    10 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago
    sjbricker...Please be assured that as a design/build general contractor, designer and business owner for over 30 years and one
    a. who has worked first hand with engineers, architects, building officials and sub-contractors
    b. who has spent more time working with property, on the jobsites, at lumber yards, stone yards, plumbing/ electrical/HVAC showrooms/warehouses than in the office,
    I was not being cavalier or naïve with my response.