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nhardy_gw

Comparing English roses,

15 years ago

I'm newbie on this forum. I have one potted tree rose of About Face with four minature roses to fill the bottom of the pot. I drag the pot into the garage in the winter. I prune it in January. I guess I should feel lucky that it does not get BS since I never spray it. I'm more worried about the invasion of Japanese beetles. I received my DA catalog this winter. I would like to plant a few roses in the ground. So I looked @ Roses Unlimited & Heirloom Roses websites. I want something that smell like a rose, that will rebloom more than About Face, disease resistant & the color preference this year seems to be pink with apricot or coral to pink hues. HR has DA, English Legend Roses & Heirloom Roses.

Here is the compare & contrast part. Is one of these more disease resistant & cold hardy since it got down to -12? Is DA more fragrant than Clement or Harkness? Is it better to have the rose on its own rootstock?

Comments (13)

  • 15 years ago

    There are many DA roses and they all have different qualities to them... like some are more hardy than others and some are more fragrant than others. I'm a totally different zone, so I'll let someone else answer you more fu lly.

  • 15 years ago

    actually... DA's website tells you which are hardy for zone 5: (see link below)
    http://www.davidaustinroses.com/american/Advanced.asp?PageId=2063

    Probably A Shropshire Lad is your best bet according to that list and your stated color preference, if you want to go with a super hardy one.... but they say "Almost all the English Roses in our US collection are rated as hardy, which means that they can be grown successfully in zone 5."

    But, like I said, I'm sure you'll get more answers from people in your zone later here, too. :)

    Here is a link that might be useful: DA's Hardy Roses

  • 15 years ago

    nhardy,

    Hello, nice to meet you. :)

    Rootstock will depend on your soil:

    Acid soil: 'Multiflora' is best
    Alkaline soil: 'Dr. Huey' is best

    Own root Austin's haven't performed well for me at all due to our cold winters. All of mine are grafted on 'Dr Huey' and a few on 'Multiflora' that I couldn't find another source for.

    On the DA website, the only roses that are truly CANE hardy in zone 5 are the ones that say "VERY HARDY", when it just says "HADRY", that must be for zone 6 and higher because none of these are cane hardy in my zone 5.

    The best hardy Austins for a beginner would be:
    'Brother Cadfael'
    'St. Swithun'
    'Mayor of Castorbridge'
    'Lilac Rose'
    'Eglantyne'

    There are probably more on their website that I would also suggest but their site is not working for me right now. :( I'll let you know later if it's working again.
    I doubt you will find any of those locally, they would have to be ordered bare root from the website for next spring.

    If you have seen some for sale locally, let me know what they have and I will give you my opinion on them for your needs.

    :)

    Rob

  • 15 years ago

    I keep forgetting to add 'Crocus Rose' to my list of suggestions when people ask. :/ So add that to my list above.

    Rob

  • 15 years ago

    I wouldn't recommend Heirloom roses for zone 5 unless there is no alternative. They are tiny plants that will take longer to get established and that might be in jeapordy the first winter. Larger own-root plants are available from Roses Unlimited and Antique Rose Emporium. David Austin sells large plants grafted on Dr. Huey. If multiflora rootstock is better for your soil, large grafted plants are available from Pickering and Palatine in Canada. These are more likely to be free of rose mosaic virus. Plant grafted roses so the graft is buried and safe from freezing.

  • 15 years ago

    So Dr. Huey it is. Thanks for the other websites!!! So is everyones preference is a DA rose over Harkness or Clements for disease & fragrants?

  • 15 years ago

    I wouldn't say DA roses are more disease-resistant and fragrant than Harkness or Clements roses. Some are, some are not. All three breeders are first-rate. But I do love DA roses and probably would go with them just for that reason.

    Kate

  • 15 years ago

    You need to be asking about particular varieties. Generally the most disease resistant roses are being produced not by those three breeders, but by Radler and Lim in the US and by continental breeders such as Kordes. Some of the recent Austin roses are fairly resistant.

  • 15 years ago

    My very favorite Austins are Radio Times and Sharifa Asma, though my second year St. Swithun is contending for a top spot too.

  • 15 years ago

    Austins are not necessarily more disease resistant than Harkness roses, quite the contrary - of course it depend on the location where you garden. I have Compassion, for example, which is a Harkness rose, and in my garden, in a terribly humid blackspot inferno in the eastern coastal region Compasion has been always 100% blackspot free despite the fact that it is planted in a semi-shady spot. Moreover, it gives me wonderfully fragrant flowers. This Compassion came from Pickering, my first one that I discarded was virused was grafted on Dr. Huey. The newer Fryer roses also have decent disease resistance. And there are Meanwhile the Austins must be sprayed here with 1 or 2 exception. Your mileage may vary, since in the middle of the country the blackspot pressure may not be so severe.

    If you decide to order from David Austin, ask around which roses you should stay away from due to virus problems - as far as I know Sharifa Asma kept coming from them virused. (And if a plant is virused you cannot do anything, it will decline sooner or later, especially in a cold zone.)

    I would also recommend you to check out the new very disease resistant Kordes roses, most of them will probably be hardy for you and quite a number of them have very good fragrance.

    I suggest to visit Pickering nurseries website and look at the selection what they have. Check the "winter hardy" roses" cross reference it with the " disease resistant roses" and then again cross reference it with the 'fragrant roses". If that is too much, Palatine has a smaller list - they deliver the biggest bareroots (grafted) plants I have ever seen.

    Both companies graft on multiflora (this understock started from seed, not from cuttings) so you will get virus free plants. The only contraindication to these roses is if your soils is very alkaline (though you can adjust that with garden sulfur).

    Pickering's website is open for browsing but don't list the new prices yet. Ordering usually starts in August or September and you can reserve your plants for the proper planting time in your area. It make sense to order early because the best and newest roses (new Austins, new Kordes' like Laguna some Harkness) are sold out fast.

  • 15 years ago

    I have the following which have been good and cold hard in zone 5 for many seasons now.

    Graham Thomas, great tea scent. Last year lost many canes during the winter, but it is very vigorous so it springs back quickly and is now blooming. Not great rebloom, 3x a year in flushes. But worth it.

    Most cold hardy: the generous gardener, smells like the peonies I have planted next to it. A cream colored pink and a semi climber with arching canes, give it room.

    Heritage: great scent, great rebloom, very vigourous. My favorite.

    Mary Rose, scent not great but a workhorse and quite healthy, May need a spray for blackspot late in the year. But very nice with good rebloom and will bloom very late into the season into October, starts blooming more as it gets colder.

    Portmeiron. An underated one, darker pink than Mary rose, again not much scent but a workhorse.

    I have not had any blackspot problems with these, except for Mary rose. The austins do very well in zone 5.
    Some are grafted but I have had them so long, they are probably own root by now. Dr. Huey does well on alkaline soil we have here.

    Also own root does well because because Austin english roses are vigorous. I have Mary rose, portmeiron, generous gardener all on own root and have had good success though it takes several years to build up to a good size: esp the smaller ones. This was not an issue with the generous gardener though.

    I recommend Chamblees own root and David Austin.

  • 15 years ago

    I used to live z5b and got hooked on D.Austin roses. When I moved to Minnesota, I felt like I would be losing a close friend. However, I threw common sense to the wind and started a new garden of DA roses and have had good success. (I currently have 36 plants, 12 varieties). When planting, the crown union should be buried about 1" below the surface to protect it from winter exposure. Unlike the professed "tipping" method used here for winter survival, I bury the plants with oak leaf mulch. Before mulching, I spray the canes with an anti-dessicant to help against cold, cutting winds. That and with the snow cover, I haven't lost a plant in 5 years. It will require substantial spring pruning given most exposed canes die of winter burn.

    One issue I have had to stay on top of is blackspot, primarily in the fall. With the cool, moist nights and warm fall days, BS will thrive. A regular program of spraying may be necessary and be sure to start at the very first evidence of it. Also use spreader sticker in the application(s) for more effective coverage.

    As far as hardiness, I have tended to only plant those described as "hardy", but not exclusively. The following have thrived - and if I may boast a bit, are looking magnificent so far this spring - here in Zone 4a:

    Crocus Rose...Charlotte...Queen of Sweden....A Shropshire Lad...Brother Cadfael...Glamis Castle...Jude the Obscure...Graham Thomas...Pat Austin...LD Braithwaite (but hasn't thrived like the others)...Carding Mill...and Golden Celebration. It takes a bit of effort, but the reward is well worth the 2 advils at the end of the day.

    Hope this helps with your decision-making.

  • 15 years ago

    I grow about 35 David Austin roses now and find almost all of them to be crown hardy and sometimes cane hardy (St. Swifton, Mayor of Casterbridge and Constance Spry for example). The rest quickly recover from winter and put out good new cane. I do mound about 12" of shredded bark over them in November, and wrap the taller climbers in 3 layers of burlap, which often is enough to protect the canes.