Thank you so much for all the responses!

Bullthistle, Sometimes it is foolish to take on Mother Nature. I am not real happy with Mother Nature this year. She wasn't so nice to us here in MN. Terribly cold. She fooled with me...I may fool with her (and prove her wrong.)

Thanks Dr Andre and gandle, Nice to hear they have worked for you. I can handle the watering. I am pretty good at garden maintenance (cooking and cleaning not so much.)

pineresin, I may be back to a nursery that sold me a Zone 5 plant or tree (since I decided to take the risk) but I probably wouldn't try the same one.

ginkgonut, I may have to check that out. I haven't been to the arboretum in many years and need to get back out there.

OK basic, you have talked me into it! Joy or heartbreak here I come. (Once all this snow melts.)

Thanks again!

I planted a strawberry katsura tree in the wrong place -- not wet enough, exposed to harsh sun and wind. But it's alive! Buds swelling almost to the tippy top. Will make sure it gets enough water now. Looking forward to the fragrance it is supposed to have in fall.

My katsura in zone 4 is now 17 years old. I reiterate the need for ample water if you want it to do well. But it will grow otherwise too. Younger tree trunks need to be protected from sunscald (maybe frost cracking too) until bark becomes rough.

Thanks for all the feedback. Much appreciated.

I too planted a Katsura in my zone 4 yard here in WI and after approx. 15 years is is doing very well and is spectacular to see. It never fails to get comments regarding it's interesting shape or autumn color, even from people who are usually oblivious to trees. It began as just a sad looking, rabbit bitten stick with a single branch left on one side. It was given to me by a master garder who suggested it would be the perfect tree for my yard that more often than not floods for several weeks in the early spring (this year being no exception). It now stands 15-20 ft tall with a double trunk that I decided to leave alone because I felt it added even more character to it's shape. It's without a doubt my favorite tree in the yard.
Based on my experience, I'd absolutely recommend trying Katsura in zone 4. If it takes it will be entirely worth the time and effort.
I should also add that this past winter was the worst we've seen in decades here in the midwest, yet my tree is leafing out just as it always has with no visible negative effects from the cold.

Thanks for the feedback, tditzgb! I am planning to go looking at nurseries this weekend. Your tree sounds wonderful. Any pics?

"...I really didn't want one anyway..."

gandle & Bob, I am weeping with laughter, I can so relate.

"I am pretty good at garden maintenance (cooking and cleaning not so much.)"

kitchenkelly, nothing wrong with that!

p.s. This tree is a favorite of mine, I forgot to post "keep on trying, it is so worth it!"

BTW it IS hardy to zone 4, but requires a somewhat protected site even here in zone 5, where you'll get the full benefit of the burnt sugar smell in fall. It dislikes windy sites or dry soils, or too much sun.

I just bought/picked-out an 8ft multi-stem Katsura for spring. The nursery grows their own trees on a 200 acre plot of land. They took me out in the feild and they had a few 20ft Katsuras...I'd assume they are at least 15-20 years old? That nursery is borderline zone 4A/4B.

Anybody have pictures of their Katsura?

Well, based on this thread and some personal recommendations for this tree, I purchased a couple dwarf Katsura trees. Actually should call them twigs, very small, but very inexpensive. Good for experimenting. I have a nice area of ground that usually floods in spring and fall rains, so I think they will be happy in there with the other trees, barn on one side for wind protection. We can get quite cold, but not equal to Wisconsin or MN! I will plan to water in late summer during our dry season after your recommendations about the need for extra water.

I found mine on Ebay, since all the local Nursery folks had were large, fairly expensive young trees though very nice. Kind of pricy for experimenting to me. The ebay ones arrived with bright red leaves, lovely color. Planted them outside in pots sunk into my holding garden area. Stems were a pretty red as well. Very small, but supposed to get up about 15ft, as dwarf trees.

I put a rabbit fence around them and the new beech saplings planted there, so the pesky rabbits won't snack on them. I have already found some rabbit snacking on my PeeGee Hydrangea. Buds and some stick gone. Darn rabbits, there is still plenty of grazing left, shouldn't be nibbling the good stuff yet. I have all my shrubs, young tree sprouts fenced in for winter now. Must be half mile of fencing out there, formed into circle cages!!

Thank you all for showing me another interesting tree. I will tell you how they do next spring.

How nice to see this thread again. I was the original poster and I bought my Katsura based on all the helpful info I got from everyone here. I don't have a pic of mine but I googled and found this lovely pic.

I hope mine will aspire to this

Here is a link that might be useful: Katsura pic

I never read the whole thread, so not sure if this is already mentioned. They tend to suffer from sunscald and need protection while young. I lost one that was over 8ft tall. I have two others that are still alive, but they have branches close to the ground and that seems to protect the trunk. Just works better if planted in a forest setting rather than out in open like mine are. I bought alot more this spring and hope to site them in better spots. They are an unique and beautiful tree.

I've seen a 25 ft katsura tree thriving in Edmonton, Alberta zone 3 ... I've been wanting one for myself ever since!

Terry

I'd love to have a Katsura, but I have neither the space nor the moist soil.

If anyone's ever near Asheville, NC, go see the big one in the garden at the Biltmore Estate. It's HUGE, every bit of 65 feet tall, one of the most imposing trees I've ever seen. Simply gorgeous.

I have a Katsura that is going into its second winter. Took a low of -39 last year with no dieback. Worst winter I’ve experienced. I think we hit -30s about 8 times and the typical year It will hit it once or twice.

From what I understand Katsura is a zone 4 plant in moisture retentive soils and protected from winter winds.

I had severe dieback from that nasty 2012 winter - zone 5. My current specimen had dieback last year - negative 13 was the low.

I always look at these types of discussions as having circumstantial outliers for trees thriving in zones that they shouldn’t be able to thrive in. Or perhaps we don’t get the full story as far as the micro climate that the tree may be planted in. I know many zone 4 gardeners that cannot get a Katsura to survive

My issue with Katsura have been early season frosts.

Plant Love, where are you located? Where did you buy it and do you know its provenance? How big is it? Was it snow covered for most of last winter? Inquiring minds want to know.

The coldest we've ever hit is -36F, and that was many years ago. I should add that I am one of those z4 gardeners that has had nothing but failure with this tree.

There are some Katsuras around the Twin Cities. Not sure, though, if you go buy one or mail order that they are all sources are reliably hardy around here. One major problem this plant has, when grown as a single trunk tree form especially, is severe frost cracking of the trunks. Probably best grown as a clump (multistem) in a protected site and kept branched low.

Source is nutcracker nursery. I bought it at 3 feet and it’s now 4 feet. We had almost no snow on the ground when we got -39. My thujas and ponderosa pine burned on the south side it was so cold. Seed source is everything. This tree is native to China and almost all of Japan. The Chinese source is in areas much further south and warmer than the northern Japan source. That’s why you are getting such a difference.

Mine doesn’t change colour in time and has had it leaves just burn off two years in a row as we can get harsh frosts in early October. It leafs out around early may so it stays away from the harsh late frosts.

Its completely exposed to winds except for a tree belt which is about 100ft north of me. Other than that, it gets all of winter. Believe me, I lucked out and I know but if you order from nutcracker, you should get the exact same source as I have.

Honest though, lots of the trees in my yard are zone 4 and many are doing fine even with last years zone 3 winter.

Here’s a great site explaining everything about the tree.

http://rslandscapedesign.blogspot.com/search/label/Cercidiphyllum?m=0

Thank you!

I grew a bunch of seedlings a few years ago from the Arboretum plants when I found them in seed during a visit. Really easy to germinate too, just scattered in a pot in the fall and they sprouted in spring. I planted most in a clearing in a nearby woods, gave a few away on Craigslist, and planted a particularly nice one in a part of our yard where the sump pump discharges for half the year. Deer and clay soil in the wods have slowed the growth of those wild trees, but the one in my yard is doing well, growing 18" a year so far even after a -25F winter (30 min south of Minneapolis).

Just so US folks in cold areas don’t get their hopes up, Nutcracker Nursery and Tree Farm is in Quebec and I don’t find any mention of shipping to the US on their website. So I think that this is only a Canadian source.

http://www.nutcrackernursery.com/

I'm in a rather severe frost-hollow (hard frosts often in early May, sometimes in mid-May), and my Katsura shows good resistance to the late frosts. New growth may shrivel & even blacken slightly, but isn't killed & continues growing. Some of my other species have new growth completely killed.

Long term success of woody plants depends on them coming through everything a climate may throw at them. Thus instances of short term persistence like 15-18 years (really nothing in tree time) do not demonstrate that a sharp winter will be survived. Unless a real killer comes during that same period and a planting is not spoiled.

I believe Nutcracker Nursery does sell to the US, but shipping costs can be high.

Plant Love, yes, seed source is everything and I think you know you got yourself one tough little tree there if it can laugh off the head shaking extreme weather we experience in these parts! I mean it's not at all uncommon to get snow in early September and our autumns and winters are often of profound sharp variability and bitter harshness! Indeed, only time will tell how your specimen continues to handle what's thrown at it, though so far so good I'd say! That linked article is great reading and pics are really something else aren't they! It states of the the tree being reported to grow in Winnipeg and I'll again mention of the large specimen in nw Edmonton that had taken me by total surprise!

The nutcracker nursery sells Hoptree -- never seen that on sale before.....

For all you American folks wanting to order from nutcracker, if they won’t ship just ask them where they get their seed source. Other trees I’ve asked about, they said they get them from Sheffield’s so I would guess the same for Katsura unless they use cuttings off a Quebec tree. They grow fine in Montreal so I am guessing that may be the case.

Embothrium: you are 100% correct which is why I was stoked to see it get through the coldest winter I’ve ever experienced but apparently lows have gotten a few degrees colder than that here in the past. Established trees can handle more than small ones though so I feel good about it.

Ironically enough, I’ve read of way too many experiences where trees have gotten through terrible winters, only to die in one of the mildest ones. The tree will do what it wants to do I guess. Too many variables.

Bengz, I am blown away that you see hard frost in mid May that far south. Makes me feel a little better lol. And yes my katsura has seem some good spring frosts already and it seems to handle them with ease.

I started an autumn blaze pear this year and wow that thing is amazingly frost hardy. It was the last tree with fall coloured leaves into November for me and saw -7c (18f I think) with no burn and just kept turning a beautiful red and purple. Meanwhile the hardiest native poplars and Manitoba maples all burned in October with barely any fall color. What a joke.

Be aware that in our area, the late leaves on Callery pears can be a serious problem if it snows or there is freezing rain before they drop their leaves. The weak wood can’t take the weight, so they fall apart.

The fruit doesn’t have time to ripen this far north, so they haven’t been the invasive nightmare that they are farther south, but ornamental pears tend to have a quite short life span in New England. And most likely in Quebec as well. Also, comparing most trees this year is a bit unfair with our unusually late warmth and weird mix of wet and dry all season. Yes this year the callery pears looked great, but some years they are a mess of brown when it gets really cold before they turn color, also illustrated above. And most smell pretty bad in bloom. Can you tell I am not a fan? There are so many really nice trees, including some of the Freeman maples for late bright fall color, without the disadvantages of ornamental pears that I wouldn’t consider planting one.

Often the breakage problem with Callery pear cultivars is due to how they branch.

I’ve heard all the nightmares about callery pears. I’m just doing it as an experiment to see how far I can push it. I keep my trees pruned very diligently as well. But all good to know.

I got lots of maples in my yard. Just got an autumn blaze this year, crimson sunset, prairie splendor (crimson king sport), red rocket maple, tatarian maple.

I'm not an expert as to how plants evolve to become more hardy when they are brought to areas outside their native range but it would be interesting to know if there truly are isolated Katsura populations in the coldest areas of Japan (equivalent to zone 3 I believe).

Keep us posted on your specimen! Its quite a feat for any young plant to survive -40 with limited to no snow cover.

I will post pictures in spring whether dead or alive but I’m rooting for alive as our winter started off decently and we are in El Niño which typically gives us a warmer than average winter. So far we are about ten degrees celcius warmer than last winter which is pretty fantastic. We got a really cold night last week but one day isn’t normally a problem and not near as bad as last year. I have some good snow cover right now too.

Great to talk trees in the dead of winter btw. If any of you want to bring up some of the other cool trees you have, I would be excited to talk about them.

As far as finding a population of Japanese katsura in zone 3, I feel like you would be hard pressed as it seems like the farthest north the range map is, looks to be about Sapporo which is zone 5... but if they are in the mountains, then I’m sure it could reach zone 3. Need to find a person from japan on this forum! There was a confirmed sighting of one in Winnipeg which is zone 3 and has seen easily below -40 which is zone 2 winters. To be honest, Winnipeg has the harshest temperatures I’ve ever seen for a major Canadian city.

Winnipeg — burrr. Plant Love, have you tried Stewartia?

Hey Maackia. No I have not but from that tree site I posted, I feel like it would be worth trying Chinese Stewartia. It’s ranked zone 3 on his site and Japanese is zone 4 I believe. I’ve heard of Minnesotans doing the Japanese. It looks like a beautiful tree. Bark looks like a painting just like a sycamore.

Speaking of sycamore, that is one tree I have no success with because it doesn’t change color no matter how cold it gets outside and just burns all of its new growth which is typically lots of the tree considering how fast it grows. I got a Quebec zone 4 seed source and that still doesn’t help. They get way later fall frosts. Barely anything till November and we are into hard frosts at beginning of October.

I have a Korean Stewartia (S. pseudocamillia Koreana group that has done fine here. It has seen -23F as a very young tree, so it seems pretty hardy, though slow growing. It is quite pretty, but I think I may need to move it because I didn’t give it enough space.

Plant Love, here in my frost hollow my sycamore also gets its new growth often "burned" by the late frosts and sometimes can't recover its foliage until late June/early July.

I was wrong about Chinese stewartia. It’s the Korean that is supposed to be hardiest with Japanese in a close second. Both ranked zone 4 by certain growers that have had success.

I mentioned the supposedly superior cold hardiness of Korean Stewartia to the Dulith, MN-based nurseryman I bought my S. pseudocamellia. I suspect he had heard this before, and he became almost agitated when I mentioned it. I have no idea if one is hardier than the other, but they are both hardy in z4. Mine has seen -25F a few times. It survived the infamous 2013-‘14 winter with no visible damage whatsoever, but flowering was very sparse that season.

I’m convinced. I need to see some pictures in the spring.

I planted a sycamore last summer I bought from Wal-Mart. I don't have high hopes for it, but we'll see. You should have seen the ridiculous stuff Wally World was selling; rhododendrons, azaleas, magnolias, ect.. it was comical. They were selling little 'Accolade' elms, of which I bought two and do have high hopes for, one for my yard and one for my apts. Sorry, I don't mean to hijack the thread.

Why do you not have high hopes for the sycamore? Super cold temps in October? We grow a couple types of rhodos and azaleas here. My wife’s grandmother has three rhodos that are about 3ft tall.

I've got little hope for the sycamore because it's unknown what its provenance is. It could come from Georgia for all I know. Wal-Mart was selling all sorts of zone 6 fruit trees and other ridiculous stuff that would have no chance of surviving here.

I was not aware that rhododendrons/azaleas could grow in such cold climates. I'm intrigued now lol. What variety are they? have you got a picture of the blossoms?

They didn’t blossom last year but they normally do. Probably the abnormally cold winter. The variety is PJM and Helsinki University. For azaleas, plant the northern light series. The rhodos don’t get any snow cover really as they are covered by large spruce but they are protected from wind.

And they have seen below -40.