Bear with me if I have your question wrong, ok? But if I understand correctly you don't want to use your hard water to do the BWB because it is so hard, right?

That isn't a problem. Just use your water in the BWB and add to it a good splash of white vinegar before putting the jars in - about 1/4 cup. Honestly, my water is as hard as it is possible to be and this works. There is no need to use distilled water to BWB in.

Otherwise how would you plan to seal - inversion? I can't recommend that.

The Ball no-sugar powdered pectin is great stuff. We have never had a batch fail to set with it (unlike with Sure-Jell) and wife claims she must own stock in it by now with all she has used. ;)

Dave

Thanks for the input, but maybe I should have worded that a little better... By hard water, I mean hard and nasty, as in lots of free sulfur and a rediculous amount of calcium sulfate (I live atop some of the largest gypsum deposits in the country)... When my water boils, it starts precipitating sulfate and other garbage before it's even steaming. If vinegar works for you, I'd imagine your "hardness" is due to carbonates, which would effectively be turned to soluble acetates when vinegar's involved - That doesn't work with sulfates... I have an RO system, but due to the small capacity it takes about 18 hours to draw enough water to fill my canner, inconveniencing my family in the meantime - That's why I usually use distilled water.

...Never tried the inversion method, never trusted it... I've noticed that when properly prepared (hot water soak), my lids always seal - Probably due to the softening of the rubber and the steam inside the jar...However, everything I've prepped like that went straight into the fridge and was used in a couple of days - What I'm wondering is if I can trust a non-processed jar of jelly for, lets say, 12-24 hours before it hits the fridge.

- A side note - From what I've read, it seems like the no-sugar is a more reliable pectin than the normal stuff - I take it this is your experience as well? And from the sounds of it, you've had sure-jell problems too? I figure for what I put into picking I'd rather just stick with what I know will work than waste all that blood for nothing...Although if the no-sugar works out I'll planning to switch to it entirely.

Why don't you just save the water after it cools down? If your jars are clean when they go in, and you're sterilizing them in the DW (or another pan of distilled water), I don't see why you can't rebottle that water to use to process another batch, though of course you'll have to add to it to replace what evaporated the first time.

OK, avoiding the water issue, without processing the jars "seal" but the seal is weak and the vacuum is minimal, so likelihood of failures and mold is higher. How much higher is partly a function of your particular storage conditions so I can't give a statistic on that.

If you are making a full-sugar jam and want to take the risk, that's up to you. It's mainly a quality, not a health issue, as long as you discard the contents of any jars where you detect mold. Do not just scrape off the visible portion and eat the rest.

But I would never use the open-kettle method for a low-sugar jam. It's the sugar which provides the preservative qualities. Reducing sugar automatically guarantees a high rate of spoilage, like leaving plain berries on the counter for a few weeks.

I don't know if it's helpful, but many Extension sites provide instructions on home-softening of water for pickling. Unless your water presents unique problems, that should be sufficient for boiling water bath. Also, as ajsmama mentioned, save and re-use the water. Loss from batch-to-batch would be minimal.

Carol

Carol - Thanks, that's the kind of answer I was looking for. Wasn't thinking about the low sugar preservation issues when I posted but since you mentioned it it's all coming back. That raises another question, though - When I do jelly, I usually go big and make a few cases of each fruit...Full sugar has tasted the same 4 years later, can I expect the same from the low sugar recipes? Properly canned it will be sterile (until the lids degrade at least), but has anyone noticed any flavor degradation over time (ie 2+ years)?

...Not sure why you guys are focusing on my water...I have a great softener that takes care of the majority of the calcium, but it still leaves a crapload of sodium sulfate - Though the RO takes care of that, it's just slow when you need more than a gallon. The reason I asked the question in the first place is that I'd like to make ONE batch now to determine whether I'll go low-sugar or full sugar this year - I'm not going full swing for 1-2 weeks, so I'd rather do as usual and use everything fresh THEN rather than start now and have my water sit around used until then...I'm not a fan of waste on the odd chance that it doesn't store well.

It's hard to tell when the OP mentions water issues and jam storage issues which take precedent.

We're just pointing out you don't need to spend good money for distilled water to can in.

Research on low-sugar products is scant (and with loss of funding now pretty much non-existent). I have read some studies which indicate shelf life is lower than that of a full-sugar jam (which may lose color and some measure of flavor but be entirely edible for years).

The NCHFP says Reduced sugar jams and jellies may deteriorate in color and texture more quickly as they lack the full preservative effects of the sugar. Some fruits may darken more quickly with less sugar present. Flavor changes that occur over time become more evident if they are usually otherwise masked by the sugar.

So personally I wouldn't plan on keeping a low-sugar product more than a year. I made one low-sugar apricot-raspberry I was particularly unhappy with. Next canning season, I ended up tossing the remainder on the compost pile.

Carol

...Not sure why you guys are focusing on my water...

As I said up front bear with if I misunderstand your question. It did sort of ramble. ;)

But when someone starts talking about "not processing" something it tends to get our attention since for the most part "not processing" is not acceptable. I think that is why the focus shifted to the water issue - an effort to solve it so to encourage normal processing.

So to shift the focus - as I said the Ball no-sugar pectin has worked exceptionally well for us and it is all we are using this year so far. However, it does NOT have near the shelf life of sugared jams and jellies just as Carol said. I'd agree with her 1 year shelf life estimate. It also will not have near the fridge shelf life of sugared jams once opened. It remains safe for all practical purposes but is unappealing in color, flavor and consistency.

That long shelf life is of no concern to us as we don't make it by the case load and very few of our jars make it beyond a year. But if you desire long term storage and make cases of fruit jams then I'd recommend sticking with the regular sugar pectins for the best results.

Sorry to have gotten off-track on the water issue.

Dave

Excellent...Thanks for the input, you guys pretty much answered all my questions there. I had an inkling that long-term storage would be affected, but one year is quite a surprise - I figured I'd get at least 2 without flavor/color changes... Perhaps I'll go half and half then, depending on how things turn out. Been a bit busier than I had anticipated, I should be able to run a test batch tomorrow and see how it turns out.

...Thanks again for the input, and if anyone else has any comments keep 'em comin...

Even with a full-sugar jam you will often get color/flavor changes within a year. Certainly beyond a year. Strawberry, raspberry, the lighter apricot and peach, will usually begin to brown or fade in color sometime during that period, though they will still be safe to consume and probably perfectly acceptable for baking, etc.

Partly it depends on fluctuations of heat and cold in the storage area as well as exposure to light. Dark storage will slow down the deterioration as will a steady temperature in the 60's or 70's.

Carol

Today I dumped 3 jars of sugar free peach jam. It had turned really brown and was not good tasting. I find the dark ones, like grape and plum keep much longer.
The sugar free plum jelly is fine,though, and 2 years old. It is just starting to get a bit "weepy" on top. I need to use it up soon.
I was cleaning out my canning pantry today. I did not think I had any sugar free jelly , but found the plum. That was a nice surprise.

Low/no sugar jellies I have found are lower shelf life, both unopened and opened.
The blueberry jelly low sugar I made last year had a 8month shelf life and the test jar that was open in the refrigerator basically turned to liquid.

My low sugar jams on the other hand aren't weeping at all and no loss of color for the reds or blues.

Agree, the high oxidation fruits such as peaches and nectarines turn more quickly. I prefer for those making small batches and the rest of the fruits I can halfs in no sugar juice, make those jams as I need.

I also freeze alot of berries till I can use them. The one jam I make is a combo of red raspberries, blueberries,strawberries and rhubarb I make large batches and measure the 4 cups for one batch of low sugar jam and freeze.

I've made a lot of jams with Pomona pectin, using low amounts of sugar, and I agree that the shelf life is reduced. Less than a year unopened, and a week or so opened.

I'm back to making them with full sugar, or no pectin and living with less firmness.

Thanks again for all the input, everyone. After sharing some jars from my test batch I can definitely say that I'm going with the low-sugar this year. My main reason for wanting it was simply the amount of sugar in the normal Ball recipes - I tend to give away quite a bit of what I make and the only complaint I've recieved, quite regularly, is that it's too sweet. The reduced sugar level definitely lets more of the fruit flavors shine through, without the overpowering taste of sugar. For reference, I used the recipe in the box, 4 cups black raspberry juice (from ~1.5 quarts of berries and enough water to come halfway up them in the pan) and 3 cups of sugar - Yeild was around 2.5 pints...I could have probably got some more, but I didn't realize how fast this stuff jels up. Normally, after finishing the rolling boil, I let it sit for about 2-3 minutes - this way the foam forms a kind of "skin" and is much easier to skim off - The low sugar set so quick that I lost nearly a quarter of a pint just in skimming th foam.

...Will be clearing out my freezer this week and making up some jelly - Should get around 10-12 pints each of black raspberry and blackberry with what's in there now, and yes, I will be firing up the water canner. Thinking about taking some down to the local farmer's market as well to see if the owners would be interested in selling any.

-Thanks again for the info, I do appreciate the comments and concerns...