Yum.

Cool. A mystery mater. Hope it breeds true for you.

Hmmm. Doof's Cherry?

Bets

Cool. A mystery mater. Hope it breeds true for you.

Hmmm. Doof's Cherry?

Bets

Someone switched the tags? Mismarked? Someone sneaky messing with your seeds?

Was the MP you grew the smooth or ribbed version?

It's also good to know that small fruit size is dominant to larger fruit size.

For the several accidental crosses that I've gotten I've never been able to figure out the male parent not only b'c at the time I was growing so many varieties, but also b'c it's known that bees can fly several miles, so I wouldn't a priori assume that something growing close might be the parent.

But the ribbing may actually be a tip off if you were growing the ribbed version of MP.

Since the MP is homozygous recessive for PL and the others could be either homozygous dominant or heterozygous for PL about the only way you'd get a PL F2 is if the other parent was heterozygous and then you might get 25% that are PL.

I love a mystery. ( smile)

Carolyn

What do I think?

If the tomato you show is an F1 hybrid and the seed mother is Black Cherry and the only choices/chances for the pollen donor are: Druzba, Marianna's Peace, Eva Purple Ball or Burgundy Traveler, my quess would be Druzba due to the apparent epidermis color which appears to be yellow.

Yup, my Marianna's were ribbed, like half-inflated beach balls.

Since this is an RL plant, and the parent was an RL plant, I hope that I can determine if the mystery parent was a PL by sprouting seeds to see if I get 25% PL's. If it comes out PL, that's a dead giveaway because I didn't have any other PL's that year.

And, hey, it's mid-June in here in Southern California, zone 10a,, so it is rather late but not too late to actually plant a few F2s to see what happens.

Which of these genes are dominant or recessive or none of the above?

1. Black/dark flesh color.
2. Yellow or clear-skin color.
3. Flattened beefsteak shape or round shape.

Doof,

I think that's a really cool tomato. I can't explain why, even to myself, but I want to create my own tomato and then take the time to stabilize the cross. The long drawn out process appeals to me.

Carolyn said, "It's also good to know that small fruit size is dominant to larger fruit size."

So, if I'm deliberately trying to cross Yellow Pear (because it loves it here, is adorable, and supposedly is bland thus might be improved) -- then if successful, I should expect little pear tomatoes? Should I expect them to be slightly larger if crossed with Traveler or a beefsteak or the same size? Also, I know this thread is about Doof's cool cross, but in your opinion would I be better off using Yellow Pear as mom or dad?

M-Bob, I am not Carolyn nor do I play her on TV, but ...

"So, if I'm deliberately trying to cross Yellow Pear ... if successful, I should expect little pear tomatoes?"

If crossed with Traveler or a beefsteak type, no, not in the F1. And probably not in the F2 unless you grow out a huge number of plants because, as I've been told, there are two recessive genes in play with the pear shape. I think the chances of grape-shaped or plum-shaped fruits are higher down the line in the grow-outs than a pear-pear shaped fruit, but that is just a hunch.

"Should I expect them to be slightly larger if crossed with Traveler or a beefsteak or the same size?"

Yes, slightly larger than Yellow Pear but no where near as large as the other of those two parents. If yellow pear were crossed with Traveler, I would expect the F1 to be generally round and just over 2 ounces. If crossed with an average one pound beefsteak, I would expect a "mini-beefsteak" saladette size tomato of about 3 ounces in the F1. Larger fruit will show up in many of the eventual segregations and recombinations from F2 onward.

"Also, I know this thread is about Doof's cool cross, but in your opinion would I be better off using Yellow Pear as mom or dad?"

With either Traveler or Beefsteak, I would use Yellow Pear as the pollen donor because: 1) the other parents have larger blossoms with larger pistils and much easier to emasculate, and 2) because Yellow Pear gives way more blossoms so provides more opportunity for and yield of pollen.

Hi doof,

Did you mention where you got your seeds?

I thought I'd made a mistake in labeling but a couple of plants did not match the plants of the same variety in my planting this year. The 2 plants in question were Baby Beefsteak and Black cherry.

I got these two seeds from Wintersown.org, and this is not at all a knock on her, but perhaps some of the seeds were switched somehow? I'm growing the plants to find out for sure!

I got my seeds from my garden, self-saved. The original package I started with were purchased about three or four years ago from Tomatogrowers.com

I'm no way the expert these guys are here about tomatoes and hybridization. But if you're going to cross Yellow Pear, I would suggest using it to pollinate some good-tasting POTATO-LEAVED tomato plant. That way, you'll know if the crossing took as soon as you sprout the seeds because regular-leaf is dominant and if the cross is successful, the seedlings should be RL, unlike the mother plant. That could save you six months of your life trying to guess if it worked or not, because you'll see it right away.

I don't know if I would claim this is that cool a tomato. More "interesting" than "cool." I really love the taste, but the shape is even more interesting. If I were going to segregate this and make a real tomato with a name and all that, I would want to select for the shape. My Gardener's Delight cherries are ripening right now, and I prefer the flavor of that, but they are two very different kind of tomatoes. I let my renters' three year old pick hiw own GD off the vine just about ten minutes ago; his expression was priceless!

I let my renters' three year old pick his own GD off the vine just about ten minutes ago; his expression was priceless!

Yes! Get them addicted when they're young! (Addicted to gardening? to tomatoes? to both!)

Great tomato! Saving heirloom seeds takes a lot of care. Guessing what you will get from a hybrid/heirloom cross is nearly impossible.

But enjoy what you have, it seems a winner. :)

travelsfo,

????

I'm not getting what you're saying.

trudi,
I'm not saying anything now. I thought perhaps it was a mixup of seeds and if doof had also gotten the same seeds from you then that would have answered the question. However, since he had not gotten them from you then the issue is really with me mislabeling the seeds that I received from you when I planted them.

Hi Travelsfo,

Baby Beefsteak will look exactly like its name, it's very similar to Doof's pict. The Black Cherry is much smaller and darker, nearly round and maybe an inch across; and Black Cherry is a lot more prolific than Baby Beefsteak. You'll be able to ID the two types once they start maturing ;-)

It's long been my policy that I never pack more than one variety at a time. I only pull one bulk variety, I pack it into little zips, and then the bulk pack goes back in its drawer before I pull another. And, once they're packed they do get labeled immediately. The labels are printed while I'm packing. Packed seeds are all stored in their own pidgeon holes--each label has a different picture. I work very hard at keeping it all well organized.

T

Trudi, what's the story on Baby Beefsteak? You sent me seeds as well. I can't find anything about it except in Cornell's database, from someone who also received seeds from you.

Is it a Beefsteak cross, or does it just look like one? Is it related to Burpee's Baby Beef (not much info on that one either)? Or is it just another good tomato from the compost pile?

It came as a bonus pack in a national round robin trade several years before I grew it, and it was only labeled "Baby Beefsteak". At the time there was no info available; I grew it out and lo and behold, it looked just like a baby beefsteak. Whomever labeled that pack of seeds once upon a time called it as they saw it. Very practical.

It's a wonderful tomato, I've described it well on the package, it looks just like a baby beefsteak but is more juicy and tangy. I liked them so much I've grown them a few times and have shared their seeds with the name they came with.

I'm very serious about tomato variety names. I don't change the docmentation that comes with a home-saved OP; I think that's hugely unethical. This year I'm doing another growout of a variety that came to me a few years back only labeled "Purple Heirloom". This is a yum YUM tomato. I'm also doing one again that I named "Big Pink Volunteer" which volunteered from a bag of compost I bought at HD. It makes awesomely good big pink maters, hence the name. The history will be on the label.

Should the season go well I'll have seeds of Purple Heirloom, Big Pink Volunteer, the ten USDA/GRIN tomatoes I'm growing and several others available on the site by late Autumn. It's a fabulous set of tomatoes in the garden this year. I'm definitely going to have to buy at least one more set of pidgeon holes ;-)

Hope this helps,

T

Thanks for the info, Trudy. I certainly didn't mean to imply you might have changed the name.

When I was looking through online databases for Baby Beefsteak, I found a brief mention of Baby Beef in NCSU's mostly-commercial tomato cultivar list. [Brief = "Burpee" and "1999." LOL] Because of the similarity of the names, I wondered if perhaps Baby Beef was a hybrid (like so many of Burpee's), and someone had grown it out and named the resulting OP tomato Baby Beefsteak.

I know you didn't Missing, but I wanted to provide clarity for everyone about tomato seeds that are offered on WinterSown.Org ;-)

T

trudi, the funny thing is I have never seen a baby beefsteak tomato and, yet, when I saw that tomato sitting in doof's hand, the first thing I thought was BABY BEEFSTEAK. It was just so coincidental -- I can't wait for mine to start putting out baby beefsteaks now!!!

The name fits! It really does.

I think you will like them a lot. I would eat them outside with a salt shaker in one hand and the tomato in the other, but jkinda bent over so the juice wouldn't run down my face toooo much. They're very slurpy with a little tang to the taste. Really, all they need if you like, is just a small dash of salt.

I remeber making a nice salad with some of them just quartered, and mixed with a can of rinsed chickpeas, then some diced onion, some fresh basil, a little balsamic and little olive oil. The tang of the baby beefsteaks works good with mild chickpeas. Yum. I'm drueling as I type just thinking about it.

Your thread got hijacked, I'm sorry ;-)

I hope you save seeds of your not-black-cherry, it looks really nice.

T

That last pic looks exactly like my Eva Purple Ball tomatoes, just a little bit smaller (or you have really large hands).

I had the same "problem" with one of my black cherry plants. What was labeled as black cherry has produced huge 3/4 to 1 lb red fruit with slightly ribbed shoulders. I think it's actually a Marianna's Peace as it has the same "mitten" shaped leaves.