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sandra_zone6

Quote out of line?

16 years ago

I am in NW CT. We are normally DIYers but hubby is crazy busy in a project at work right now and cannot commit to redoing our kids bath. We have a quote from a friend who does mainly bath and kitchen renos that I think it way too high.

For some background, I will do the demo work which I've done before with my kids. We have tile, ditra, vanity, fixtures and toilet already. The bathroom is 5 x 7 with a tub/shower combo off to the side in an alcove. We have 6 x 6 porcelain tiles that I want set on a diagonal on the floor with 2 x 2 squares intermixed. Same 6 x 6 tiles I want installed offset in a brickwork pattern to the ceiling in the alcove which is 32 x 60 x 84. I have 1/2 x 12 pencil liner that will outline 2 rows of 2 x 2 on top and bottom for a border design. I want a 30 x 12 niche for my 3 kids shower supplies.

Here's my quotes which I had him breakdown for me:

$1130.00 for the alcove which includes new hardibacker, the niche, waterproofing the niche with what looks like a product called maplastic, install studs to receive slider doors, tile, grout and caulk. My issues here are 1)I think it's exorbitant, 2) I did say I would Kerdi myself, 3) we have shower doors so studs should already be in place, 4) I said I would grout myself but wanted Schulter products for the corners and where the tub meets tile so no caulk is involved.

$680.00 for the tile floor which includes screwing down plywood floor, applying thinset for ditra, applying ditra, install tile to floor. My issues here 1) I already have the Ditra supplies in my basement so 650.00 seems like a huge expense when I've already tiled a similar space in a more elaborate pattern in my powder room, 2) I said I would lay the Ditra since I am familiar with it, 3) I will uninstall and reinstall the toilet - in the powder room my 8 year old assisted me so I know I can do this easily.

80.00 install vanity. Issue? holy cow my 12 year old and I did the vanity in our powder room and even cut holes in the back to accept the plumbing; it was not rocket science or hard physical labor. This vanity is furniture style as well so this means unpacking it from it's box and carrying it up to the bathroom, setting in place. The counter will be measured, cut and installed by a local company.

100.00 plumbing for the vanity/sink. Issue? The countertop will be a granite remnant and that installer puts in the sink as part of the install. The faucet installation I can do myself having done a few so far.

50.00 to hang the medicine cabinet. This could be worth it as it is a 3 piece medicine cabinet and I read the installation can take 2 - 3 hours.

60.00 install glass tracking enclosure. I don't get this. Isn't this part of the shower door assembly? I have to ask on this one.

If we replace the tub, he wants an additional 300 - 400 and we'd have to supply the plumbing. At this point, I don't think we will be replacing the tub. It's a 24 yr old cast iron without chips in decent condition; unless something happens to it during demo, it should be fine to keep. My only desire for replacing it is to have a deeper base to overflow depth and I don't think that is reason enough to replace it.

This quote runs 3K and does not include plumbing for the new bath fixtures. I think it's too high, but want opinions. Drives me nuts that I can do this with my kids for nothing but I have never cut tile; that is hubby's job and he can't be around to do it.

Thanks for opinions!

Sandy

Comments (9)

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Similar situation recently; I learned to cut tile myself! It's not difficult..no more so than actually laying the tile, which is the part I normally do while my husband cuts. I learned that while he always got messy, it's not really the hard part!

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    What you should try to figure out is what a typical hourly rate is for the contractors who would be doing these aspects of the job in your location.

    In my experience when I try to figure out what I pay plumbers and electricians hourly for the quotes that I get for time and materials jobs (which yours is, basically, since they are performing certain tasks, not the whole thing) here is how it has worked out in my area.

    Electricians bill out at between $75 and $100/hr
    Plumbers bill out at between $75 and $100/hr

    My GC bills out at $70/hr per person onsite. I have used one of their contractors who moonlights, he bills out at $30/hr. My assumption is they are paying him less than $30 an hour and the other $40+ goes to the company.

    My painter bills out at $33/hr per person onsite.

    I have not used a tilesetter at my own place but designed a job that the tilesetter billed out $1500 for a 3 wall tub surround with two corner surface mounted shelves. If was less than a 2 day install and he had a helper the first day and was alone the second. So that probably worked out to $60-70/hr all told. (The tile which was the very basic white 4x4 Daltile was included in this cost.) It was straightforward as tile jobs go, and the homeowner is happy. I would say its...adequate.

    So, that is the hourly breakdown for Time and Materials in my location (Phila metro) which is about 25% or more higher than national average. A full on bath reno from start to finish here tops $20K, anything the least bit fancy or master bathlike approaches $40K.

    You may be able to makes some hourly comparisons from this.

    You are also probably paying a bit more for certain aspects since you are parceling it out as small jobs rather than having the whole thing done by someone.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Get more quotes and then compare. The guy/girl has to make a living too and while it seems expensive to you, he's probably cutting you some sort of deal since he's a friend. Keep in mind he has to pay all sorts of stuff that business owners need to pay (equipment, insurance etc...). Based on what you wrote above about the medecine cabinet charge of $50 sounding reasonable for 2 or 3 hours of work, I would assume that you're comfortable paying $20 to $25 per hour for his services. Anyways, get a few more quotes and let us know what you find.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think labor quotes always sound high to DIY-ers. I know they do to me. Which is why we DIY. :-)

    I'd encourage you, if you've got the time, to just do it yourself. It sounds like the only thing you're nervous about is cutting the tile, and that surprises me, given everything else you've done. It's really not that hard. Spend an hour with some scrap tile and your hubby looking on, and you'll feel completely comfortable.

    Here are my thoughts on the math, based on my tiling speed, which I'm sure is slower than the pros. As a point of reference, I tiled a bathroom floor slightly larger than yours in about 8 hours, including Ditra, tile, and grout (no new subfloor). It wasn't the pattern you're doing, but it was a pattern so required some thinking. At the $680 cost, that would be $85/hour. Looking at it differently, that's $19/square foot, which seems REALLY pricey (as does the $85/hr).

    In the same bathroom, I tiled a 3x4 shower with 4x4s and 6x6s in a pattern, and the whole shabang, from hardibacker to redguard to tile & grout took about 20 hours. Plugging that in to your bid, it would be $65/hour. Or $18/sq foot if I'm interpreting your measurements correctly. Vertical tiling should cost more, but $18 still seems high.

    We also retiled our foyer and asked Bill Vincent what he would have charged for it, and the number worked out to $50 per hour of our time.

    Enough of my blathering. Get over your scaredeycatness of tile saws and just do it yourself. :-)

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think the price is reasonable, I'm in CT as well. You have 6" tiles, a couple of tile patterns, one on a diagonal, an inset border around the walls, a niche, etc.

    It's part labor, part materials, and realize it's not all going into his pocket. If he's licensed and insured, generally we look at charging $1.70 to make a buck, with the other 70 cents going to overhead. The buck that's left over? Then we pay taxes on that buck.

    From your description you certainly have DIY skills, if you're able in all the other areas why not learn to cut tile and install a vanity to save yourself the $3k?

    Mongo

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    My suggestion would be to get a couple of other wuotes, if you feel the one you have is too high. Personally, though, I agree with Mongo. It sounds okay to me.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    That's what I wanted - just an idea that it is fair. I had told him going in that what I was really looking for was a substitute husband to work with me through the job since he can't be there. I really did not want to pay 3000 for the labor of this. It is not materials, I have the materials other than the hardibacker and maplastic that he would use, I was going to purchase Kerdi for the tub/shower combo, so this is mainly labor. I understand that time is money and as a DIYer I have no clue what folks charge to do this stuff which is why I posted here. Seems high to me but I don't do it for a living. And I guess he, as a contractor, doesn't want my help, he wants to do things himself.

    Why would studs need to be installed to receive glass doors if I already have glass doors in the current setup?

    As far as the medicine cabinet, it's the only thing I felt I got a 'deal' on with him being a friend because I did read that the install was 2 - 3 hours and I did tell him that.

    I think weedyacres has the best advice so far. :) I may just go buy myself a tad more tile and cross my fingers. I can use a chop saw and did to cut and install floor moulding and crown moulding, so maybe I'll just bite the bullet and do this. At least I have no one to blame but myself if it doesn't work out.

    Anyone have any idea on this maplastic stuff? Should I go the Kerdi route or Redguard?

    Thank you again....

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Kerdi, hands down.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Cutting tile with a wet saw is pretty easy. The big thing to be careful of is not putting any undue pressure on the tile, vertical or lateral, as the cut reaches completion. If you do you can get a little breakoff right at the end of the cut.

    The unwanted pressure can come from your fingers, from the saw blade not being parallel with the saw fence or sliding able, or from a wobbling blade.

    A good place to start is with tiles where the cut edge will be hidden...floor tiles for example, where the edge will be covered by baseboard.

    But honestly, basic cuts are easy, and you sound capable.

    After not linking to this for what seems like a year, I feel like I've dredged it up a dozen times over the last couple of days, but here's a link to a Kerdi shower I posted a while ago.

    Mongo