The perfect build followed by the punch list from h**l
I'm in a quandry, mostly about how to handle things from here with my contractor. I know what I need to do, it's how to actually go about doing it that I've been agonizing over for the past month.
Compared to so many of the nightmares I'd read about on here for the past three years, my build went perfectly. I'd been preparing for this for two years, and by the time my GC put together his contract, I had stacks of photos to show him how I was going to want things done. He took everything with him, and it stayed in a folder on the job so it could be consulted as needed. His crew was here every time I came up. The site, and afterwards the house itself, were kept immaculate. His crew were kind, courteous and friendly to me. I walked the job with the plumber and the electrician, pointing out where switches and plugs were going, making sure they knew about about details like the air switch for the disposal, the in-deck soap dispensers everywhere, RO filters under three of the sinks, my vintage light fixtures, just everything I could think of. Everyone nodded, took notes, and to me, everything was perfect.
At least, for the first 12 months. Little things started coming up in August, a month before the house was to be finished. The electricians were grumbling about my wall sconces. Somehow the outlets in the walls were too large, and the carpenters were having to make wood plaques to go behind the sconces in order to cover up the holes. They put a switch in the wall for the disposal, and everyone (plumbers and electricians alike) were completely mystified by what to do with the air switch I had already bought. The plumber said it was impossible to connect my kitchen RO filter to the fridge for filtered ice. And after telling my GC for six months that my dishdrawers needed to be installed differently from a regular dishwasher (thank heaven for this forum!), it took three installations of the durn thing (along with calls from my GC that it had to be defective) to get someone to bother reading the manual and getting it right.
But the house was turning out exactly as I had hoped. After all my agonizing over paints, tile, flooring, granite and everything else, everything was coming together better than I could ever have hoped. The you-know-what didn't hit the fan until after I moved in.
I need to say now that I had a fixed price contract. It had the standard wording about requiring change orders in writing in advance, and stipulated a contractor overhead/profit of 18% (where I live the norm is 20 - 25%). We had a written agreement, however, that he would only receive 10% up front, with the remaining 8% due after completion.
The first set of problems all involved the plumber. I moved in on a Friday, and by Monday three sink drains and two of the RO filters were leaking water all over my nice new cabinets. Two sinks wouldn't drain at all. GC and plumber alike blamed the RO filters, which they said couldn't be hooked up securely so as to avoid leaks. It took a little more than two weeks to get everything working correctly, and my GC told me he had let me move in before he had a chance to check all the plumbing to make sure it was working. Meanwhile, somebody said something about how everything had been installed, they just hadn't finished tightening it all up.
Meanwhile, one of the soap dispensers and one faucet had been installed so far back from the sink that they were unusable. My contractor shook his head, and said he'd pay for me to buy a new faucet with a longer neck, and a soap dispenser with a longer reach.
Other than that, the punch list seemed so minor I counted myself lucky. My GC sent his guys out immediately to take care of everything.
We had to wait for the county to issue the actual CO (I moved in after the final inspection had been done, but it takes our local government three weeks to issue the piece of paper itself) to go into my lender for the final draw. There were still funds left in my contingency fund so I asked my GC to fax over his change orders I'd signed (which I couldn't find because they were still apparently packed), and pulled together the receipts for all the things I'd paid for myself. I knew I had signed change orders for about $41k in additional items, all of which I'd paid him for up front.
The actual stack of change orders I got totaled almost $100k. While many of them had dates from last March and April, I'd never seen them before. They included things like an extra $2500 for the septic system, $6000 for the electricians, $23k for finish carpentry and, my favorite (not), almost $6k for the punch list! On top of all this, the builder overhead/profit added on to every one of them was either 20 or 25%, not the 18% called for in my contract.
Meanwhile, simply from living in the house I was discovering things I hadn't noticed before. When I couldn't fit my daughter's birthday cake in the fridge, I discovered they had installed it so the doors couldn't open any more than 90 degrees. When I couldn't fit my lateral file into the closet I had specifically designed for it, I discovered all the bi-fold closet doors I had spec'ed out in my drawings had been converted to sliders. I had OK'ed one closet door change, and somehow never focused on the fact they'd changed all of them, even going so far as to buy the appropriate hardware for the bi-folds. The tile work in the master bath looked so nice, I had never bothered to view it from the perspective of inside the toilet area. That's when it became obvious the corner tiles were off by a quarter inch, and the huge grout line so quickly attracted our local red dirt that I couldn't help but notice the poor mitering job.
That was about the same time I realized that all my nice white grout was already staining in the master bath and my daughter's ADA shower room. My GC promised to send a cleaning crew out to clean and seal it again (which still hasn't happened).
I didn't discover that the plumber hadn't hooked up my steam shower correctly until I had been in the house five weeks, and the shower door finally was installed. The steam head was upside down, and my nice thermostatic grohe shower valve allowed me to scald myself as much as I wanted but couldn't put out cold water. This time around, I insisted my GC pull in another plumber, and that we make sure that everything else had been installed correctly.
About this time I happened to read on the bathroom forum about how changes in plane for tile needed to be caulked, not grouted. Curious, I went through the house. Not only did I find no caulk (even in my steam shower!), I found cracking grout in every room that contained tile. It took three weeks to finally get my contractor out here with the tile guy, at which point the tile guy announced he would just "prime the grout" and add some caulk where it had already cracked. My GC assured me that I had a year warranty on the house, and whenever any more grout cracked they'd be out in a flash to fix it. Caulk, he told me, was ugly and just could never look as nice as grout. It's taken two subsequent conversations with my GC for him to admit that there's no such thing as priming grout, but it's only after he snapped at me about how I needed to stop reading things on the internet. I'm still waiting for all this to get fixed.
Then came the wonderful call from the county building division that about two-thirds of my $35k photovoltaic array had been built inside the flood setback on my lot. I knew we had been waiting for the permit for the foundation, which was the main reason I hadn't been pushing the financial issues. For that matter, my GC hadn't been pushing them either. My GC's first reaction was it was an inspector that was being too picky. His second reaction was that I never needed to disclose it, and could pretend not to know. When I finally got him to go down to the county, the inspector actually had him fake a new drawing of the array, showing it outside the flood setback, in order to continue with the approval process.
As of yesterday, a permit based on the phony drawing was issued. Next week my GC is supposed to take the permit to the electric company so they can finally, two and a half months after I've moved in, get my net metering system installed.
It's time now for me to deal with all the financial issues. I know I need to write my GC a letter, but writing it without any of my frustration coming through is a challenge. This is a small community, and I had heard from my GC continually about how the clients he built for before me had jerked him around and refused to pay for $50k in change orders. The idea that he could start talking about me like this is unpleasant, to say the least. Interestingly, I have a completely new perspective on it now that I too have been hit with all these previously unknown change orders.
I know he doesn't have a legal leg to stand on to require me to pay any of the change orders I never signed. Somehow, I actually feel kind of sorry for him over that, which isn't helping my general outlook towards writing this letter. On the other hand, I really do NOT appreciate the way he's handled all of the issues with the tile guy, making every excuse under the moon and trying to intimidate me into backing off on the caulk vs. grout issue. Then there's a few other comments he's made to me: When I mentioned my ventahood was making rubbing noises when it was installed, it is obviously a manufacturing default. I still don't know if there's anything different about installing one of these as opposed to a regular vent hood, but I do know they had never heard of the brand before. As to why my gas fireplace (a Lennox, another brand he'd never installed before) barely puts out a four inch flame, he's told me that altering the gas pressure in order for the flame to appear correctly would create a dangerous situation and disburse soot throughout the house (there's a glass front on it!). It's been more than a few weeks now since I've had the growing feeling that all the lines about a woman not knowing anything about construction and believing anything she's told are coming true, something I never ever felt during the construction itself.
Please help me figure out how to deal with communicating the real issues, without letting my frustration and growing anger get in the way! I don't know if I'm just too close to it right now to see my way clear, or too conflicted, or what, I just know I can't see my way through what now seems to me like a morass of tangled issues related to finances, quality of construction, and emotional frustration over the way I feel I'm being treated now.
Sorry this is so long!
Summer
Comments (16)
18 years agolast modified: 10 years agoYou are having a "Seven Rol-Aids Day". I have no advice.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
I don't have any helpful advise except to say that you're right to be frustrated and angry. I think you should just write the letter (a rough draft, at least) and not worry about these feelings "getting in the way". Then, maybe you could post some or all of the letter and get feedback on which parts, if any, need tweaking.
I'm really sorry you're going through all of this. It's so frustrating to have to rely on someone else to do something right when it's so important to you. And from what you said about him talking about previous clients not paying for change orders, it sounds like he has a history of these types of problems. He should have learned a lesson from that client and make sure everything was signed. That's on him, not you. Don't feel bad about not paying.
Good luck!
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Summer,
Sit back and relax.
Take out all of your contracts, transactions and any documentation you may have to support your "case" wrt the 100K bill you just received.
Next, begin putting all of the cold hard facts in order. Begin first with a charge (part of the 100K), try to catagorize these charges, plumbing, elect, etc. Next, put the facts supporting your claim next to it. Try and remember dates, and specific facts. Names are good.
Once every charge is accounted for, take pictures and more pictures, date and file them according to trade, etc.
All of this is tedious to say the least, I have been thru this with my framer.
Come up with a bottom line on how much you are willing to pay, ie, half, or 1/3, etc to "make it go away" and keep that in your focus during your discussions with your GC. You will pay some, it's just a matter of how much.
Another thing to note - did all of the workers file a mechanics lein preliminary notice and then release of preliminary notice once their work was complete? Did you track any of these, if any?
Always try to handle this situation w/the GC face to face, with a document as described above. You will not come out of this w/out paying some, it's just a matter of how much.
I am sorry to tell you that.
Our framer slapped a 30K overages charge on us with some of the same issues you have discribed above. I did what I mentioned to you and ended up paying him 7K.
Remember, when they do pay, have them sign in writing that all lein releases are cleared once the check clears.
Hope this helps. Relax, and choose your battles wisely, it's the war you want to win :) labradoodlelady
Original Author18 years agolast modified: 10 years agovfish, thank you so much for your detailed reply. I've actually already pulled out all of the paperwork I can find, and the $100k in change orders is itemized. The $6k from the electricians I was able to document by going through the photos I had taken at the time - it appears I am being charged for the installation of every light fixture in the house. It makes no sense, as I have the electricians bid, and obviously installation was part of it.
Items like $23k for additional finish carpentry my GC is blaming on the fact that my built-up moldings and trims were more detailed than he imagined. The problem is I had actually already bought most of the trim myself before we signed the contract, and had shown him tons of photos of what I wanted. He kept telling me he didn't want me to give him that paperwork (I actually had photos of each piece of molding I had bought and the quantity), he had allowed more than enough in the budget. I really do feel that if he hadn't blown me off (at least that's how I feel), he couldn't be saying now he didn't know.
My lender required the mechanics lien releases prior to each disbursement, and before converting my loan to perm financing. That part should be OK.
He's told me that there are overages that he absorbed himself -- something in the framing, and an extra $20k bill from the painter (who also said he didn't know about all the molding). And some of the change orders are for legit items -- the AC and the intercom system. But I've already paid him for those.
I suppose I should mention that I might be a little extra sensitive to the issue of being told stupid explanations under the assumption that I'm a woman and won't know any better. One of my first experiences with a GC here was a guy trying to tell me that mold and mildew couldn't grow inside my walls (pipes upstairs had broken and flooded the whole house) because it was dark in there. I've already gone to the bathroom forum with the priming the grout issue, and bill v and mongo both verified it ain't possible. I resent that I had to argue the issue with my GC before he finally gave in and admitted I was right.
bungeeii, I am so sorry it was so long. I couldn't believe it until I had written it. :) Thank you for going all the way through it. Keeping my patience is going to be difficult, I know.
A friend of mine who is a realtor (and who is overseeing my GC's current job for previous clients of hers) has offered to be in on the face to face meeting. Do you think it's a good idea? I know it will put him on the defensive immediately. But my friend has already told me that if he doesn't do right by me, she's going to warn the current clients, who right now have been giving him a pretty loose hand with their money (they're building for cash).
arghhhhhh!!!
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
I personally know a couple realtors, a couple builders and a couple of lawyers. Of those 6 people that come to mind, I would feel comfortable with bringing only 2 of them. (A lawyer and a builder.)
I think the quality they both possess that appeals to me is that they have the demeanor and qualifications necessary to serve as an arbitrator. The other 4 would either lack the expertise or seem more of a possible irritant.
You probably don't want to appear confrontational. If you bring someone to watch your back, they should understand the legalities involved as well as clearly possess expertise in building homes.
This is just my opinion, though. I have no expertise or experience in working through the situation you're in.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Summer~
I'm sorry you are going thru all of this stress when you were just hoping to move in and "be done".
I don't have any advice, just wanted to share that I feel for you. I hope you get this all resolved to your satisfaction, and don't develop too many gray hairs over it. :o~
Let us know how it all works out.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
I think that one thing you need to do is discuss the whole situation with a really good construction attorney. You don't have to let your builder know you've hired a lawyer or anything, but I think you need to understand exactly where you stand given your specific contract, signed change orders, and the new unsigned change orders. And I think a lawyer should read through any letter before you send it, just to make sure you're not accidentally obligating yourself to something that wouldn't otherwise be your responsibility.
I wouldn't worry about the builder talking about you in an unflattering way. It sounds like he's pulled this same "pay me an extra 50k" stunt at the end of other jobs, so frankly his credibility isn't very good.
If you haven't closed yet, I think you should also consider delaying closing until at least the larger problems (plumbing etc) are fixed, and holding back money to cover the rest. I also would worry about the photovoltaic array being left in the flood setback area - maybe it's no big deal, but it just seems like something that might come back to bite you when you go to sell the house.
I actually like the idea of bringing your realtor friend along. It would be a good reminder to him that his actions will affect how other clients and potential clients view him, without you having to spell it out quite so bluntly.
It sounds like you've been on top of the details during your build, and that will be a big asset to you now. Keep your head in any phone calls or meetings, and don't feel obligated to agree to anything on the spot. And hang in there!
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Meeting with a construction attorney is a good suggestion, and one that I wish we'd taken on our previous build. I'm stunned at the length of time that your build has taken and yet there are still so many issues. Please squelch any sympathy you may still feel for your GC and be prepared for some tough negotiating. Document everything, as I'm sure you already intend to do, and don't let him wear you down. I hope you reach a good resolution before too long.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Sorry you are going through this. I just wanted to mention the gas fireplace and that you should get some advice from a pro rather than take your builders advise. The flame concern could be due to improper gas line sizing and could be a possible safety hazard.
In our area, you can schedule a visit from the local gas company who does inspections free of charge for all gas appliances, furnaces, water heaters,etc. You might try them first before going to an hvac outfit, but get someone who knows gas.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
So sorry for this hassle. I don't have any advice except to echo that hiring a building expert sounds logical. It would be wise to have a 'third party' just as witness.
Our GC is frequently employed by attorneys as an expert witness, testifying in court on builing issues that have come to trial. (You don't want to have to take it that far!)
Perhaps you need to remind yourself that this was not 'the perfect build'. These are not typical 'punch list' problems, but errors in the construction of the house. You just didn't recognize them until now.
Recently a lady in London posted about planning to build on Maui before moving to the island, something I strongly discouraged. Her argument was that the very nice architect they were using lived near the building site and said he would supervise the build. It's been my experience that many people in Hawaii are inclined to be overly polite. There is a hesitation to flat out say, I can't do that," or "I won't do that." In this weird way extending "Aloha" can turn out badly -- when promises made with seeming sincerity aren't kept in the long run.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Consider hiring a licensed home inspector or someone like that to go through your house and independently document ALL the goof-ups. You may want to bring this person to the meeting with you and your builder to back up your side of things. There may be other more insidious faults in your home that may not make themselves immediately apparent but could be costly in the long run. Proper flashing and waterproofing comes to mind. You don't want to hand over any more money until you are sure everything is done right.
Get some legal advise, too. Can't hurt.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
That is ridiculous! Step back a minute and try to look at this as an outsider: your GC is a crook. His behavior is criminal. No matter that a lot of contractors try it.
Best help you can get when you're involved with someone committing a civil crime is to get an attorney's advice. I can't urge you too strongly to have an attorney help you write any letters to your GC.
The LAST thing on your mind should be your GC badmouthing you. He should be laying low and hoping he doesn't end up paying YOU.
Okay, and he's not only a crook, he's also incompetent and a bad businessman. Don't enable him.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Hi,
You have one trup card. You owe them some money. So until you are happy, do not pay.
The other thing is. It looks like you have moved in. So that means you have a certificate of occupancy O.K. In which case you are laughing.
What the contractor can do is to put a lien on your property. However you can contest that, just make sure you are ready with all the documents and your side of the story.
When he tries to put the lien on contest it.I think you are in a pretty good position. You have not paid them and you have moved in, and the town is O.K. with you moving in.
best, Mike.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Your problems brought home to me in spades why we decided against building again. (We decided we liked our present home too much to go through all that again, even tho' we aren't able to get rid of our mortgage by staying put.)
I wonder if all contractors have some gene that allows them to come up with ridiculous excuses (lies) for why things aren't done the way they should be. I thought I'd heard them all on our build, but you came up with some new ones.
Don't roll over. And, in a meeting with him, bring a tape recorder (if you don't bring someone else) and ask if you can record everything so that there will be no question in remembering what was discussed and agreed to. If he won't agree, then take copious notes (that would be a good thing for your "witness" to do).
You are in the driver's seat, so to speak, if you still owe him lots of money. Don't feel sorry for him (our contractor told us he had never been so insulted in his life when we told him we didn't want to pay him what the contract said we could withhold until the punch list was satisfied). Too bad if he feels bad.
- 18 years agolast modified: 10 years ago
Oy. I feel for you. We just moved in as well and have 'discovered' that all our low volt wiring has been done incorrectly. Fortunately, or unfortunately, I was the GC of the build, so we only have to deal directly with the company we sub'd out to.
I wish I had some advice for you; here's to good vibes sent your direction...
bungeeii