Quite a bit of information to digest, but I'll give you some points of my non-professional advice.

Since you would be 'building' a new system, a room by room manual J is absolutely essential. Once having established the heat loss/gain figures, a Manual D study should be conducted in order to design a proper duct system.

This is especially critical, since the house is already constructed, no doubt many compromises will have to be made (location and routing of ductwork). Considering the size of the home, a zoned system or 2 heating plants should be considered.

While I can appreciate your concern about the costs involved, and the desire to achieve maximum rebates, you don't want to be stuck with a system that will not give you the comfort you're looking for, for the next 15 to 20 years.

May I assume that electric is your only heating option? Would you mind stating your general location (nearest city)?

V

My 18 year old lennox split system is dying (handler probably needs replacement) Due to the expiring Tax credit -and energy efficiancy FPL I am looking to replace our system this month.

I will be pricing with three different companies.
I live 3 miles west of coast (high humidity in SE florida)
Old 1956 CBS 2 story (2nd added 35 years ago-prbably duct system added then as well)Total SQ ft 2045 -Upstairs always 10-15 degress hotter! 2 UV lights added /retrofitted to handler 7 years ago.

Budget 6 K

Everyones pushing Trane-what about Lennox?
Should I continue with split system (handler on 2nd floor) Compressor on slab outside.

suzanne

the story above from OP is a good example of why not to purchase HVAC through big box store.

now to suzanne. this is a straight AC system or HP? what size are you replacing? the difference in floor temp is normally an indication of poor ductwork design/sizing. Now is the time to ask dealer for recommendations to improve this comfort issue. You might look at your attic insulation for improvements as well.

and yes, I do think Trane/AmStd hold up better in harsh coastal environments.

your home is on slab or has crawlspace?

IMO

Hi V,

Thanks for your response. I live in Eugene, OR - fairly mild climate here. Never at extremes of the winter or summer for more than a week or two generally.

Currently, the "system" in our house is only electric. We have 2 pellet stoves, that heat the main area of the house, (we do not intend on removing them) and a gas fireplace insert, but they of course do not circulate air like they need to, to get to bedrooms, etc.

We're on a VERY strict budget doing this, and if it were not for the expiring rebates, I would not be trying to push this process through before end of year. Although we technically purchase through Costco - they use a local Oregon company that been in business for many years, before being in Costco - so it's not really Costco doing any of the decision making. That's why I've gotten an email into their corporate office to check on the rebates, etc. I just feel like the estimator is being quite pushy currently to get us to sign, and while I feel like our best deal is going to end up coming from this company (who I don't doubt will do a good install), I'm just a leery on the high pressure sales technique and the fact that I've had to correct his suggested equipment several times now.

They were supposed to send out the installer this AM to start measurements, etc - I sent an email last night saying we needed to hold off a day or two as we still had questions and were not nailed down on some of the equipment (filter system, air handler, etc, not the HP itself), and he has already left a message this am saying that they need to come out and do it as he "committed" to an extra savings that was good only on last Friday (he took $600 off the price and said it was a "manager's special, and since we verbally committed, we would get the additional $ off). I'm not really that gullible, and I realize he's using this as a high pressure technique to get us to sign the paperwork.

I'm going to be putting a few calls in this am to their headquarters and see if I can't get some general information over the phone on the Costco pricing without this particular estimator involved - I just feel like he's jacking the prices up on us - for what reason, I'm not sure.

But back to the calcs - is it common for a company to charge to do this? What is the manual D calc? I know about manual J - not familiar with the other.

I know if we had gone through the program with our local utility company, the require that the contractors do those calcs - and the consumer doesn't pay for it. Unfortunately with some of their additional requirements, the rebate you get is far less than the actual cost of doing the program, so we opted not to.

Also - about the system price - as it stands now, is it looking fair for the Xp17 and the CBX40UVH and ductwork, etc?

Thanks again for your help - I hope by the time I'm done reading and researching I'll feel a little more confident in my decision making on this!

@tigerdunes

Thanks for your response.

Its a Lennox 4 ton with upstairs Air handler/HP and yes we are on a Slab. (South Fl is pretty much all slabs)

My air people who have kept the Lennox alive these past 7 years suggested a XL15i Trane (up to 16 SEER) to comply with the FPL (florida power and light rebate)

I will speak with them today concerning the flow through upstairs ducts and perhaps an attic fan, attic access in in upstairs hallway or more insulation? House is a "cape code" with steep pitched roof and gable facing south.

Thanks again
suzanne

Sounds very expensive. What ductwork are you getting? If your just hooking up the new airhandler to the ducts where the old one is, thats not much ductwork.

I know 5-tons and xp17 is an expensive system but $15K? Thats crazy.

Get some phone quotes.

Heatpumps are great for your climate.

Neohioheatpump -
Thanks for your response.

I'm not sure what kind of ducting, other than a completely new, retrofitted duct system for the heat pump system (5 ton), that is mastic sealed.

THe problem I'm faced with is that I have to have all new ductwork put in, so getting just a quote for the lennox system itself is tricky. I've had three HVAC companies come out, and all were in the 15K range for the work and the heat pump system. After rebates, it's looking better, but I'm getting the feeling that even with the ductwork needing to be fabricated and installed that possibly folks on this board think that it's still too high.

Not sure where to go from here as we've gotten quotes from three of the main / quality contractors available. There are many smaller co's but I don't know that I would trust them to retrofit a system to our home - it's not the easiest of jobs due to the strange 1950's architecture of the home. We're going to be running ducting through several closets to achieve ductwork supply to the whole home.

When I call for quotes - can I just ask for a quote over the phone for the system that I am looking at?

Neo-
Just realized that you may not have seen that there are sort of two topics running in here.. someone else posted a question about their home system as well. For me, we installing brand new ductwork, and a completely new system. Currently, we only have baseboard heat, and pellets stoves!

Thanks!

gotcha. Sorry about that.

Not a problem - I just appreciate the insight and help.

With that in mind (all new ductwork being retrofitted to a home that will require lots of ductwork through closets, etc - with the XP17 and CBX32MV air handler) does the amount $15k before rebates sound crazy? After all rebates are taken into account, our net amount is around $12000 - does this seem reasonable? We're just about at the point of signing a contract, so I just want to make sure we're not totally in outer space with pricing!

Also - I've seen several people make mention about "evap coils" and those factoring into rebates. I know nothing about this, and wonder if that's something I need to check on? We've been given no numbers/options on those - is that ok?

Many thanks again, for your help. Stacy

I've never priced ductowork before so don't know going rate. It sounds like you are getting some considerable work so its probably not crazy overpriced

Just verify with the installer that evap coil has the txv valve. That makes it more efficient. As long as its the matching evap coil you will be fine. A heatpump that efficient will last a plenty long time and be very efficient.

Is the XP17 single stage? I recommend single stage not 2 stage. 2 stage's are more for air conditioned driven climates with lots of humidity.

Whats your electric rate by the way?

Its 36 degrees fahrenheit last night where I live so my heatpump is running a good amount. Keeps the house toasty and warm.

Hi Neo,
I guess that's where we run into a problem - we're just not sure if we're paying a fair amount for the labor/material for the ductwork, but it seems like we'll just have to go on instinct on this one.

The installer from Costco won't give us the cost of just the Lennox equipment, so we don't have that number as well =(

I will definitely verify about the evap coil and the valv - good to know!

The XP17 is a single stage - initially we looked at a 2 stage, but we didn't see the need for it, so decided on the XP17.

Here's the electric rates for our area:

Basic charge $7.00 per month
Delivery charge 2.887 cents per kWh

Energy charge, Winter (November through April billing cycles)
First 800 kWh 4.356 cents per kWh
Next 2,200 kWh 6.001 cents per kWh
Over 3,000 kWh 7.220 cents per kWh

Energy charge, Summer (May through October billing cycles)
First 800 kWh 4.356 cents per kWh
Next 900 kWh 6.001 cents per kWh
Over 1,700 kWh 7.220 cents per kWh

Given that we rarely go below freezing for sustained periods - I think a heat pump is perfect for our climate too (nor do we get heat extremes). Also, since we have NO heat at night typically (we turn the pellet stoves off), I think we'll be happy with even a cool 62 in our house!

Thanks again for your help!

In case anyone cares at this point, Lennox pays the $1,000 in cash card, that is why you cannot double dip. Also, if that company is sending out a "tool" of a salesman/estimator, you should complain to corporate. We do all of Costco's work up here and have a wonderful relationship with them and their members.

Here is a link that might be useful: Barron Heating Green Team

I hope I am not too late to stop you from buying a Lennox. Lennox is junk. Two different dealers have been changing parts on my XP19 since 2009 without success. I am currently running emergency back up waiting for service call number twenty. (No exaggeration.) Unit is only four years old. Lennox corporate is no help, even though I obviously have a lemon. DO NOT BUY LENNOX! Here's a good link to a consumer rating website. Wish I had found it before my purchase.

Here is a link that might be useful: Homeowner reviews of Lennox. Scary stuff.