in our old kitchen we had a stand lone range (probably from 1980) that has NO cabinets around it at all and also no hood. We lived without a hood for 3 years here and the previous owner obviously lived that way since their kitchen was installed (the house is a 1928 bungalow so who knows when the kitchen was actually added).
Now the wall bhind the range, that was another story all together...it was disgusting and pretty much beyond cleaning. I mean I wipes it down as much as possible but still, it was pretty dirty.
We now have cabinets surrounding our range and have installed an OTR microwave with a pretty decent vent IMO.

So if you don't want to have a range hood or an OTR micro hood, what are you planning on putting over your range?

We are living in a temporary house during reno. It has no hood. My word it is horrible. Even just boiling pasta creates a big steam mess. I have to open a window almost. And forget about what happened when I fried oysters the other night!

I was starting to wonder the same thing as you until I moved in here. Venting is extremely important to the way I cook. BTW, I don't fry often, but I saute a lot.

Besides, we will not be able to pass inspection without venting. Take that into consideration also.

I agree - a vent hood takes up valuable space in a smallish kitchen that could otherwise have cabinets, and I also like to smell what I cook. :o)

I suppose it depends on what kind of cooking you do, but I can't imagine not having a vent over a range or cooktop. I very often have something on every burner and I rely on even my current piece-of-junk vent very heavily. I can't WAIT to have my new one installed and be able to stir-fry with abandon. ;o)

My friend just did a custom kitchen and installed a little shelf for her microwave above the range. I asked where the vent was and she said code didn't require one. I was shocked to learn that, but code or no code, I couldn't do the kind of cooking I do without one.

Although they're known to be less efficient, if you're wanting to avoid visual clutter above the range, you might consider a down-draft vent. Jenn-Air makes a slide-in range with this feature, or you can buy a separate telescoping one for use with other ranges/cooktops.

If you really don't think you need one and local code doesn't require it (and you're not concerned about it affecting resale), there's your answer. :o)

Craftlady, my point exactly. I believe that a lot of that yuck behind the range was likely due to the OVEN output then the stove top. Around my wall oven - damage. Around my island cooktop, clean around the counters and up above on the ceiling. I'm putting an electric slide-in range on the island not against a wall and w/o a vent.

Breezygirl. Perhaps we are just boring cooks but not a problem for us. In fact in our dry climate, the moisture is welcoming. All this fuss about steam, then why do people use humidifiers. Considering how many problems I hear about humidifiers and people getting sick on the bacteria that grows in those things, I'll gladly boil some pasta and have it fill the air with moisture and some safe byproducts. Most jurisdictions from my understanding (at least in our area) require venting only for gas stoves. What are you doing with all the steam and yuck that your OVEN gives off?

Well, I understand where you are coming from. I had an OTR microwave that supposedly self vented, although it didn't have filters, lol. We didn't have it long before the reno.

We struggled with the WHY do we need venitlation question. But in hindsight, I would never go back to having little or no ventilation. I see the smoke going up and out that vent when I cook. Cabinets in the area are not greasy, and no, I don't deep fry or stir fry. If I use a tsp of butter to saute something, I see it on the baffles.

My oven does vent, and sometimes depending on what exactly is going in that oven (a rotisserie chicken, for example) I will put on the vent hood too so it leaves the kitchen completely.

I have been looking at new homes online. I hate seeing the "gourmet" kitchens that don't have proper ventilation, but I just keep reminding myself, no matter what we end up with, I'm sure we will gut it and do our own thing.

Ventilation is not glamorous and it is expensive. It is sort of like the infrastructure stuff we talked about last week. It's the bones of the kitchen.

So, I am a total ventilation convert. Once you have good ventilation, you never go back!

Come look at my parents' house...the cabinet above the range, the wall next to the range, and the ceiling....all have a layer of "gunk"...combination of grease + dust. That's a killer combo! I will NEVER be w/o a rangehood!

Yes, I wish there was also a hood over my ovens, but just b/c I can't get one doesn't mean I don't also need it over the cooktop.

Oh, and the type of cooktop/range you have is not the sole determinant for sizing venting, it's also how you cook. If you fry/saute/brown/stir-fry, you will need something more powerful than if you just boil water, regardless of "fuel" type ("regular" electric, gas, induction).

Putting a cabinet over your range to "add cabinet" space...each range has specs that tell you how far away flammable surfaces have to be...and wood cabinets are flammable. I think most say 30" above the cooking surface, regardless of "fuel" type. That, btw, IS Code!

Besides, you can get a rangehood that mounts under a cabinet. You're not losing anything in cabinet space to a hood b/c the hood fits in the "empty" space b/w the hood and the cabinet above...that space that's empty b/c you can't have a flammable surface that close to the cooking surface.

I suppose if you don't cook it doesn't matter what you do. But if you do, do yourself a favor and get at least a basic rangehood.

One last thing, many people say they grew up w/o one and never saw a need (but, if you were a child, you probably never noticed or didn't know any better)....years and years ago, houses were not very well sealed so there was a much greater air exchange (and faster). With today's well-sealed houses, odors will linger far longer than they did when you were a child. I don't think it makes a difference with grease, though...it stays now & stayed then!

While we don't fry a whole lot, we do make a fair bit of steam (canning, pasta etc) and since putting on a metal roof this summer, which breathes much less than the old shingles, the moisture load in the house has become much more obvious. (Icicles inside the attic, and condensation all over). So a hood fan will be installed next week - we've never had one in the 6 years I've lived here.

It depends on so many factors - your cooking style, house structure, and local climate all play a part.

But how is everyone dealing with all the yuck from the wall ovens? I know for a fact a LOT more came out of my wall oven then anything I did on the stove top...is everyone ignoring those smells and yuck. I NEVER fry and occassionaly saute and brown...I'm not a gourmet cook.

Breezy girl wrote "I have to open a window almost". What is so bad about opening the window? It can't be any less efficient then sucking all the warm air out of your house with an overhead vent. I realize that so many kitchens don't have windows (our current kitchen doesn't but will), so this may be a reason for a vent I suppose.

When we were considering vents the salesperson admitted that most people install their vents quite a bit higher then the manufacturer recommends (sorry I don't remember the height). He said people put them higher since otherwise the vent is in eye view and actually obstructs one's view. Hence it voids some of the intent of the venting in the first place.

Code requires venting in a bathroom and private commode area because of the moisture but they don't require it over a stove?...what does that tell you? It tell me, the byproducts of cooking are not bad enough to necessitate a vent.

My intent of this thread to get answers to the why of venting and so far the only reason I can really see, is in a windowless kitchen. I'd rather invest in a new window, let the fresh air IN, and see nature outside.

I realize I am in the minority that disagree with a MUST HAVE VENTING here on GW, but NO ONE I know uses their vents in my little circle of life.

Well, I don't seem to generate that much from my ovens. I do wish, though, the ovens had a vent for the few occasions I do need a vent (like the self-clean mode).

Just b/c it's not available for ovens in this country, doesn't mean you don't need one over your cooktop. These are two different appliances.

Sorry, but the thought that "since they don't make vents for wall ovens, that must mean you don't need them for cooktops" makes no sense! You're not comparing apples-to-apples, instead you're comparing apples-to-bananas.

And, just b/c Code doesn't require it in YOUR municipality doesn't mean it's (1) not required elsewhere and (2) not needed. Every year it seems, new items are added to the Code. Does this mean these items weren't needed before? Doubtful. I think it's more a matter of realizing that these things are needed...maybe as a result of seeing the byproducts/aftereffects of not having them...so they get added.

There are some things that seem like "common sense" and so they shouldn't need to be "forced" on people b/c, well, it's common sense to do it/have it. But, as we all know, common sense is not a universal trait. So we have rules & regulations. (Yes, there are other reasons for the various Rules & Regs, but this is one of those reasons, IMO.)

As to the window, you lose a lot more conditioned air from an open window than a rangehood...at least we do! Do you really want to leave your window open for an hour or so while prepping & cooking (and later waiting for everything to dissipate) in the middle of winter? I know that when the smoke from our fireplace backs up, it takes forever for the smoke to dissipate even with the sliding door and garage doors open...and boy does it get cold in the FR and kitchen then! We've actually found that our rangehood helps get rid of it faster!

Besides, opening a window eventually (and it's not quick) gets rid of most of the smoke & odors, but does absolutely nothing for grease!

[Personally, I think the fan/vent Code in bathrooms was an attempt at "odor control"...moisture removal was an afterthought!]

I have avoided this thread so far. I simply can't imagine what on earth you are baking in your oven aloha. I have baked steadily and beautifully for 40 years. I have never had stained ruined cabs in the kitchen NEAR AN OVEN. I have had odors from chicken and roasts , the rest has been breads both yeast and quick, baked lasagna and casseroles and baked pizzas ( made from scratch) meatloaf, baked fish, pies and cakes...truly I can't think what you are baking !

My Miele double ovens have cream cabs above and below them . I have used my ovens very thoroughly for 5 years and the cabs look as pristine now as they did when installed. I have wiped them down a few times a year and that is all. Only finger marks and dust.

The cooktop we have now is a 36" gas Caldera . We have 1400 cfm over it and we USE it every single time we turn on a burner. I clean the baffles every single Sunday. They NEED it. We stir fry and deep fry and saute and boil and sear. Our hood is beautiful and mounted at 33 " above the cooktop. It works and it serves a purpose. In every single one of my past residences I had poor ventilation over the cooktop. I had grease on my cabs and walls that had to be cleaned off 2x a year with dilute ammonia water. I cringe when I think what was on my furniture and walls.

You may like the stale odor of cooked food and the residual cooking grease that was on your walls and furniture that noone seems to be able to have perceived. None of the rest of us in the real world of cooking do. We are grateful to be able to purchase more than adequate ventilation to prevent the inevitable damage to paint and finishes and respiratory health of our families.

To each his own. You are already dead set in your thinking. Good...go on and do as you have already said you are going to do. Enjoy. You won't convince anyone on this forum who really cooks that you are right. c

I think it all depends on your cooking and your climate. If you don't generate much smoke, grease, or odor, and/or if you can leave windows and doors open, then perhaps you don't need an exhaust hood. I spent most of my life in California, and didn't have or miss a hood in most of my kitchens. Then I started doing a lot more cooking and moved to cold rainy Portland. Things changed.

I am with you Aloha.

Buehl,
I truly, absolutely, unequivocally, do not need a vent over my cooktop. I HAVE a perfectly adequate vented outside vent over my cooktop, and have never used it. NEVER. If I needed a vent, I would remove the plastic bags and flip the switch. And the old, top of line vent would kick in and do well.

Our vent is stuffed with plastic bags to keep the warmed air in and the seeping cold outside air out. I don't fry. Rarely brown. Grease of any kind, evoo, butter, is an enemy, and is 'stopped at the threshhold'. Onions are sweated, not oiled. Garlic is added later. Does food taste better when it is crusty and laden with oils and fats, probably, maybe, or not, but, some folks get older and develop 'no fat' criteria. Tastes change, esp., after your arteries clog, or you worry about clogging.

Tonite, I broiled some 93% hamburger in the broiler, in foil, and blotted with paper towels. The oven inside got a little dirtier, but it was contained.

I suppose it is obvious that Aloha and I don't cook like most of the gw community does, and steamed vegetables and steamed food tastes better to us, for me, with a bottled sauce for flavor. I don't get a kick out of using 24 ingredients to make 4 T of exotic sauce, when I can buy a bottle of something and doctor it up. It's just fine, as long as it's reasonably healthy and doesn't mess up the kitchen and leave fat smears all over the cabs.

When I broil, and I trim the proteins well, often the fat sprays the surrounding area. I use the oven broiler to broil. Altho, in the last year, I have used the cooktop to do what is called 'pan broiling', and it is usually a thinner cut of food.

Summary, Never had a need for a vent over a cooktop and most often had a real need for a grease dissipator over the oven broiler. Baking in the ovens, whether meatloaves or breads, just did not require any outside help! Westsider

If you live(d) in an older house with shoddy insulation, air leaks around the windows and sill plates, and no extra ventilation, air exchanges occur(d) with great frequency. Of course, this wastes tons of energy by paying to heat/cool the city instead of your home, but many of us know that because we grew up/lived in houses like that. Ducting was unheard of - just one big wall or floor heater. No vent hoods over stoves.

However, modern building science and the very real need to conserve energy indicates that houses are tighter - better sealed; therefore ventilation (or better ventilation) is necessary. Check out the Building Science website about this topic. And the point here is that what we did in houses in the past was not efficient, but it's what was known and what was done. Yet advances in building sciences allow for more efficiency in our homes as it modern advances can positively impact other areas of our lives.

Just as your oven's greese and smoke ruined your cupboards, so can greese and smoke ruin finishes in other parts of the kitchen. I personally am not a fan of wall ovens because they aren't vented. Think about the inside of a dirty wall oven - ewww - and then residue that escapes - double ewww.

Maybe the issue is that wall ovens should be vented, but we've not yet reached that advancement yet, so it's not required. If you Google "venting a wall oven" and there are 360,000 results about this topic from self-venting wall ovens, kits, and diy projects. From what I can see, wall oven venting is highly recommended for the same reasons that cooktop and range venting is recommended, and for the very reasons you point out in you initial post.

If you need venting for your wall oven more than you do for your range top, then perhaps that where you should vent; however, perhaps you can consider venting both appliances.

You quoted me about opening a window. Buehl basically answered for me. It's cold here. I am cold all the time anyway. I have a baby who doesn't need to have cold air coming through the window as she is suffering from a nasty cold.

I've seen steam from pasta leave residue on the walls and upper cabs.

A window takes hours to clear out smoke or bad smells.

I don't fry often. I saute fresh, organic vegetables in olive oil (which is a healthy fat as long as you don't guzzle it like wine) a couple of times a week in addition to all the veggie steaming I do.

In my old kitchen, I used to turn on the hood when poaching chicken or fish. You know, healthy stuff. Still creates moisture.

I do get a kick out of using 24 ingredients to make a sauce. Why? Because I enjoy the creative process, the thrill of taking raw food and creating something completely different. And because I KNOW what is in it--no trans fats, no artificial sweeteners, no preservatives, no artificial color. That is stuff I don't enjoy eating.

My oven is part of the range. When my lasagna bubbled over and burned a bit last month during a party, I wish I had a hood to help clear out the smoke and burned odor. But again, I don't have one in this temporary house.

That's why I (underlined) need a hood.

If you don't put in a vent, make sure that your local zoning codes and any HOA or condo rules permit that, and that it won't void your cooktop's warranty, and that your insurance company allows it.

Also be aware that I, as a potential buyer, would probably never buy a house with an island stovetop with no ventilation, due to the extreme difficulty of installing one without taking the kitchen down to the studs and re-routing the plumbing, electrical work, and probably the supporting beams.

I've already said my peace about this. Nothing else to add, except I finally figured out who really doesn't need to have a vent hood. The people who are on those "raw food diets". I assume they don't use the range at all. I don't know anything about that diet, I should be clear.

In a previous thread on this subject people went to great lengths to explain why a vent is needed. A majority felt it was necessary.

If you don't want to spend the money or don't want to have that much construction, or just don't like the idea then don't install a vent.

What I don't get is why there's yet another thread on this subject and why you're trying to dismiss something established that kitchens need. You can live without one. But it's better to have it.

None of us will live in your house. There won't be a visit from the GW vent police. Knowledgeable people who have been through this are simply trying to help you.

As for the ovens, back in the early 80s I had an amazing pair of Thermador ovens that actually did vent outside. You make a good point about that and I wish that particular feature for ovens would return. I miss it. My cabinets haven't discolored but the oven smells linger. To help with that, I run my stove vent.

Since I have parked my tent over here on this forum I've noted venting is a subject like removing shoes, and silk plants. People are adamant on why they do or why they don't.

Variables such as climate, house type, cooking style, fuel type, and personal choice all come into play. Neither is right or wrong if your circumstances support it.

Why I don't use my hood more than 4 times a year:

My house is huge and old. I would have to devote a year out of my life to seal up all the air leaks in this monster. I already keep a spare can of the spray foam stuff around for new finds and I've been here 10 years!

As often was the norm back then, my kitchen is in the back of my house, separated from the main living area. I can't even get heat to go around the corner much less have smells permeate the house. Actually by the time I get a whiff of anything, it means whatever it is is done!

We live in the Adirondacks. 9 months of the year we live on soups, stews, casseroles, and good ole meat and potatoes. The best is when you can throw leftovers on the woodstove to re-heat during power outages.

Once you can stand outside without icicles hanging off your nose, we grill anything and everything! It's almost a compulsion to NOT cook inside.

I am convinced I have noise sensitivity. The hood irritates me, jars my nerves, raises my hackles, puts me on edge-hate it.

I DO use the hood on hot humid 90+ days for pasta and accidents caused by others in the kitchen...DH thinks medium high is the ONLY setting for everything!

Cooking is not my passion. I am a good cook and I cook mainly from scratch, but you'll never find me in the kitchen humming and whistling. Of course when my kitchen is re-modeled I am hopeful. =)

OH!-We did use our vent this fall when smoke from someone's chimney down the hill from us got sucked into our open basement window and filled the house with smoke. That was a weird one time fluke though. =D

IF I lived in a new airtight house, in a warmer climate, with the kitchen central to my living area, GOOD fresh produce closer than an hour away, and a desire to be healthier, I probably WOULD use my hood more.

I just wanted to chime back in and say that I can guarentee that the grime on my walls around my ventless stove was absolutely not caused by anything coming out of the oven. It was all from the cooktop.

We had wall ovens in the house we rented before we bought this house and I do not remember the surrounding cabinets ever needing to be wiped down or washed for anything other then fingerprints and dust.

I have to "ditto" trailrunner and ask what you are possibly baking in your oven that creates such a mess.

And even if you don't think you need one for the cooktop because of what you're cooking (which I totally undersand) I often turned mine on at the old house if nothing else just to get the steam out of my face. If I could open a window (I live in PA, it gets rather cold here in the winter so the windows stay closed at least 5 months out of the year) it still didn't pull steam away face so I could see what I was doing. A window just isn't as effective as a vent for clearing steam IMO.

Venting IS required by national building codes. It's just that an operable kitchen window is considered acceptable for that ventilation. And, local regulations can and do override national codes, so it can be confusing. However, the trend is more towards tightened compliance with national codes rather than the local hodge podge of non enforced regulations. If you wish your home to comply with the latest home safety codes, then planning for proper ventilation is a MUST during construction. Homes that do not have proper ventilation have much higher incidences of mold and moisture damage, as well as much poorer indoor air quality.

The purpose of kitchen ventilation isn't all about smoke removal or grease containment, although those are the primary reasons for it's existance. Besides the production of smoke, which I don't think anyone would consider desirable, cooking produces HOGS (Heat, Odors, Grease, and Steam). None of those cooking byproducts are a desirable addition to your indoor air for multiple reasons.

Heat, especially in the summer cooling season, adds to your energy use by creating more work for your AC to cool. It makes it uncomfortable for the cook to stand at the stove in the warmer months as well. It creates convective air currents that carry odors and oils throughout the home.

Odors should be self explanatory, but since many people say they like the scent of their cooking, we'll explore that as well. I don't think anyone finds it objectional to smell morning coffee brewing, and bacon cooking. However, those odor molecules that smell so pleasantly at breakfast time aren't welcome smells at dinner that night. Or the next day. And the odors can quickly become rancid smelling if not "aired out". Think of cabbage cooking or fish broiling, and the odor molecules traveling into your drapery material or couch fibers. Just because you don't smell it doesn't mean other people won't. We habituate to our own home's distinct scent and don't smell it. That's why animal hoarderss who live in filthy conditions don't understand when rescuers come in and have to take fresh air breaks. They don't smell what their home smells like. They're used to it. You're used to what your home smells like too, whether that's good or not so good.

Grease is often another subject where lifestyle seems to be a player. However, just because you don't saute onions in butter or olive oil, and never fry anything doesn't mean that cooking oils are non existant in your diet. Even steaming or boiling veggies releases plant oils into the atmosphere. (Where do you think vegetable oil comes from?) Without ventilation, those veggie oil molecules float on air currents and end up on your hard and soft surfaces. Oils attract dirt, and when the two combine, they become even more difficult to clean. Even if you are a vegetarian and only steam your meals, you're still dealing with a certain amount of "grease" in your environment. Where that grease ends up in your home is entirely due to ventilation or the lack thereof.

Steam is another item removed by proper ventilation. Many people say that they like the extra moisture during the dry winter months so don't understand why steam is an issue. Well, even in older less air tight homes, there's "good" steam, and "bad" steam. If the steam is produced in enough quantity to be able to condense, then you've got a problem. Moisture is the enemy of any home. That's one of the primary functions of a shelter: to keep moisture away from us. Moisture rots and decays and functions as an environment for mold and mildew, which add to health problems. Steam also carries the odor and grease molecules throughout the home. Cooking moisture isn't "good" clean odor and grease free moisture, even in winter. In summer humidity, it can add to the AC's burden and make for some miserable meal preparation. If you're in one of today's much tighter homes, then containing moisture within the walls should be avoided at all costs. If you'll read on the Flooring forum here, there've been many tales of wood floors buckling even in winter's dryer climate. That's just one of the effects of too much moisture in a home. There are plenty of others--and none of them good. Any new home construction should take into account the overall tightness of the envelope and the elimination/introduction of moisture as a priority.

And, finally, there's the resale issue. I can understand walking into a 1950's home without kitchen ventilation, but if I walked into a 2000's home without kitchen ventilation, I'd really have to wonder about what other infrastructure issues were being shorted or neglected. It's a red flag about the quality and maintainence of the home. It'd be like walking into a home with nothing but bath tubs in the baths. Yes, that was standard in 1910, but certainly NOT in 2010, and it would be extremely non functional and odd. If I were considering such a home, I'd have to reduce any offer on it by several thousand dollars to be able to bring it up to minimum standards of proper external kitchen ventilation.

live_wire_oak essentially said everything...! well said.

I am in the pro-ventilation camp. I would LOVE ventilation above my double ovens. This is my first house with double ovens, and I didn't think about the ventilation issue or know to expect it. I might not have purchased them if I had known, honestly. It grosses me out thinking about the food odors that comes out of them when the door is open, my smoke alarm goes off when the self-clean is running, etc.

"We habituate to our own home's distinct scent and don't smell it." This is true. The OP might like to live with their food smell/stink, but I HATE it. The lingering smell of garlic, onions, bacon, whatever... is nasty to me. If the smell is allowed to spread throughout the house (instead of being vented out,) I can imagine that funk slowly accumulating in carpets/couches over time. I absolutely would not buy a house that had smells in it from cooking, pets, whatever.

Of course, you can do whatever you want in your own home. I think ventilation is important for your guests, though.......Two examples:

1) I have allergies, so my sinuses are a bit more sensitive to strange odors (it's a super power.) It's very noticeable when people have smells in their homes, and it literally gives me sinus pain!

2) My husband gets headaches from the smell of vinegar. Last night I made a balsamic vinegar reduction on the cooktop. The vent is the reason he never had a clue what I was cooking and why I am still married today! ;)

Last comment,...... It is 5 degrees fahrenheit outside. I'm not opening the window!!!! When we use kitchen cleaners or items that aren't particularly healthy to breathe in, I turn on the stove top vent and it helps a lot!

"Come look at my parents' house...the cabinet above the range, the wall next to the range, and the ceiling....all have a layer of "gunk"...combination of grease + dust. That's a killer combo! I will NEVER be w/o a rangehood! "

Are you our long lost 3rd sibling?? If you did it first, you didn't do a very good job. If you did it after us, we didn't do a very good job.

I use my vent every time I turn anything on on the stove including the oven. And I often use it with the toaster oven across the room. ALWAYS with the pizza cooker thing and the crock pot plugged in beside the stove. I live in an old, old house. Air replacemnt happens all day and all night! I don't fry anything but I do simmer stuff and I do bake almost everything. I don't like to clean. It's easy to put the vent thingies in the dishwasher.

I think most of us are in some agreement that ovens spew out waste too. I understand the comments which basically gets down to 2 wrongs don't make a right. In previous threads, Buehl has made it crystal clear that she does not believe in having a cooktop over an island due in part to the extra cost of venting and safety. I agree that if one has their cooktop and oven over BOTH these appliances, more of the grease and moisture will be removed then w/o any venting.

But...since we know that newer homes are very air tight these days, how can the venting work as well as it is suppose to? Simple physics come into play. If air is being sucked out of an airtight home, the efficiency of the suction will be diminished in a very short time. I know evaporative coolers (which work in the opposite direction pushing air into an airtight home), need windows ajar a few inches in each room to get the draw for the appliance to work properly. In simple terms, if you take a straw and put your finger on the end, you will quickly expire all the air out of the straw and if you continue to suck the straw will collapse and shortly no air will come out. A house obviously is a lot larger then a straw but so is a vent stronger then your suction, but at some point (fairly quickly) the vent needs continued new air. If your house is too airtight, the vent ceases to work as well as it was intended. So Neverending, your house would be more uncomfortably cold, but your vent would work great on your house. But anyone with a new house, if you really want your vent to work properly, open a kitchen or nearby window 1-2" while your vent is on.

Trailblazer, I am not going to entertain your statement of whether I like stale cooking odors more then I just have. I do enjoy the smell of a roasting turkey, a pot of stew, warm cookies, fresh bread etc.

To avoid more DANGEROUS pollutents then grease from food, I hope those of you that vent have a no shoe policy in your home. Wearing shoes brings not only grit, dirt, grease but harmful chemicals from your lawn and streets. Should I mention the grossness of desinigrated feces that is all over. Considering how few people have a "no shoe policy" in their home (I have when the grandbaby was crawling - and should really go back to it myself), but how can you spend the $1000's on "proper" venting but let those dangerous contaniments in your home (especially when it's a free fix).

I looked and looked for an organization that would not be profited by encouraging the use of vents. I am VERY open to reading any article that doesn't directly/indirectly profit from warranting the usefulness of vents. I believe so many things we purchase are influenced not by need but scare tactics.

I put one in during my remodel and don't regret it -- but, where I live 95% of houses (even high end ones) have over the range microwaves.

I do use my vent most of the time but I think anyone is trying to fool you if you think it will remove all cooking odors.

I crank my Zephyr up to high before of turn on the stove and cook bacon -- you can still tell I cooked bacon if you walk into my house. My hood has to be efficient too -- it vents right out the back of the house (no turns or long lengths).

So, my point is, they have limitations. The biggest limitation is if you don't turn it on -- it won't work! Most people get annoyed by the noise and tend not to use them, especially for long cooking times.

As much as like mine, I don't know anyone who would refuse to by a house because there was no fancy vented hood over the stove.

The issue of makeup air is really coming to the forefront for the physics reasons you just mentioned. My municipality requires a MUA (makeup air) system for any house with a vent hood drawing more than 400cfm. I believe this is becoming the standard in most parts of the country. Simply opening a window isn't acceptable for meeting building code.

We are a strictly no shoe house.

My old kitchen had a wimpy downdraft that quit working years before we remodeled. I really hated washing cabinets, wall and ceilings of the grease that kept acculmulating around the gas cooktop and gas ovens ( which vented into the room). The room would fill with smoke and fumes if ever something was burned or DH decided to cook cajun. We had to open windows and doors and even though it is So. Cal. sometimes it is cold.

I would never consider not having a vent and would never go with a downdraft again.

I have noticed that in going to electric oven, the grease is not an issue. I do use the cooktop vent religiously and even when something has dripped or burned in the oven, on goes the vent and quickly clears the room! I love the vent.

Oh yes, there clearly must be a connection between people who feel kitchen hoods are useful and those who let "desinigrated feces" into their homes. And surely that is part of a vast conspiracy by VAH industry to take over our thinking. Light must be cast on such scary issues.

We use olive oil for most things, and need to wash teh vent hood filters about every other month.

They collect enough oil it runs down into the small tray they sit in and needs to be cleaned up also.

Without the hood running that oil would be allover the kitchen and the house.

aloha2009 - you've made the decision not to get a vent and came here for sympathy and validation and when you didn't get it, you turned petulant and accused people of dragging feces into their house - how silly. Floors can be cleaned as well as greasy, dirty walls and cabinets :-) The only valid issue you did raise is that of make-up air which is a real consideration.

LOL! I warned that this is one of those sizzling, heated, may need a vent topics!

Even though I don't use my hood often, I do believe every kitchen should have proper venting in place. Kinda like if you don't cook, you should still have a stove, maybe not a commercial range, but something in case you want to pop in a frozen pizza or two! =D

Though this thread seemed heated at times, I think many of the pros and cons have been addressed. A debate doesn't have to be personal, just different point of views and experiences highlighted.

I have learned, that it depends on where you live (temperatures, humidity) on how necessary a vent would be.

I learned that it has to do with the way one cooks.

I have learned, that I likely have never experienced what a decent vent can do (only had above range vent, microwave vent, or downdraft).

I have learned that some countries do require venting for the oven along with the stove (seems strange to me to ignore one grease maker and not another).

I have learned that some areas are requiring MUA.

For those of you didn't already know...

I hope you learned on your new construction to consider installing an MUA if you want to vent properly.

I hope you learned that those that do not have an MUA, opening the window 1-2" (even in the winter) is necessary for proper functioning of your vent.

I hope that those that are truly wanting their homes to be clean (especially from the dangerous things outside), will have a no shoe policy. (Isnt' having your house clean and fresh the reasoning behind the venting)

For myself, I am going to check further into the Jenn-Aire slide-in down drafts. Though they aren't in the league of other models (from my understanding on GW), perhaps having nothing isn't wise. I will also invest in a splatter screen for when I'm browning, etc. Doing nothing is naive on my part. In my remodel I could move the range to an exterior wall, but to do that I would have to give up the 6' window, views and continual fresh air that is just a window away. Trade-offs.

I am going to return to a no shoe policy. Since we planned to redo all the flooring, I didn't care much about the flooring in this "new" house. But reminding myself of why just a year ago (old house) why we had a no shoe policy wasn't just to keep the damage to the floors down, but also because of the contaminents brought in.

Hopefully I will not be banned from GW for my opposition. I like it that others are passionate in their beliefs and are not shy about vocalizing it. For anyone to get a full picture of the pros and cons, both sides of an issue need to be examined.

I also do not need a vent above my stove, when I had one in my previous house I never had to use it, it was wasted space. In fact I can't remember EVER having to use one.

Maybe I just don't cook food that requires it. All my cabinets and walls next to the range have been fine.

Having said that, I will be buying a vent for my current range, only because that wall looks totally unfinished without one, and when I sell the house future buyers may wonder why there's no vent.

So there's some money down the drain for something I won't use just to make things pretty and not make buyer's think "wait a minute..."

If I could get away with not having one and saving the money, I would.

/eyeroll

Fori, be careful they'll get stuck like that....then what!

"I hope you learned on your new construction to consider installing an MUA if you want to vent properly. "

LOL, does the fact that I live with 2 DS and 1 DH who constantly leave the kitchen door open to the backyard count as MUA??

Ovens cook, and an amount of steam, smoke and other things is produced. It is contradictory that you need a vent for a stove top (and range) but that this is not extended to include a wall oven. It is true that cooktops make more steam and smoke.
pots boil = steam
pans fry = grease
(grease specks are so small they float up and remain suspended)
if things are normal, not an accident, this is all in the normal course of things.

Vents are good for removing this.

But nobody is selling any kind of oven vent.

My $.02 - prior to our renovation my son's room regularly smelled like dinner in the evenings.

We had a Jenn Air down draft.

We now have a Modern Aire hood and dinner hasn't made it upstairs ever.

We have a vent because we need one.

"I hope you learned that those that do not have an MUA, opening the window 1-2" (even in the winter) is necessary for proper functioning of your vent."

Or an old enough house that is not well sealed.

A one to two inch window gap, in concert with normal house leakage, may be sufficient MUA for hoods operating in the few-hundred cfm region. Potential backdrafting of furnaces and gas water heaters would still be a concern and should be checked for, as backdrafting is hazardous.

For the larger flow rates needed for cooking over woks, grilling and other tasks justifying semi-pro ranges, a significantly larger window opening would be needed to keep the house pressure from falling too much relative to the outside. Low pressure not only risks backdrafting, but also cuts the actual flow achieved by the venting system. The presence of a screen on the window would be a factor in how large an opening would be sufficient.

This is why, for the larger flow rate configurations, the MUA has to be forced. The MUA ducting would otherwise have to be very large (more than 2 x 2 feet, I would guess). The other reason is that one normally wants the MUA heated in winter unless living in a very temperate climate, and filtered always, and the heat exchanger and filter will cause a significant pressure drop by themselves.

As an aside, I hope none of the anti-vent partisans are operating gas cooking appliances. Gas appliances need venting to remove toxic combustion products.

kas

Often, I would prefer to eat the stunningly delicious food you guys make here. If Trailrunner invited me over for french fries or all the spectacular Chinese dumpling stuff, I would exercise portion control and dig in. MMMmm.
She built her fabulous kitchen with state of the art vents to clean the air and her house. That's what vents are for. Vents are desirable and necessary for most cooking. Opening a window, even a crack in winter, is good too, but not as a vent replacement.

I have different priorities. I'm not real lazy but I don't want to clean much. So I made the annual bacon, (turkey, yes with nitrates) for a blt sandwich. Bacon, on a paper plate, on a dinner plate, in the microwave, and with a microwave cover. It cooked. It crisped. Likely tastier if fried on the stovetop in the frying pan, but when put on toasted bread with tomatoes, lettuce, mayo, the difference was not earth shattering. It was still good.

I wiped the plate with a used paper napkin as I am anal about putting grease down the drain. Then in dw. No vent needed. That's just my lazy a**. This house now has a vent and will always have one.

I would prefer to eat your delicious food, sometimes, but not if I had to deal with grease.

P.S. And if you dont have a vent or an adequate vent, life goes on. Not a big deal in the grand scheme.

live_wire -- that was a consummate post -- thank you.

And thanks, Kas, for the reminder about gas by-products. And the potentially lethal danger from backdrafts. Perhaps we should all check upon installation of a new high-powered ventilation system, that our pilots in water heaters (including instant, I believe) and stoves don't go out (regardless of local codes).

Why is there so much acrimony about this subject (too much "venting" surrounding the issue -- we need a hood for the tone of these posts!)? Why is this seemingly so emotional? I'm guessing whenever we tacitly reference our childhood (or parents) our dander just goes up (as in - 'my mother lived in a house for 427 years with no MUA and lived to tell the tale...').

I cannot tell you how many times I have rued that gunk on the walls, ceilings, cabinets and said -- outloud no less with nary an explanation, ever -- "I wonder why there's all this gunk here -- where does it come from, what causes it??" I never made the connection with the volatiles from my cooking, or even the smells -- yummy though many of them may be. Much less with any potential danger. Heck, I even like the smell of paint and garages in some sense, but we've all learned by now to associate those with danger and we've come (many of us) to try to avoid them. There's a never-ending set of calculations we all make trading off risks in our lives every day ("should I cross that street or will I be hit by a bus"? Some of us actually stay in bed to avoid that particular risk, or so I understand; but we understand this is pathological).

Risk assessment is tricky, involving facts and emotion and complicated assessments. But it's not helped by acrimony. Thanks, all, for thoughtful thinking on the dilemma.

fori, I hope your eyes are ok! ;) (I've wondered many, many times what's a good emoticon for rolling eyes! (@@) perhaps? Buehl? (or one of you computer-uber-literates?)

Well, I'm a lurker here who has an almost finished kitchen. I really really wanted an outside overhead vent but it was outside of my budget. There were things I wanted out of this mini-remodel that took priority (can you say soapstone?) Anyway I had an OTR range that vented to the ceiling. Our ceiling was a mess, the insides of our can lights were a mess, the cabinets were a mess. We had to do SOMETHING, we were putting expensive beadboard up on the ceiling and I couldn't bear if it became greasy in two weeks. And we cook like the normal family, chili, soups, spaghetti but no frying. So we purchased a Jenn Air downdraft electric (couldn't do gas). We've had it about two months now and it works wonderfully for shallow pan cooking. But then it doesn't travel far to vent, and my hubby works in engineering and was very particular about getting the vent to work just right. It is better than the OTR micro, and tons better than nothing....

Well, I am one who has not been able to get on for days and missed all this fun. Trying another browser now. Anyway.....

I used to wonder why I would want to spend serious appliance money on a vent -- mainly because I'd never had one that worked well enough to make me think they were worth it. But I bought one that was well suited to my gas cooktop and it's close enough to my double ovens that it offers some assistance when running a cleaning cycle. I will never again question why I should spend as much on that appliance as the ones that are doing the cooking. Just my experiences -- with several recirculating, downdraft, minimal vents and a couple of homes that I don't think had any vents. No question what is better -- and I saute, but don't fry.

But, on the other hand, I'm still wondering about the oven that is spewing grease and fumes. I also have to wonder what you are cooking -- as well as when the last time you cleaned your oven was. If you are broiling a lot, you might find that cooking meat in a pan, on a griddle or grill pan or with a built-in grill on a cooktop, you could keep your oven cleaner and have the fumes under a good vet where they can be handled with greater efficiency and safety.