nhb22

Poured concrete overlay -stamped and stained

nhb22
April 11, 2012

We are getting ready to build a pergola and outdoor fireplace out back. The existing stained and scored patio has seen better days. Staining has flaked away and we have had to reseal three times in 5 years. We would like to do something over the existing pad, but not sure what. I was thinking stone pavers, while DH wants something less expensive, like a concrete overlay.

I searched on the stone forum and have no luck finding the answer to my question.

Has anyone had a concrete overlay - then stamped and stained, poured over an existing concrete patio. We went to see a new pour last night, and while it looks great right now, I wonder how it will do down the road. The poured layer is so thin that I cannot see it holding up without chipping away bit by bit.

I'll post photos later tonight to show you what we have and some mock-ups that I have done, plus some inspirational pics.

Comments (30)

  • cearbhaill (zone 6b Eastern Kentucky)

    If the old pad is prepped correctly and if holes are drilled in the old pad to connect the two slabs with rebar and if the new portion is thick enough and stabilized with wire mesh it will stand up well.
    If any of these steps are neglected the top will chip, crack, and shift.

  • chispa

    We are in the middle of a big outdoor project and went with concrete pavers. The major brands in my area are Belgard and Angelus. I went with Belgard as I liked the texture and colors of their pavers better. They have fireplace kits too. Nice thing with pavers is that you can always remove any damaged or stained pavers and replace with new ones.

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  • Letty Point

    I don't think you can lay pavers over an existing pad because it would not allow for drainage.

  • nhb22

    cearbhaill - That's just it with these overlays, they are more like a thin coating about 1/4" or less. No adhering with rebar, etc.

    chispa - I'd love to see photos. Yes, we have Belgard and general Shale. I like the Belgard better.

    lpoint - I am not sure I understand. There would still be drainage. A thin layer of sand would be put down over the existing slab. The water would seep under the pavers and on down to the existing pad, and then out. That's what the paver companies say.

    I am thinking that we may either have the existing pad redone - using acid stain this time, or use the pavers. As chispa says, the good thing about the pavers is that they can be replaced if needed.

    Well, been gone all day. I was out looking at pavers, fireplaces, etc. Then I spent an unexpected amount of time and money at the veterinarian with my dog. I will post some pics tomorrow.

    Anyone have the thin layer concrete overlay over an existing pad?

  • blubird

    I just happened to have picked up a Tech-Bloc catalog today and they have some blocks which are specifically to be used as a concrete overlay - the Blu 45 abs Venetian are the 2 styles.

    Helene

  • nhb22

    Thanks Helen, I am not familiar with that brand, but will do a Google.

  • kswl2

    Last year we were at the same point--- an existing patio with stain flaking off and looking terrible, trying to decide what to do with the concrete we had. We went with a 2" concrete overlay and exposed aggregate. Overall I am happy with it, it's a very natural look and goes well with our decks and paint colors. In the end, we decided against stamped concrete because I didn't want something that "looked just like" something else. I have seen gorgeous stamped concrete, but it just wasn't right for our country setting. Regardless of how long it lasts I don't think it works in all settings. From your choices, I would go with concrete pavers.

  • blubird

    Darn that auto-correction...the company name is Techo-Bloc and the concrete overlay styles are Blu 45 and Venetian...

    Helene

    I just happened to have picked up a Tech-Bloc catalog today and they have fsome blocks which are specifically to be used as a concrete overlay - the Blu 45 abs Venetian are the 2 styles.
    Helene

  • nhb22

    kswl - Not sure what "exposed aggregate" looks like. Do you have a photo?

    blubird - I found the site last night. I love the venetian. Just have to see if we can get it here.

    Y'all, I promise I will get some photos up. Spent some more unexpected time with my dog at the vet this morning, and had some cleaning up to do when i got home. A patio guy is on his way over, so i am in the process of gathering photos and making a list. I'll get back over here later this afternoon.

  • bbstx

    When we moved into our house 8 years ago, we had the patio tiled. It was tile specifically for outdoors. Off hand, I don't remember what the temperature range was, but your tile store can help you with it. The patio is partly under roof and partly under a pergola. We have had no problems with it.

    Our neighbors have the same set up but they used brick pavers and put theirs in a year before us. They, too, have not had any problems.

  • francypants

    We have stamped and stained but it's thicker and they started from scratch, no previous patio.

  • leafy02

    Previous homeowners had the long run of back steps and the pad at the bottom covered in stamped and stained. Not sure how long ago that was (we've been here 3.5 years) and it looks ratty. Faded, some flaking and chipping where DH put salt on it the first winter--before we knew that putting salt on it would crumble it right off.

    I curse it, but dread the cost of having the whole 13-step run replaced.

  • nhb22

    OK, met with the contractor. There would be a problem with using pavers. There is not much room between the level of our screened porch and the level of the existing patio to place the sand layer needed, and then the pavers, so that option is out. Therefore, we were presented with 4 choices.

    1. Fix crack on existing patio, acid stain and live with it as long as that finish will last. Do it again when needed.

    2. Tile over the existing surface. (I don't like this idea at all. I cannot imagine tile looking good outdoors, or holding up too well. Just me and my taste.)

    3. Concrete overlays. (OK, I am feeling a bit better about this product. The coating is not all concrete. It's an epoxy mix coating. I've linked to the site below. I will also post a couple of photos of the job we just saw.)

    4. Tear out existing patio and pour a new slab (stain or overlay), or place pavers down. This is out because DH does not want to have his lawn torn up anymore than it already will be. Plus, it's more costly.

    Now for some photos. I'll start with the patio and porch done with a concrete overlay. Remember that this IS NOT stamped concrete. The concrete pad was poured in February, and the textured and scored overlay was done last week.

    This textured patio coating is made in large scored squares
    {{gwi:1663238}}

    The adjacent porch is done in one solid textured coating. No scoring because they didn't want too much conflict with different shapes going on that porch. There is also a pergola overhead that throws off shadows. Same as we will have, so this solid coating is probably what we will do with the patio.
    {{gwi:1663239}}

    My screened porch - Interior looking out to patio. Notice the floor of screened porch. Good to great condition.

    My patio from yard - Notice the difference in the patio surface...cracking, peeling, discolored.
    {{gwi:1663242}}

    Another view of patio
    {{gwi:1663243}}

    More photos to come of what we plan to do outdoors.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Concrete overlay

  • nhb22

    caminnc - Thank you for that picture. Now I know what it is. Had that before. One eyes Jack that put it down just called it "decorating with pebbles." You can imagine what it looked like. We had patched of pebbles in one area, and none in another. Poor dear!

    bbstx - Show me your tile. I am intrigued, now. :)

    leafy02 - Yes, that's what our neighbors said about the salt. they had to have the end of their driveway redone because the city sprays a salt wash on the street and up into driveways. It has even eaten away the end of our concrete driveway.

    francypants - Yours, too!

  • kswl2

    That is exactly what our stained concrete patio looked like, new homebuilder. This is a picture of our exposed aggregate:

  • nhb22

    Oh gosh, just re-read my post about one eyed Jack. I sounded drunk in that post. hehehe

    kswl - Your patio and landscape are absolutely beautiful!

  • maire_cate

    newhome - I don't remember and I can't tell from your photos - but do you have a pool? Do you need to be concerned about a surface that might become slippery when wet? Many pool installers recommend the exposed aggregate around a pool because the texture provides better grip than smooth concrete but it's also rougher on bare feet.

    The textured patio in your photos is beautiful and the texture would help when it's wet.

  • tinam61

    We are entertaining the possibility of the overlay also NHB. Our concrete patio is just over 15 years old and we do have a crack. I think it's done pretty well for 15 years. Last year we had a small line cut out for better drainage off the patio (not sure if that could have something to do with the crack). One thing that can make a difference in your staining is was that regular concrete poured and THEN stained? Or was the concrete treated with coloring before being poured. From the contractors we have talked with, I believe that is how the overlay is done. The concrete (and expoxy) is treated with color before pouring.

    None of our sidewalks, front porch, etc. have cracked. Our concrete driveway, however, is having some cracking at the bottom - we are probably going to have a section cut out and a decorative brick pattern done there. Someone not far from us had the same problem and that is what they did - looks great!

    tina

  • susieq07

    This is a concrete/resin overlay on our driveway. It was expensive but we love it!


    close up;

    you choose your colors..our house is white trimmed in teal blue

  • kswl2

    Newhomebuilder, thank you for that kind comment!! Your choices for your house are always so considered and appropriate that a compliment from you means a lot.

  • nhb22

    You're welcome!

    maire_cate - No pool, but the existing patio does get slippery when wet, especially when I am in flip flops.

    tinam61 - Our patio was poured, and then it was suppose to be acid stained. Instead, they rolled some type of stain on top, and then sealed it. As I said, the inside has held up with two more applications of sealer in the last 5 years. The outside has actually been re-stained (after the first season and flaking began)and has been sealed 4 times.

    Yes, the overlay has color applied before the epoxy is poured.

    Are you thinking of having the lower driveway done with stamped concrete, or brick pavers? If you are in an area that gets lots of snow (and salt) I would not try the stamped concrete. My neighbor has has his torn up and redone, and still had it ruined over the winter with the salt trucks.

    susieq07 - I've seen your driveway before. You've had that quite a while. Has it held up well?

    Talked to DH today. We are going to wait for the estimates to come back on our project. If the numbers are within our budget, I think we are going to go ahead and either add to the existing pad before having a coating put on it, or tear the pad up and pour a larger pad. We could also do pavers instead of a concrete pad. Maybe the yard would not get as torn up if we are just taking out the old pad, and not having to have a new pad poured. Again, it all depends on the expense and our budget. I wish for a larger patio to be able to serve our needs.

    Here is the rest of what we are doing. Pergola will be attached to house. So instead of four columns, we will have two. This will improve our siteline from the house and screen porch.

    From backyard looking at patio and screened porch

    From backyard with pergola mock-up

    From backyard with pergola, grill enclosure and fireplace mock-up
    {{gwi:1663251}}

    Fireplace and/or pergola examples that I like.

    We are not sure whether to go with brick to match our house (if we can find it) and use stone accents like this. There would be seats on either side and the chimney will be higher to tie in with pergola.
    {{gwi:1663252}}

    I like this the best, but chimney would not be quite this tall because we will have gas. Take away the two columns, and scaled down a bit, plus add the seats.

    Original dream photo. I've hung onto this for a couple of years.

    Saw this at General Shale yesterday and was determined that this was it! Today, I am having second thoughts that it may be TOO formal. Plus, the white detailing may become a headache for cleaning. I think that I'd rather go with detailing like the following photo, whether used with stone or brick.
    {{gwi:1663258}}

    {{gwi:1663260}}

    Did I tell y'all that we will also be improving the looks of the screened porch post? Instead of the solid paint stain on rough treated post, and the vinyl cladding on the outside of the porch, we will have the post re-wrapped with a smooth paintable wood and then redo the screening and trim them out. Again, this is something with can put on the back burner if needed. After all, I just stained the post last summer.
    {{gwi:1663261}}

    Throw in some landscaping, lighting and furniture, we will be all done!

  • nhb22

    Contractor is coming tomorrow to go over his bid with us. We have no idea what we are looking at as far as cost, but he has made a big deal about the cost of the cedar for the pergola. Says he has some other ideas that would cost less. I've always thought that cedar was the best option when wanting to paint something. Opinions on materials would be helpful?

    I am also undecided about the finish for the outdoor fireplace. You have seen my mock-up with the stone. Here is one using our brick. Don't know why it turned out so small...sorry.

    If we went with brick, we could use some stone accents around the mouth of the fireplace. Something similar to the arch shown in the post above would look nice.

    We still do not know if we will be redoing the patio, or going with a totally new patio. I am afraid of having too many textures and colors with the porch/patio/fireplace, and why I am thinking that using our brick (if we can get it anymore) might look better.

    What do y'all think...brick to match the house or stone?

  • aktillery9

    All I have to say is WOW to all of your lovely outdoor spaces!!!!!

  • angiedfw

    I vote for stone rather than brick. I think brick would not give you the same feeling as your inspiration pic.

  • susieq07

    To new home builder; our driveway is done 6 yrs. now, after hurricane charley ruined our stained, stenciled job we did ourselves, see pic. our gar. is still nice done by us!: our entire driveway was like this floor before hurricane.


    We keep our driveway nice by cleaning with TSP and clear coating with H&C 23 every couple yrs. It cost us 6 grand, we want to keep it up!

  • nhb22

    WOW...what a neat garage.

    angiedfw - I'll keep that in mind, but my yard doesn't look anything like my inspirational photo, either. hahaha

  • susieq07

    You can't see much of gar. but I've got kit. cabs and counter tops too in gar... and a deep sink..
    Do you still build homes (new home builder) or just your own? this home and our last build was built by a lady builder, with lot's of input from us! to our specs...

  • nhb22

    No, lol. When I signed up for GW, we had just built a new home, hence the name. I am not a builder myself. :)

    aktillery - I didn't mean to ignore you earlier. I wish those were all my outdoor spaces. I am hoping to at least create one of those.

  • nhb22

    Any other opinions? I have an hour and a half to decide. :)

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