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annab6_gw

Layout again! Good enough or possible to make it better? (Long)

17 years ago

I've been going back and forth on the layout with our KD. She is very nice and knowledgable but we have definite limitations because the kitchen space is also a traffic path to the family room and has no windows. Finally I felt I had worn her out and this is as good as it will get.

KD is independent, next step is to work with cabinet shops so as long as we are not changing the walls we still have some room for improvement if we wanted to change something.

The good news I got many of the items from my wish list incorporated into the layout:

36" range or rangetop (still undesided about this), 27" wall oven (I wanted a smaller one and can go down to 24" if I want), a large sink, four seats at the island, room to put undercounter refrigerator drawers (will be either to the right of the range or in the island as marked), cutting board and tray storage (next to the range), appliance garage, broom storage (15" tall cabinet around the corner next to the appliance garage cabinet). Ignore the note "standard adj. shelving", we'll change them to pullouts. Also ignore the warming drawer, we'll get it only if we don't get the second oven.

Still, I have concerns about the efficiency of the work area, oven placement etc. I want to prep on the island and specified to leave 48" of countertop to the right of the sink for that. The idea was that others can still use the sink and dishwasher. The dishes will be stored between the fridge and the wall oven. But now the range and the oven cabinet are sort of in my "clean-up" area, I wonder whether we'll be bumping into each other all the time (which is exactly why we are expanding the kitchen in the first place).

I am also afraid that we have too much going on and it will look too crowded when built.

So I came up with a bunch of options which i am thinking about and would love to get input on. But first let me clarify the oven choices.

I think it will be great to have a 36" rangetop but not sure about the 36" oven, seems to big for our needs and definitely not something I would use daily. So I am open to switching the range to a rangetop. But a 30" oven would look too big in the corner so in that case i would have the oven undercounter in the island. The second oven has to be smaller and would be my day-to-day oven. I am also looking at the Miele speed oven which is both an oven and a microwave. In that case I would have the speed oven and a warming drawer and no additional 27" wall oven.

Now the options:

- Move the range 18" to the left. KD and DH don't like it because the hood would not be in the center.

- Get rid of the diagonal oven cabinet. Replace with the upper and lower on diagonal, put a m/w drawer in the lower cabinet. For the second oven, either have one undercounter in the island instead of the ref.drawers or have a small one (Miele speed oven will work) instead of the appliance garage.

- Get a rangetop and wide storage drawers below. 30" wall oven undercounter on the island

- Keep the oven cabinet but get rid of the hutch and move the refrigerator there to make it look more open

- unrelated to anything above, but make the island a bit longer and a bit narrower so we can still have the four chairs but leave more room for traffic on the seating side.

Do you guys think any of these ideas are worth considering and would be a definite improvement? Anything else I haven't thought of?

many thanks

annab6

Comments (9)

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I love the space you have! My only concern as a general observer is the corner oven. You are giving up at least 20" of storage space and counter space with a corner oven as opposed to having it along a wall. I would much prefer it to be next to the refrigerator or near the range, and have a diagonal corner cabinet with glass doors where the oven is. The oven, if placed near the fridge, would then only require 30 inches of space. An oven is also not one of the things that needs constant tending, so having it out of the general work area should not be an issue, especially since you will have a beautiful 36 inch range. BTW

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Ok, maybe reverse the location of the dishes and the appliance garage and mirror reverse the entire island.

    This way you can reach the storage of the dishes from the dishwasher, it puts the larger prep surface (currently to the left of the sink) near the ref and small appliances and it makes the sink and cooktop not so much butt-to-butt.

    Even better might be, as you said, to move the ref to the end near the stair door so the two smaller bits of counter formed a larger counter.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I also like the plan you have, but have some concerns about the corner ovens.

    Getting your oven situation right (that's right for YOU) is very important, so I'd analyze that systematically. Budget some time to write down the meals you've cooked for the last few weeks - everything you can remember. Then write down your oven options: Range + speed oven, range-top plus wall ovens, etc. -- whatever the possible combinations are. (Aren't there also 36" ranges with two ovens - one real small? Or maybe they're 48"?)

    Then simply match up your possible oven set-ups to your 'standard' meals to see which fits are best. Also be sure to consider 'toaster-oven-type' foods because, for most of us, they're a reality.

    On your dish-storage, I'd be inclined to keep that on the outer edges of your space rather than inside the work area proper - just for foot traffic.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Footballmom is right; putting an oven in the corner isn't the most efficient use of space. Mine is there, but I have a big kitchen, so it wasn't much of a sacrifice for me. To me, even with your oven in the corner, it still looks like you have plenty of storage and counter space. So it will come down to your personal preference. Let me know if you'd like pictures of my corner ovens.

    You'll probably want to stick with the rangetop b/c a range's oven door would conflict with the DW door across from it.

    We put our vertical (tray) storage in the top cabinet of our oven cabinet, and over our fridge. If you were to put tray storage over your oven, you'd regain that 12" next to the rangetop. To me, the space right next to the range is a prime storage area, so I'd prefer not to have tray storage there. Even if you use it for cutting boards, you'll use it once during a meal vs using utensil storage several times.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Thank you for your kind responses. I will adress in order.
    This is a great discussion and very very helpful

    1. Footballmom's suggestion to place the oven next to the fridge. Since we can't have the oven right after the diagonal cabinet, that means eliminating the hutch, moving the fridge there and putting the oven where the fridge currently is. I think it would look much better and the space utilization would also improve, but the oven would be around the corner and we would not have a landing area next to the fridge. So I am not sure about this one.

    2. bmorepanic's suggestion. I've been seriously thinking of this. What do you all think of moving the sink even further from the refrigerator? Ok or too far?

    Also, I would be fine with the dishes in that location (above the appliance garage) but it means the kids will also need to go there for a plate or a cup and then to the refrigerator and then probably to the microwave. So is it too much running around through the work area with food and dishes?

    3. Sweeby's suggestion to analyze the oven needs.
    Sweeby, this is my biggest issue. I've been analyzing this forever! In summary, I love to cook in the oven both for daily meals and entertaining. But only occasionally (may be six times a year) do we have a large party where the 36" oven would be really useful. For the other 359 days, I make smaller dishes for four to six that would fit in a 24" oven or even the Miele speed oven just fine. We have GE 30" range now and at times I skip the oven and make do with the stovetop just because it feels like an overkill to preheat the whole thing for something small. So it does really bother me to have the less frequently used big oven in the more convinient location then the more frequently used small oven. Unfortunately, DH wants to have the microwave close to the refrigerator and doesn't want it undercounter and this requirement is seriously "in the way".

    5. Alku, I have seen pictures of your kitchen, it is beautiful. But I definitely don't want a 30" corner oven, I think it is way too much for our space. This is why we have a smaller one there and I am even thinking of reducing that to just a speed oven (which is the size of the advantium) and a warming drawer if we keep the corner location. If we go with a rangetop, the only other place for a larger oven is in the island. What does everyone think of that location for an oven? I would be standing in front of it all the time, would that be a problem?

    As far as the cutting board storage, I had to have it there. The location above the oven is too high up for me and for DDs. I currently have my cutting boards on the counter exactly because of this problem and hate the look of them stacked up there. But thanks anyway

    Again, thanks for all your suggestions, please keep them comming

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I just started this thread yesterday and it is already on page 5! Looks like a very productive couple of days on this forum :)

    So bumping my questions with hope to get more opinions. Have to start talking to cabinet people next week

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    another bump

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I think you are not getting more responses, because some of the greatest layout minds on this forum have already weighed in and covered the bases! :-) I was going to post the day you started this, but read their comments and saw everything I thought had already been said. Best wishes. It seems you are getting close to finalizing things.

  • 17 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Thanks rhome, I was thinking it was either that or my last post didn't make any sense :-)

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