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caribbeancupcake

Electrical wiring nightmare please advise

18 years ago

We are at the stage of installing the ceiling fans in our newly constructed poured concrete house.Today we started to install the kitchen ceiling fan only to find that the same wire feeds the outdoor dining room chandelier. Without a separate circuit I can't have the chandelier off and the kitchen ceiling fan or fan light on. The ceilings are exposed beam with a hip roof.The dining chandelier is supposed to be on a dimmer and completely separate circuit.

We fired the electrician months ago when we found out he did all our rough in work without pulling a permit. I will be taking him to small claims court after we get our CO.

Other than running exposed wiring a few questions;

Is there anyway to rewire the chandelier on the fixture to turn it on and off? I realize I can turn the fan on and off at the fixture but if the fan is off the chandelier won't work.The one big disadvantage of a concrete house is trying to figure out were all the wires go after the fact.We have a new permit and new electrician who has been okay with us doing the fan and fixture installation. At $80 dollars an hour and having already paid the electrician we had to fire.Our new electrician has been trying to cut us a break letting us do the basic jobs.

Comments (9)

  • 18 years ago

    Hi,

    I think your best bet is to put in the extra wire if you can. Maybe you electrician can advise you how.

    I appreciate that poured concrete is difficult to push wires through etc, but if it is an ICF (Insulated Concrete Forms) house, would it not be possible to put the wiring into the polystyrene insulation? Then up across your hip roof to the fan. Would not the sheet rock in your final ceiling hid the wires?

    Failing all of these things you could do for something like
    http://www.apartmenttherapy.com/ny/best-products/best-products-radio-shack-wireless-light-switch-001290

    Which is a wireless remote switch for the fan. This is however I feel a bit messy, may have reliability issues and may not be to code. There are other switches out there from Ace hardware as well which are wireless

    best, Mike.

  • 18 years ago

    If pulling more wire is a problem, Smarthome (among some others) sells a number of devices that allow control of multiple devices over a single circuit. Buy a wall mounted remote control for the fan (there is another part that installs at the fan). This allows the fan circuit to remain hot while allowing full control of the lights and fan separately. The controls for other lights on the same circuit as the fan will work just fine and allow dimming.

    Give them a call and tell them what you want to do and they can recommend the devices you need. The fan remotes are available at the local big boxes.

    These is the issue of finding a box to install the wall controls in if they haven't been already.

  • 18 years ago

    I had a very similar situation to yours where I wanted to replace two outdoor patio lights with fans/lights. I wanted separate light and fan control...and the fans needed to be able to retain lo/med/hi speeds and the lights needed to dim. Unfortunately, I had no room to be able to add the necessary wiring and switches. So what I did was use the existing wiring and a pair of wireless switches/receivers that I picked up at Lowe's. I installed a receiver on each light/fan, set them both to the same frequency, and used just the one wireless switch in the wall. Now I control both fans and their different speeds, dim the lights, etc. all off the one switch. Works like a charm. This controls both light/fans as one. So when you hit the switch, both fans/lights respond to the command. Your situation would require two separate switches...one for your kitchen and one for the dining room...set on different frequencies. Since you should have switch boxes for each place, this should not be a problem. If you can't pull new wire to make everything hard wired the way you want, I would consider this option. It works great for me. Oh yes...my wireless switch is inside the house and my fan/lights are outside...and it works every time.

  • 18 years ago

    If the house is poured concrete, then the wiring should be in conduit embedded in the concrete. It is trivial to pull new wire into conduit.

  • 18 years ago

    Wow,thanks so much for great suggestions and solution.The remote option seems like it will work.
    The house is 8 inch walls of poured concrete and a totally exposed rafters. Trying to feed an additional wire is impossible as it goes up the inside wall through the roof under the metal and then back into concrete to the ceiling outlet. I will call Smarthome tomorrow. We have only hung two fans out of 16 so who knows what we will find.When you refer to big boxes what is that?

  • 18 years ago

    "Trying to feed an additional wire is impossible as it goes up the inside wall through the roof under the metal and then back into concrete to the ceiling outlet."

    How did the existing wires get installed?

  • 18 years ago

    brickeye has a good point. If the wiring is in conduit...which it has to be, you should be able to pull new wiring. Have you asked your current electrician what he thought about a new pull?

  • 18 years ago

    Lowes, Home Depot, Menards are built like giant boxes, hence, big box store.

  • 18 years ago

    Okay here goes.First of all,remember nothing in the Caribbean is the way it is supposed to be. That's not a complaint just a fact of life we accept.
    The light switch as you enter the kitchen goes up the inside wall in conduit embedded in concrete.The wires for the ceiling boxes are laid after the roof is framed and run through the purloins on top of the insulation to the point in the wood rafter roof where the wire decends down through a hole.Then the roof metal in our case galvanized aluminum goes down and everything is closed up with no access to the purloins or wires ever again.
    Instead of two wires which would control each device separately the electrician ran one wire from the wall switch as you enter through the galley kichen fan and then kept going out to the ouside eating area directly in front of the kitchen. We keep ceiling fans on 24/7 for good air movement and because we rarely need air conditioning somehow even though he had a very specific punch list of what I wanted he assumed both fixtures were fans not one that is a fan and one that is a light.
    Hope this makes sense. But the issue is that it is not a straight run of wire through a conduit where you can use a snake and feed another wire it is a contrived connection.
    I looked at the Smarthome site today and it sounds like a good solution. I was going to head to STT tomorrow to pick up water heaters and thought I would check out Radio Shack to see what types of remotes they carry.