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Help! I don't think I like my new recessed lights! What to do?

16 years ago

So yesterday my recessed LED lights were installed and I don't think I like them. Let me say that there is a chance that I *might* still like them once the kitchen is completed. I realize it's difficult to really tell how things will end up looking. So far my cabinets are installed, but mostly the doors aren't on them. The base cabinets and range are covered up to protect them. The countertop that will be granite is currently only plywood subtop. The wood floors aren't in yet. The undercab lights aren't in yet either. But still, I'm worried.

I really really really wanted to like these lights. I love the idea that they're super energy-efficient. Dimmable. No mercury. High CRI. Aside from the price, I loved everything about them. (They cost about $90 each including trim, but excluding housing). I did have a few concerns about them -- I was worried that the 6'' cans would look too big in my little kitchen with 8' ceilings, and I was worried that they wouldn't give enough light. I figured that we are also getting undercabinet lights, so that shouldn't be a problem.

So you can imagine my surprise when the lights were turned on and, to me, it was too bright! Bright like McDonalds :( So I tried turning them down with the dimmer switch. At their most dim (which I think is 25%), the amount of light is ok. It's the amount of light I would've imagined at 100%. So there's no way to dim them lower for ambience. I would just always keep them on at 25%. Which kind of defeats the purpose of being dimmable. Worse still, when dimmed they make a buzzing sound. It's not loud, but I hear it. I also detect a slight flickering. It must be very quick, because I can't see it when I'm looking at the light. But I sense it when I'm just in the room. Maybe I'm discovering that I have superhuman perception, but I doubt it :)

So my concern about not having enough light was way off. I also don't mind the 6'' housing. It looks ok. It's possible that now I just have too many of these lights for my space. Also I imagine they would look better if I had higher ceilings. But then I still don't like the way they dim.

So now what do I do? What are my options? I *think* I could return the LED lights for a refund. They are installed in standard 6'' remodel housing.

Here is a drawing of my lighting placement ...

And here are photos of the room at 100% ...

And here are photos of the room with lights dimmed to the max ...

I think that actually the pictures look better to me than in real-life. I am noticing a greenish hue though. The paint color is actually a warm beige color that's not at all green.

Comments (18)

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Can you use different, lower foot candle bulbs?
    Talk to your electrician. Maybe he/she has an idea.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    LED lights are still very new in the commercial/residential markets. Like their fluorescent predecessors used to be, the color rendition in LEDs is still very limited and, as you've noticed, take some adjustment.
    There is nothing you can do until the LED manufacturers develop LEDs in a broader range of Kelvin. Of course this will affect the color of everything they illuminate- which is why your wall color has the greenish cast it does. These are the trial-and-error experiences DIYers go through. Very few people outside ALA certified ighting specialists (like myself) would know to advise a client on.
    I suggest focusing on the cost-saving benefits the lights will gie you for years and years to come. Eventually- and much sooner than you think- you will get used to the light color and quality.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    i must have the same dimmer in my bathroom because when i'm soaking in my tub, with lights dimmed to 25%, i hear constant buzzing too!!!!!!!!!! yikes. wish i had better news for you!

    as for your pictures, they look ok to me but it's hard to tell unless you see it in person....

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    are these creLEDs?

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    If I'm reading your plans right (1 square = 1 foot?), you have 7 cans over about a 9'x5' floor area.

    Yes, that's way, way, way too much light.

    I would take them all out and put in a decorative fixture in the center of the room. If your pendant lights don't light up the sink and counters next to the sink well enough, move the two cans flanking the sink area back so that they are over the midline of the counter, and use them to light the counter and sink.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I have 8' ceilings too with about the same spacing of cans. I only use them when I'm doing a lot of work in the kitchen. And as soon as I'm done they get turned off. Even though they're dimmable I see it as a waste of energy. I keep my undercabinet fluourscents on all day ... only turning off overnight. And the pendants over the peninsula are used as needed, but I do utilize the dimming feature with them.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    If they will take the bulbs back, I would exchange them. The buzzing would drive me crazy!!! I tend to get migraine headaches, and the fluorescent lights in my bank will bring on a headache within minutes- I couldn't work there for love or money.

    So, not having LED's, am I understanding correctly, that it's just the bulbs, and you could put some other kind of bulb in your housing? I would do that for now, and convert to LED's when they improve.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Once you're using the kitchen again your perception will most likely change. Right now they're new. Give it time.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Yes, these are the Cree LED lights. They seem to have received rave reviews, so I was under the impression that these were the first LED lights to really be a viable option. It's true that they are much better than any other LED lights I've ever seen -- they definitely emit a lot of light and they don't have any of that blue-ish hue that I usually associate with LEDs.

    BUT, I really don't like the light. In fact they make me feel a little carsick, particularly at any level of dimming the resulting strobe effect literally makes me feel ill. So I will have to return them and find another solution. It's very disappointing.

    I should be able to just put some other kind of bulb in the housing. I'm not sure what kind to get though. I'm also not sure whether to just do the minimum fix (ie switch to other bulbs), or to take it a step further and reduce the number of lights ... which would also require moving the remaining lights. And if I do that, then should I also switch to 4'' housing? And if I do that, should I switch to low-voltage? Or am I now just driving myself crazy and should just probably try switching out the bulbs first.

    If I assume I'm just going to switch to other bulbs - what kind should I get?

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    To find out what you like, experiment! The easiest way to do that is to try lamps that will fit in housing. I suspect it takes normal Edison base lamps, so you can try lots of different things. In general, though, "lots of different things" pretty much comes down to standard "A" lamps of various wattages, and various reflectorized lamps, of assorted beam widths and wattages. What you probably can't do with what is currently there is point the lamps anywhere other than straight down, or move the fixtures.

    Play around, and have fun!

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I felt exactly like you do with my last kit. They had all of them on one switch. I had the electrician come back and make 3 swithches. The one I used most often on one (prep area) two flanking range on one and the rest on the third. Two and 3 switch were on dimmers. I can honestly say I never in 5 yrs used the 3rd switch.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I have the LR6s as well, 9 of them in a 12 and 1/2 by 25 foot space (plus a different kind of recessed LED over the sink). I love them, and others who have seen them are very impressed. Have only had them a few weeks, but they are the first to go on, at full power, and stay on when we're in the kitchen. First thing I would do is make sure you have the right trim kit and dimmer switches - many can be used with these, but not all. Second -- are several connected to one dimmer? When mine were first installed, we only had 3 on one switch because I had bought too few by mistake, and it wasn't enough for them to work properly (need at least 4). One of the lights would flicker. Now there is no problem. LEDs should NOT buzz or flicker.

    Good luck.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    I'm glad to hear that the LED lights are working for you. It sounds like you have a much bigger space than we do, with only 2 more lights. I think this was perhaps our biggest mistake -- just too many of these lights. (As I mentioned, I was worried that LEDs wouldn't put out enough light). Maybe if we had only installed 4 of them, the amount of light would be ok. To reduce the number to 4 at this point would require completely re-placing the lights and rewiring.

    I wonder also if the increased number of lights in our smaller space is amplifying the effect of the flickering? i.e. maybe it wouldn't be noticeable if the lights were further apart?

    The housing and dimmer switch we have are both on the compatible list on the Cree website. All 7 of the lights are connected to the same dimmer switch. So I'm not sure what the problem is.

    When they are on at full power, they don't buzz or flicker. We had friends over yesterday and at full power they thought the lights looked great. (It wasn't too bright for them). Then I dimmed them and they didn't think the buzzing was too bad. They also didn't really notice much flickering. But then I started waving my arms around and they were shocked. The strobe effect when the lights were dimmed made my kitchen seem like a disco!

    Cbjmidwood, when you dim your lights and wave your arms around, is there any strobing?

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    My husband suspects your issue with the flickering/buzzing is related to the dimmer and not the lights. What specific dimmer are you using? He said he will look up the dimmer information and try to help if you can provide that information.

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    The dimmer is a Leviton Illumatech IPI06-1L.

    Thanks!

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Oh Aussies, this is breaking my heart! I have watched your research on the board and have decided on the LR6's, too. My kitchen is a tiny bit bigger and I have only five going in. They'll be on three switches....yes, dimmers. I am super-sensitive to buzzing, so I am worried. OTOH, I am getting older and find I need LOTS of light to work comfortably. Please keep us posted!

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    aussies -- I tried the arm waving and didn't get any strobe effect. The dimming is a bit uneven, e.g., some of the lights go off before others. Not a problem for us as I'm not sure we'll really use the dimmers much.

    amysrq -- You might want to check with electrician... I'm not sure 5 LR6's on 3 switches will work. Each dimmer switch needs a minimum amount of wattage which I believe equates to about 4 LR6's (since they're so darn efficient!).

  • 16 years ago
    last modified: 10 years ago

    Oh, well, that's just grand, isn't it? I hate it when we push the technology envelope and force new tricks on old dogs who don't even know what the hoops are...

    I'll speak with the electrician asap. Thanks.