It seems like it.

We want new counters, Zodiac or Granite. But then our cabinets will look shabby. So we tried to price out refacing optioins, but never imagined that $11,900 would be the standard cost for refacing. It's cheaper to replace them with Ikea or Lowes.

I'm experiencing sticker shock. It seems like you mentioned the work "kitchen" and every contractor around adds $10,000 before they even know what you want done.

Not moving walls, not replacing appliances, not changing flooring or lighting. Just updating/replacing cabinents and a new counter. Don't want to do it ourselves, but it's looking more and more likley that we cannot afford anyone else.

The economy is certainly not in great shape. But I am too far along in this build to shift gears now. I sort of look at it as if I buy what I want now, it will save money because if I get something cheaper I'll end up replacing it later down the road anyway and the money spent now would have been for nothing. It's new construction, so I can't put off getting things like applinances. I am spending a little less on things that are inexpensive and easy to replace later, like the bathroom faucet and some of the light fixtures.

Financial planning is not, never has been, & most likely never will be, a strength of mine, so my thoughts must be heard with that in mind.

I own 2 small businesses, & have been busier than ever - what economic downturn? (I know it's happening; I just hope my work busy-ness will continue, but who knows?)

I happened to start a small project (replacing my front door), & my contractor has slowed down a bit (on purpose - he's just burned out) so he could fit me in easily. Well, of course, my little project led me back here for questions & answers, & now I'm doing some kitchen tweaks, & the front door project turned into tearing down a wall, replacing the entry tile, & all of the many extras that went along with that, plus doing some work in the bathroom, plus.....

So I guess my answer is "no", I'm not not putting off improvements, I'm adding them!

My project - tear-down of sunroom, adding addition that will be the new kitchen, converting old kitchen to a dining room - just started yesterday. My house is already in chaos! The economy was only a minor concern, because I've been saving for this project.

But, in talking to contractors, I found that new home builders are underbidding on remodeling projects. The window guy I talked to yesterday said business is getting tight. The cabinet dealer, on the other hand, said business is on the upswing.

In my experience, the contractors are so eager to work that they will work with you on price. To them less money is better than no work. They are practically begging to work for you.

I have a friend who is looking for ceasarstone. She got an estimate, but is not ready to proceed. Every couple of weeks she gets a call with a reduced price...

moon- what kind of businesses do you own? You are certainly one of the lucky ones!

Oh yes - I meant to mention that there are a lot of hungry workers out there; as onenjen said, less money is better than making none at all!

onenjen - I have a green carpet cleaning business and I'm a feng shui/space clearing consultant. The space clearing is my passion; the carpet cleaning pays the bills. One is maintenance, the other people consider a luxury (although I think it should be maintenance as well!) so both tend to be eliminated from people's budgets when things get tight - but not for me, right now!

Yes, definitely! Back in May my DH quit his very well-paying job to go back into the family business. I didn't realize how much he hated his job and was losing sleep over it. We had just gotten a home equity loan and even started demo. Now he is making less than half of what he was and we have had to use the loan money to pay some bills. Thankfully, our LTV is really, really low, so we'll be fine. And money isn't everything when you are miserable.

I am thankful we have food on the table and a roof over our heads, but I have to admit I am also a bit bitter about all this. I really have to keep my feelings in check because my DH is such a hard worker and wants more than anything to own this business someday. But it's no fun when a good portion of the house is nothing but studs. We also built a detached garage that has to be drywalled and stuccoed still.

I am still doing lots of planning with my computer program and researching appliances, etc. because I know the dream will come true eventually.

I'm not really sure what we're doing. I am more than likely losing my job within the next month, and while I'm not the majority breadwinner, I contribute my fair share. Plus, the current credit/economic crisis isn't helping the situation either. So, all this may change things considerably. I already have all my appliances sitting in various parts of my house, frig/freezer in DR, Blue Star range in Great Room and all the others in the basement. It is depressing walking past them all the time not knowing what is going to happen. I have a deposit on cabinets but have not yet ordered them. We installed hardwood in the LR, but didn't finish them because we were waiting for the kitchen to do them all at the same time. It is depressing(as I know Houseful can relate to)to walk around your house seeing everything in a state of disarry and no work being done. I thought the layoffs were coming a couple of weeks ago, so we decided to take a wait and see attitude about the reno. What makes matters worse is that it took me about 2 years of planning to get to this point and finally be happy with the layout, finishes and appliances. We are/were SOOO close. Now, we're just waiting....and keeping our fingers crossed!!

I have been doing planning without a real goal for when I'd start (but hoping for early spring). I have to admit, I've been putting the word "if" into my conversations a lot more than the word "when" lately.

I have a sophmore in college and a junior in high school. I wonder how much I would enjoy my new kitchen if in a couple of years the college funds haven't recovered, we couldn't make the tuition bills and I knew I could've had an extra $30,000 from my kitchen fund.

I'm continuing my research and planning, but I think I will be much more hesitant to sign a contract.

Also, the longer this goes on I think the trust issue will get harder and harder. I may be comfortable with spending my money, but how am going to be able to tell if the small business people I will be working with are not just this close to going under? How will I know that the money I pay up front is going to pay for the materials and sub-contractors on my kitchen and not on the kitchen they worked on before mine?

Which brings up a question - does anybody work out of escrow accounts? I'll put money into the account, but the GC can't draw on it until the work is done to satisfaction? I'd hate to have to work this way, but it could protect both the contractor and the customer.

I SO empathize with what several of you are saying. My job is secure, I'm a teacher. Consequently, I earn ... well... not much; even though I've been teaching for over 20 years. My BF/DH (whatever) is retired due to an injury and we do OK. HOWEVER, his house hasn't been rented for a year now and 2 mortgages are being covered. We planned on renovating and expanding his small home for our retirement home and that got scaled back to just a renovation. I conceded. Then the renovation (in his mind) keeps getting scaled down and I conceded some. Now, it looks like someone we know may need a home for awhile and we'll rent to them if they need it... no problem. But when it comes to creating my kitchen... there is a huge divide. He lacks flexibility, vision, and is resistant to change. Everything I want he views as excessive, too much work, or too much money. This is very very hard for me because by nature I am a "let's dive in and do it now" kind of person. I want to pin him down to commit to a design I love; even if it's a year from now. There's no way that's going to happen. So I sit back, play with layouts, read the posts, help where I can, and pray that one day it's me posting a "final layout help please" thread (or heaven knows a finished kitchen post)! It sounds so stupid that so much of my heart is tied to this remodel when I write/say it but I think it represents more then just new "stuff". I think it represents commitment to this being my forever home too; that I won't just be living in "his house". So, here I sit, with my heart in my mouth; waiting for a year to pass so I can know where my life is headed.

Sorry if this is a bit OT and too much but it's the only anonymous place I can vent without repercussion.

How timely a question! I inherited my grandfather's house this past year, and I was going to replace the in-bad-shape kitchen before selling it. But I just checked the housing prices, and the comps have fallen $100,000 since I last checked some months ago. I now owe more than it's worth, and I'm almost out of the inherited money I've been paying the mortgage with. So if there's a chance I'm going to lose the house, I'm certainly not going to spend the money to redo the kitchen. I might try to rent it out, but the carpets are pee-stained, and I'll at least have to come up with the money to replace 1600+ feet before I can rent it out (and also remove all the packrat belongings in 3 bedrooms and a 2 car garage)(living 500 miles away)

Sorry for venting, but this has been a shock these past couple of days...Hopefully the world will calm down soon and people will be able to get loans again within a month or two.

Carla in Sac

Carla... I'm sorry to hear about your grandfather. You might try talking to the mortgage company to see what can be renegotiated especially with the new bail out plan. I know there are provisions for mortgage negotiations though I don't know the specifics imbedded in the bill. Try waiting a few weeks and then talk to someone so you can approach the bank with knowledge.

Hugs & gentle smiles to you remodelfla - your post touched me. And I agree - it sounds like the remodel you're dreaming of is much deeper than just *stuff*. Although that's probably true for many of us - our homes reflect so much of who we are, who we have been, who we are becoming :)

And Carla - gentle smiles to you as well. The world is indeed in flux; may we do what we can to keep our own hearts calm in the midst of it. Best of luck. :)

We saved 10 years for our kitchen and paid for it with saved funds. We didn't take out a home equity loan. I sometimes think had we waited we may have been able to get some things cheaper, but my crystal ball has not been working very well these days ;-)). I know I overspent on my kitchen, like everyone else, and lately have been having buyers remorse. I do love my kitchen and when I'm cooking on my spulge item I enjoy every minute of it, so I guess that's priceless. Things will come back they always do.

This thread is interesting since I JUST heard on the local radio today (I'm in Chicago), during a business segment, a snippet from an interview with Mike Abt, owner of Abt Appliances which is located in a suburb of Chicago. Some of you TKO's may know of Abt Appliances--they're an enormous appliances/electronics store, do a lot of internet business, and have an excellent reputation for standing behind their products. Mr. Abt said they've seen a decrease in business on two fronts. First, the developers who would previously buy, e.g. 500 each of fridges, ranges, MW's and dishwashers for a construction project, aren't doing that any more. Second, individual consumers who say almost word-for-word what Mapletex wrote in the OP above ("I will wait and replace [the appliances] as needed. I just can't justify spending the money, not knowing how things will be six months from now.").

On a positive note, Mr. Abt said that while kitchen appliance sales are down, flat-screen TV sales are increased due to the digital conversion coming in February. I myself believe the TV sales increase can also be attributed to their significant decreases in price, and also because people are cutting back on vacations, restaurants, theater, and the like, so are sitting at home more with their TV's.

(BTW, if you are visiting the Chicago area, and are crazy TKO, the Abt Appliances store is TOTALLY worth a visit! It covers several acres, and is fascinating. There are appliances at every price point and a ton of brands, so that you can see things side-by-side. And also a 20' long fish tank.)

My retired Mom (most of her non fixed costs are covered by her draw from her private pension plan and retirement savings which are definitely not going up) was expressing some concern the other day and I suggested we could still put it off and her answer was an emphatic no. Her condo is paid for, she has the money set aside and she can defer the payment of 1\3 of it for a year with no interest.

Canada has been pretty resistant so far so I don't get the sense great deals are around the corner (but I'm keeping my eyes peeled). This has always been a reno where we needed to watch the bottom line so if our business becomes a little more important to vendors we won't mind in the least. I was pretty insistent on trying to buy Canadian when I could, particularly for the cabinetry, and I'm really glad we could do that one little thing.

I'm an Art Consultant in the Public Service so pretty teflon (I hope). My Mom was getting ready to retire her 10 year old Saturn but she'll wait another year and see how things go. Ever resourceful she's working the advance polls for pin money tonight. Prairie girls raised in boarding houses are pretty resilient in my experience. I hope it is relatively painless for everyone and particularly for those in our manufacturing sector who seem to be just taking hit after hit.

I started feeling the economic downturn last August. I work for a law firm that does due diligence for the big banks making commercial real estate loans. I work on a per piece basis and an hourly wage (it is too complicated to explain).

Anyway, last August our work flow decreased when the markets got jittery. Things pick up a bit this spring but now we are completely dry - no deals are being made. My gross income has been reduced by 2/3s.

We decided to just paint the kitchen cabinets, take wall paper down and repaint and figure out what to do with the counters that will update them and not be expensive.

Now that I am not working as much I can paint the cabinets and not get stressed about finishing deals but I would rather be working more and stressing about the economy less.

Yep. Just sent off an email to a potential kitchen designer that I've been working with since June, asking how we can cut back. Their original bid was 32,000 for ceiling/lighting/soffit work, granite counters, and cherry Kraftmaid cabinets. But, no major changes to the layout at all.

Looking to perhaps leave the soffits in place, go with a cheaper granite, and cheaper cabinets - > different wood and door style. I'm hoping I could cut the cost down to 20k-ish, but not sure how realistic this is.

I'm also looking into cabinet refacing, although DH isn't crazy about the idea, and not sure if it's worth the $$.

I just cant stomach 32k. Not a lot left over after that for emergencies, should something come up.

I'm so sorry for all those who have been adversely affected by our poor economy. It's one thing to hear unemployment numbers on tv, but to hear the stories of those actually affected makes it very real.

Surveymom: I know how you feel. I have a college sophomore, a high school senior, and a high school sophomore. Luckily our college student got a scholarship which covers 2/3 of her tuition, and we are able to pay the remainder and her room and board out of our household income. Our college fund has not been touched yet. Our second child is seriously considering going to school in our hometown, so we will have no living expenses and in-state tuition.

I was not looking at very expensive appliances, and have the money to pay for them, but I'm still hesitant. I wouldn't mind replacing something broken, but right now it just seems frivolous to replace a working appliance strictly because I don't like the colour. I guess I'll just appreciate them that much more when I finally do get them. :)

We are too far along to scale back, but I would have if I had known just how bad it would get. I had planned on buying new pots and pans and dishes, etc., and all kinds of accessories for the new kitchen, and I'm putting that off. It will kill me to put my old junky pots etc. in my beautiful new kitchen, but I'm very nervous about how my job and my husband's job.

We were also going to paint our house, which would have included a lot of work on our wraparound porch in our 1894 house, a pretty major project, and we're putting it off until next year. It kills me because I know that the porch will get worse going through another winter, but we just don't have the money.

I'd love to replace some or all of my appliances, but like many others here, can't justify it in these times. Have a furnace and WH that might demand replacement soon, so the "wants" must give way to the "needs" for a few months.

I've been lusting after a Lacanche Cormatin stove, but my real need will probably start with a new DW, since it's the sole remaining original appliance left from our 1989 remodel. The darn thing just won't die, but it's a water hog (it uses 9 gall on Water Miser setting, not great in a mandatory drought environment) and the door is slowly rusting away underneath. No leaks yet but it's just a matter of time before it gets urgent.

I figure the Lacanche will still be there next year, when I do expect things to get better. Of course, there's also that back porch and stairs that's beginning to deteriorate....ah, the joys of homeowning, LOL!

We figured the over inflated housing market in Vancouver was going to burst, so we sold our beloved home & downsized to an area out of the lower mainland.

As for the renos we're doing, we have also downscaled them a bit. For the bathroom reno budget really came into play, the granite company wanted $700 for a counter, we ended up finding a wood counter which DH added trim to, cost $32 + a bit of labour. Sink & taps came from HD instead of pricey bath centre.

We have shelved it. We have the money saved to pay for it but it makes no sense in this economy to take that kind of risk - we would have no cushion considering what has happened in the market.

Borngrace - sorry to hear that. We haven't shelved it yet....but I am working very hard to "downsize" what I can still affect. The only reason we haven't shelved it is that all my appliances are already paid for and sitting in my house. So, I will be reducing quantity of cabinets and also will be adding in some pantry cabs from Ikea instead of using only the all wood cabinets as originally planned(I was going for more of an eclectic look anyway). I will also be rearranging my layout so I need less plumbing, electrical, framing and drywalling. Part of our remodel was replacing a picture window with a slider. Was able to find the exact size I needed on Craigslist for $350 vs. the $1700 retail, so that has helped. I also think DH is going to do more of the work that we had initially planned.

And an update from my post above on Oct.3...I am 99.9% sure I will find out on Thursday that I am losing my job. But...I'm still trying to figure out a way to make this work.

Good luck to everyone. We will get through this somehow.

We are in the final stages of our 10 month diy kitchen. I had taken a personal day two weeks age so the granite could be templated. The granite guy couldn't come until the next day(grrr!!) but my husband came home and told me he'd been laid off. We seriously considered cancelling the granite but since the money had been earmarked already, we decided to go for it. We also continued on with getting our island covered in cherry butcher block. It was nerve wracking to forge ahead, but we have been working very hard for so long on this kitchen, and just needed to get it done. The final, last non-critical elements (pantry cupboard, backsplash) will have to wait. Atleast I'll enjoy my kitchen more as I'm cooking up lots of pasta!

We are in the final stages of our 10 month diy kitchen. I had taken a personal day two weeks age so the granite could be templated. The granite guy couldn't come until the next day(grrr!!) but my husband came home and told me he'd been laid off. We seriously considered cancelling the granite but since the money had been earmarked already, we decided to go for it. We also continued on with getting our island covered in cherry butcher block. It was nerve wracking to forge ahead, but we have been working very hard for so long on this kitchen, and just needed to get it done. The final, last non-critical elements (pantry cupboard, backsplash) will have to wait. Atleast I'll enjoy my kitchen more as I'm cooking up lots of pasta!

We haven't made any cuts at all, actually we have acquired a bad case of "while we're at it" disease ... but it really DOES make sense to rework the second story plumbing while the first floor ceiling is open...

I think that things are slowing down a bit in our region for suppliers and contractors, but here that just means that they are very busy rather than insanely busy - although one high-end kitchen supplier recently folded.

We are doing most of our work ourselves so have not noticed much change in labour costs ;) but we are hoping that prices on some things we have yet to buy will come down a bit.

Spring 2009 will probably be much different. I think that there will some excellent deals to be had then. If I was planning on starting a reno I would wait until then but I would not, under any circumstances, go into debt to do it with the global economy in the condition that it is now.

Things are going to get extremely tight. I believe that it will be many years before the real estate market ever approximates the performance it turned in over the last decade, so it may be a good idea to make sure that improvements are done to one's personal tastes rather than with an eye to a quick resale.

Not downscaling & not putting off but not getting in any big hurry, either, because I'm anticipating lots better pricing on materials. Have already noticed that the 3/4'' plywood that I need for the floors is $5-$6 less per sheet now over late last spring/ early summer. Like Sailormann, we do most of the work ourselves so most of our budget goes to material. Besides better pricing at retail, I anticipate that a lot of stuff is going to shake out in the secondary market (Craigslist, etc.) with contractors going out of business, homeowners shedding stuff they've bought in anticipation of remodeling, bankruptcies, etc. Bad economic news is good news for bottom feeders.