Also, don't confuse hardwood with engineered hardwood--they have very different pros and cons and one might be better (or cheaper) than the other. (I think a 3 day soaking would be a bit tougher on engineered, for example, but the wide planks you're after would be better with engineered....)

I agree with scrappy concerning wood look tiles. I read the other wood tile thread and while I agree that JC and Sophie are correct about industry standards, I don't see a problem with choosing to disregard those specs if you are aware of the limitations and trade offs. I have LFT in a 50% offset with 1/16 inch grout spacing and am very happy with it. I wanted tile, I did not want big grout joints. I do believe that the skill and experience of my tile setter has everything to do with my satisfaction with the job. If I were going to go outside of industry specs, I would be very careful about a "budget friendly" installation. I plan to have wood look tiles installed in my office using a random pattern and 1/16 grout joints, but I have seen some recent wood-look jobs done by my installer and I am confident in his work.

Sounds like you picked a very high quality floor. Plus like you said nothing gives the feel and warmth of wood.

Additionally if you have any back or knee problems stone and tile will exacerbate the problems. We moved into a rental while our house is being built, and the floors are stone. We were there for only 6 days before coming back to NY for the summer, and I have to tell you my back was already feeling it.

I'm not in Canada but I am going with Kahr's Canvas collection in their white oak bristle color. It's click and lock or glue down and is 5" w x 72" l. Price at Pro Source was under $6 a square foot in the US and from all I've researched Kahrs has a very good reputation.

Here's a link to the Kahr's Canvas Collection

I can't tell you what you should do, but I will tell you a 4.5mm wear layer is excellent. What is their warranty on the floor? Plus that floor you chose with the cabinets and counter is heavenly. I love the combination!!! Personally I wouldn't worry about not researching it to death. (Although I'm the same way as you so feel your pain.)

Ms K, yes there is a high potential for tile lippage with average tile and an average installer. I used the wood look tile in our guest house, about 1,600 sq.ft and we have no lippage, with a random pattern and narrow spacing. Our tile was very straight and level out of the box and our installer was very thorough with the floor preparation and tile installation. It was not a budget installation ... we paid whatever the GC asked to get the random look we wanted.

We have site finished hardwood floors throughout our house (except bathrooms) and have had no issues with water in the kitchen.

cpartist, when do you plan to install your flooring? I love your choice and hope you'll post pictures when it's in!

cpartist, when do you plan to install your flooring? I love your choice and hope you'll post pictures when it's in!

Thank you jellytoast. First the house plans need to get out of the permitting stage. I'm told that will probably be another 4 weeks. Then another 2 weeks for the builder to gear up and make any changes we have. Maybe sometime in November? December? Who knows. LOL. But yes, I'll post pics of my floor and my whole house when I'm finished.

Love your choice Arlene.

Ms. K...are your cabinets QS oak? Very nice.

you won't regret wood. Not so hard on your feet and knees.

I installed solid oak floor in my kitchen in 1986, raised two boys, one dog, and had two ice maker failures resulting in leaks.

I've sanded and refinished the floors once since installation, they are about due for another quick refinish in front of the sink and range. Believe me, this floor has not been babied, my kitchen is like a work shop. You will love walking/working on wood versus cold hard tile, plus it looks real because it is!

I've had hardwood floors in two kitchens over the years, but mine were the old fashioned oak "finish on site" kind and I had a high gloss polyurethane finished put on them. They're VERY easy to care for - just keep a mop and bucket away from them - too much water is deadly. They're great with dogs but I do have oriental rugs in the kitchen to catch some of the mud and hair - easy to vacuum up and looks better than dust bunnies the size of sage brush. I have no experience with any other kind of wood flooring.

That's an expensive floor, for sure. (I converted your price to USD)

Ours was also on an expensive side(even though still a bit cheaper). We really liked it though. We explained to the store owner how we're looking all over for certain type of wood flooring, and have such and such quotes by now, and asked him "Do you think you can make a better price for us?" Surprisingly, he said "yes!" Saved us almost two dollars per square foot. Full house=tons of money. Never ever hurts to ask..

As for the everyday care-I'm yet to find out, and find comments here really reassuring..

Plus, I personally think the wood tile look will look dated in a few years. Real wood is timeless.

I don't know why anyone would let worries about what may or may not look dated down the road influence their thoughts about what they like today or what works for them in their home. It really narrows your choices. Wood isn't for everyone. I wanted a floor in my kitchen that I could douse with Pinesol. Try that with wood! :-)

I don't know why anyone would let worries about what may or may not look dated down the road influence their thoughts

I guess I do because I always have resale in the back of my mind, just in case.

I put hardwood floors in my kitchen and will be remodeling a new kitchen in near future and ABSOLUTELY would put in hardwood floors again. Would aim for true hardwood (vs engineered) if possible, if cost is not prohibitive. I sold my house recently and the buyers loved the floors - good for resale.

I also have engineered wood floor in my kitchen. Before we decided on that, DH would ask me "are you sure you want wood floor in kitchen? Would you consider tile?" every 2 weeks, for a couple of months. It's been over a year now since we remodeled the kitchen and moved in. No regrets at all. I thought I would stress about it since I have weekly gathering with my girlfriends which we all cook one or two dishes in my kitchen together. Nope, not stress at all! If I see big spill of water, I wipe them up right away, I did the same when I had tiles in my last kitchen, so no differences there. I have dropped stuff on it and the woods take drops and dents well. Would do it again in a heartbeat!

Hello everyone! I'm so overwhelmed, again, at how generous you all are with sharing your time and personal experiences. Because I'm in the midst of figuring this all out, I can't do the individual replies like you deserve. I'm so sorry. But here is an update/general reply:

I got the pricing for both materials. Materials-wise, the tiles were WAY cheaper but installation-wise, the tiles cost way more. When I compared the material + installation cost for both, HW still costs quite a bit more but it has more pros for me than tiles. And my GC couldn't guarantee he could install the tile with narrow grout lines and little or no lippage.

So I've decided I will be doing HW. But, I am going to give myself one more week to seek out a cheaper HW that has the same look. I also plan to "cheat" a bit and lay down some cheap tile or linoleum underneath the cabinets. This will both save me a bit of money and give me some peace of mind, should any leaks occur around the DW, sink or fridge.

And some quick answers to your specific questions:

cpartist: this floor has a 30 year warranty.

ILoveRed: my cabinets will be a stained rift white oak but the cuts my cab maker used in their door sample showed some beautiful flecking in it like QS oak, so it's close to QS. :)

BTW cpartist: your comment "Plus that floor you chose with the cabinets and counter is heavenly. I love the combination!!!" really stuck with me and made me stop and just take in the fact that this floor will really make this kitchen the kitchen of my dreams. Thank you - so glad that at least I got something right in this whole process!

cpartist, I do agree that in thinking about resale, many people would prefer a hardwood floor.

"I also plan to "cheat" a bit and lay down some cheap tile or linoleum underneath the cabinets. This will both save me a bit of money and give me some peace of mind, should any leaks occur around the DW, sink or fridge."

just make sure you don't run into the same problem my mom had. Her dw had to be replaced and the flooring was not under her dw. They had a heck of a time getting it out.

i can't wait to see your cabinets. Love QS oak!

Yes..we were also highly advised by our GC to put some tiles under the cabinets, fridge, etc., the whole perimeter of the kitchen. So that's what we did. Tiles should be the same level with a flooring of course..

We were also advised on engineered wood vs solid since it's doing a bit better with moisture.

ILoveRed: I made sure to ask GC to get the two different flooring materials level/flush so hopefully that won't be a problem.

aprilneverends: Ooo... so this isn't some half baked idea of mine. ;) Ha ha... Did you get any of the tile to stick out at all, or is it cut totally flush with the toe kicks? I think I'll stick with engineered wood. It seems more stable for the wide plank look that I like.

No, nothing sticks out, toe kicks cover that part

At least for us, it was our subfloor that determined engineered vs. solid hardwood. 100% of the installers we had come give us quotes told us on no uncertain terms to do engineered. If your installer has not weighed in yet, that might change your plan.

Jillius: I'll make sure to check that with my GC before I confirm if I'm getting engineered or solid. Thanks!

I went to another flooring store and found another floor that looks similar to my first choice but is half the price. Here are some photos. The first shows my first choice on the left and cheaper choice on the right:

The two choices side by side:

I much prefer my first choice because the colouring is slightly warmer and the finish has a lovely satiny feel and it's wire brushed so I can see and feel the little lines in the grain. It also has a finish that the sales guy told me is free of aluminum oxide, which I'd like to avoid of possible.

The second one is so much cheaper and looks close enough to my first choice. It'll save me about $3000. If I choose it though... I may regret it for decades, as I intend to stay in this house and keep this floor for 20+ years. How to choose???

While it's hard to tell from the coloring on a computer screen, I prefer the coloring of your new choice with your cabinets. Why should we be avoiding aluminum oxide? I

Ditto on everything jellytoast said!

That said, $3000 divided by 20 years is $150 a year more to have the more expensive floor, which is roughly $12 a month additional expense to have a floor you passionately love. That seems worth it to me.

splurge on your floor...your kitchen is pretty open and sits between your living zone and dining zone and is on view from those two areas. Go spendy on floor...you won't regret it.....wood is rich and beautiful...get the best you can afford.

I'd even cut back the budget to solid surface counters to get the floor "spectacular."

The second one is so much cheaper and looks close enough to my first choice. It'll save me about $3000. If I choose it though... I may regret it for decades, as I intend to stay in this house and keep this floor for 20+ years. How to choose???

Well that's an additional $3000. Over a 20 year period that equals out to $12.50 a month. Is it worth an additional $12.50 a month for something you LOVE?

Here is a thread that covers the concerns over aluminum oxide: https://www.houzz.com/discussions/refinishing-floors-dsvw-vd~892246 I would love to go with a no-VOC finish like Rubio Monocoat but I know there's no way I could keep up with the maintenance re-oiling. So getting a polyurethane finish seemed like the best choice for durability and ease of maintenance. Researching the different types of finishes led me to learning about the concerns over aluminum oxide.

I got the MSDS for the finish on my first choice floor and the ingredients don't show AO so that alone puts it in front.

I also just can't get over how lovely this floor is! I do passionately love it! When you all break it down and show how little it costs in the long run, I just want to say "To heck with it!!!" and just get it already!

BUT my reno costs are getting really out of hand - 50% above my original budget!! This is despite getting really good deals on my cabinets, counters and sink. I haven't even picked a backsplash yet. The costs are racking up because of the large scope of work: knocking out a couple of walls, installing double pocket doors, installing can lights and undercabinet lights, and relocating some electrical.

I am looking at what I can cut out so I can bring down the budget. Switching the counter material would break my heart too so that will be a last resort. But it certainly would make a huge impact if I just chose a cheaper one.

In the end, I think I will be sticking with my first choice. If I end up hating the cheaper floors that's $3000 totally down the drain.

is your lighting showing these a little differently? What I see is your first choice coming through a bit yellow......the 2nd is cooler. Your cabinet stain looks to have a reddish undertone and, okay, if you're sure about it .....but for a large horizontal plane, are you sure you have the right tone??.....the difference, or discrepancy will be magnified. Really, get the right one but be sure it's the one. Have you brought enough samples home and placed them alongside cabinet sample in your light,etc?? If you've been through all that ,sorry for the questioning.......but be ruthless. You could go a little more red and maybe a shade darker.

herbflavor you are speaking a language I am totally clueless about! ;) Would you kindly teach me more about undertones? A few people have *tried* to teach me in my other threads but it is still so confusing to me! Are you saying the yellow undertones of my first choice floor won't work well with my cabinet stain?

Ms K, we can't tell what the exact color is because everyone's monitor is calibrated a little differently. So what may look more yellow on your monitor might look more red on mine.

What herb is suggesting that you put the floor down on the floor and put your cabinet up against it vertically as you will actually see it in real life. Then step back and make sure the two work well together when YOU look at it. If you think the two work well together, that's all that matters as it's your floor and cabinets.

Oh! Now that is something I can handle! ;) I've done that and YES they look fantastic together!

I've got a new concern about hardwood floors. When it needs to be refinished, can oil based polyurethane be spot repaired? And when I refinish it, will I lose the beautiful colour that's been fumed into the wood?

First of all my guess is the floors are not oil based poly but water based. Secondly, if it has a 30 year guarantee, chances are you won't need to refinish them for quite some time.

One thing you might want to do is just keep some extra boards for a just in case. In my condo, I dropped a very heavy thing onto my floor, which dented it completely. (I'm talking heavy and of course it fell corner down first) It was an easy fix for my floor guy to come in and replace the one board.

Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about something that you may or may not need to do 20-30 years from now. :)

Honestly, you're overthinking it. (Which I understand completely since I do the same thing! I think it's a GW curse.)

If you want to triple check though, I'd post in the flooring forum and ask them.

Thanks cpartist! I just posted in Flooring: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3969062/m=23/will-i-lose-the-beautiful-fumed-colour-if-i-refinish-this-floor. I checked the manufacturer’s specs for the floor and it is oil based poly. I AM over thinking this! Oh my goodness... it is a GW curse! OK... I'll try to just let it go after this one last question! ;)

We plan to purchase 8% more than what we need to have extra boards on hand. It will be pricey but good for peace of mind.

OK... I'll try to just let it go after this one last question! ;)

Well you may try and convince yourself you will, but those of us who are similarly cursed will know better. ;)

I have regular red oak 2 3/4". I wouldn't have anything else in our kitchen. I love it. I feel like it's almost bullet proof. Even with floods, after a while (1-3 months), it will go back to normal. We just had matching wood installed in our dining room and living room, and then the entire main level sanded and poly'd to all match. We didn't use stain. I learned - never use water based poly; always oil. The water will look pretty, but will wear badly and need refinished way sooner than the oil. (We used oil.) Also, I wouldn't go with engineered; I want natural. That's me, but I don't feel that man-made anything is as good as nature-made something.

Having said that, we had wood-look porcelain tile installed in our basement kitchen last fall. I wanted something totally flood proof downstairs (not wood). We love it! It was expensive. Everything is expensive, but when we are buying, we're hoping to only have to do it once.

Also, I wouldn't go with engineered; I want natural. That's me, but I don't feel that man-made anything is as good as nature-made something.

Engineered IS NOT man-made any more than "real wood" is man-made. It is real wood that is sliced thinly (usually about 2.5mm - 5mm thick) and glued to a plywood base. (Please explain how that is not as good as nature made since both solid wood and engineered have to be cut down to size?)

The plywood base gives the wood dimensional stability so there is less expanding and contracting of the flooring. So in places like FL where humidity is high, an engineered wood is actually a better choice to prevent things like cupping.

You are probably thinking of laminates which are pressed wood fibers.

Interesting information CP. I still wouldn't do it. To me that's a veneer. I don't want veneer, I want solid. But that's why there are so many choices! I do have expansion of my "old" floor (1999) a little because we get humid and a lot of temperature variations in Michigan too. I guess that's normal to me and I don't hate it.

And yes, CP, I think I was thinking laminate (which we had in our prior house).

Thanks so much for sharing about your floors Debbi. "I feel like it's almost bullet proof" - I'm hoping the white oak will be just as durable. My current red oak cabinets have been very tough and have stood up to lots of abuse and neglect which is what made me choose oak again for my new cabinets and floors. :)

When I first started the search for HW flooring, I thought all I'd consider was solid. Then I saw some high quality engineered floors and was sold. I think the extra stability from the engineered core of the will make the floors more durable. The floor I'm likely getting also has a 4.5 mm wear layer. It's like a thick slice of wood. It can take up to 3 sandings (or so I'm told) so I hope they'll stand the test of time and last for decades.

"Everything is expensive, but when we are buying, we're hoping to only have to do it once." That is how I'm justifying spending the gobs of money going into this reno...! I've been selecting higher quality materials that are (I hope) quite timeless so that this kitchen will only have to be done this one time.

Update: I did some more shopping around yesterday, trying to look for other options that looked similar to my first choice. Nothing else compared. It was really hard to find one with the same colouring and texture, and especially difficult to find any with a finish free from aluminum oxide. Anything with all of that was in the $12+/sq ft price range. Yikes!

My first choice floor is the hands down winner!

Here's a close up shot showing the wire brushed texture on it (LOVE how it feels under my feet!):