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Healthy gallica recommendation for the frozen north (5a)?

I am buying a rose for my mother, who lives in Vermont in zone 5a. I'm looking for something that requires ultra-low maintenance, and I think a hardy, healthy gallica would be a good fit. Ideally it would not require any spraying, it could just be planted in good soil in a good site and grow for years. What would you recommend? Thanks!!

Comments (32)

  • 8 years ago

    Ispahan. It isn't a gallica, but gallicas would start in your nice hole, then spread outwards toward New Hampshire and New York.

    R. hugonis would be even better because it doesn't need regular renewal pruning.

  • 8 years ago

    As Mad Gallica says, gallicas don't stay put. I have 3. Jenny Duval is a gorgeous rose but an absolute garden thug and comes up everywhere! Aimable Rouge, a beautiful gallica I got from Pickering (sadly closed) does not wander as it is grafted on multiflora. The third one isn't grafted yet hasn't suckered. It isn't in commerce however. If you want to get a gallica I would suggest getting a grafted one, perhaps look at what Palatine sells since their roses are also grafted on multiflora.

    What flower color do you think your mother would like?

    My favorite rose in my garden is the alba Felicite Parmentier. She is on her own roots, had her since the mid 1990s and she has one sucker about a foot away. The most fragrant rose in my garden, it wafts through the air, and the scent is to me fantastic. Pale pink flowers packed with petals. Not very thorny. No disease (blackspot isn't a problem here but comments on HMF indicate good disease resistance in other parts of the country).

    If she likes yellow, I would suggest R. primula, the incense rose. It has pale yellow flowers and sets copious amounts of hips that decorate the plant. Blooms all along the canes. I have read here and elsewhere that it is blackspot resistant. Graceful, vase-shaped growth habit (does get tall!), and foliage scent that wafts through the air. My mother plant is grafted on mulfilora so I don't know about suckering for sure. However, I have 4 seedlings of R. primula and 2 of them look as if they want to sucker.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Thanks all!

    Suckering is not a problem, these will be standalone with mowed field around, or they will be against a wall of woods and spreading will be a nice plus. These will be out on two acres of land and not in a manicured environment, and if they can compete with the sumac more power to them.

    Health / disease resistance in VT is my number one priority.

    Pink, dark pink, red and purple would be ideal colors.

    Ispahan and Felicite Parmentier are common recommendations and are at the top of my non-gallica list. Charles de Mills and Cardinal Richileu seem to be other common recommendations. I've sent her an email asking how many roses she'd tolerate : ) My dad will be on the hook for digging the holes, ha.

  • 8 years ago

    This sounds like the perfect use for Gallica roses. I like to send roses to my sister living in zone 4b Iowa, so I'm tracking this thread with interest. Although not a Gallica, I sent her a William Lobb moss rose that is sailing through the harsh winters without any die-back. It might be a nice taller companion to the Gallica(s) you're planning to give your mother.

  • 8 years ago

    If it's suckering you want, then you can't go wrong with Charles de Mills. I'm trying to dig this one up and will probably be at it for the rest of my life. The blooms are beautiful and have a strong fragrance. (Mine was in the wrong place.)

    I love my Ispahan!!! She's about 15 years old, never been sprayed with anything, never ANY kind of disease, ever. Long bloom period and has one of the strongest fragrances of all my roses.

    You're a thoughtful daughter to send a rose plant instead of just roses that will last about a week.

  • 8 years ago

    I'm actually a son, but thank you! I have filled my own property with roses and now I'm pawning them off on others. Right now the leads are Charles de Mills, Cardinal de Richelieu, Felicite Parmentier, and Ispahan. My folks have a large, rolling property with many different sites, so all of those could be sited how they like. All seem to be pretty disease resistant. I'm having a hard time cutting any of them from the list, I wonder how many holes my dad is comfortable digging in Vermont clay ...

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Most own root purple Gallicas would work well in your parents' zone. If you decide that spreading is a problem, Palatine in Canada will be open for business in September (grafted, hardy). My favorite of all purple Gallicas is Tuscany Superb! If I could only grow one rose, TS might be the one. It's disease free for me. When I gardened in MN, I also enjoyed growing Albas. Carol

  • 8 years ago

    Jenny Duval is a lovely scented roseUpright. Medium green foliage. 3 to 5 leaflets.

    Height of 39" to 5' (100 to 150 cm). Width of 3' to 5' (90 to 150 cm).

    USDA zone 4b through 8b.

  • 8 years ago

    My apologies, Spectrograph. A silly assumption. Your parents are blessed to have such a thoughtful son! We are probably your parents' ages, and my husband is still the principal hole digger here in our WA clay. Sometimes with a pickaxe. You've chosen some of the very best to send.

  • 8 years ago

    If you happen to want a mannerly Gallica that doesn't sucker for a different location (or for your yard), Paul Barden has mentioned several of his gallicas that don't sucker and stay mannerly indefinitely. I'm sure Marianne is one as is Umbra, and I think he'd mentioned Gallicandy and Song of the Stars were not widely suckering. Others are right that the ultimate epitome of gallica suckering is Charles de Mills. Just make sure no one will ever want to plant something else in that spot, or do something foolish like run barefoot in the area. He would make a glorious spring statement, but he's not low maintenance if you plant to want to keep him contained.

    Cynthia

  • 8 years ago

    Well, I went with two classics: Charles de Mills and Cardinal Richelieu. I wanted to include Felicite Parmentier, but I could not find a nursery that had all three except for Rogue Valley Roses, and because of their history of mis-labeled roses I did not want to do business with them any longer.

  • 8 years ago

    Two beautiful ones and great choices. Your mother will love both. You did good!

  • 8 years ago

    Lovely choices! I've grown and thoroughly enjoyed both and suspect your mother will be equally enchanted by them. Carol

  • 8 years ago

    You've already ordered, so it's too late, but I've heard that 'Cardinal Richelieu' can have foliar issues, owing to its china ancestry. You may want to investigate that. I don't grow it, so can't really say either way. I can say that both 'Charles de Mills' and 'Tuscany Superb' are very healthy in my garden.

    -Chris

  • 8 years ago

    Do make sure they understand how to prune these things. They *require* annual pruning to remove aging out wood, which is taken out at the base.

  • 8 years ago

    Too bad nobody mentioned that 'Cardinal de Richelieu' - being part China - has a pretty serious proclivity to Blackspot. Its not what I would call low maintenance. It can also suffer some die-back in cold zones, also because of its tender China ancestry.

    I will send you a potted division of 'Ellen Tofflemire' as a gift if you wish. My three original specimens are now nearly 20 years old and have not exceeded 6 feet in diameter, and always remain tidy and under 4.5 feet.

    See: Ellen Tofflemire

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    Paul, that is very kind, and exactly the kind of feedback I was hoping to find here. I have contacted High Country Roses and asked to alter the order, if possible. It's unfortunate they did not has Ispahan, as that was a runner up choice. I should have just chosen it from the beginning, very few roses get as much praise as Ispahan. Perhaps next year!

    Ellen Tofflemire looks gorgeous. I would love to send it, but you absolutely don't need to do it for free. If you have PayPal, please provide me your username and I will send a small payment to at least cover shipping. I would be honored to have that rose in her garden.

  • 8 years ago

    Spectro: please email me in private to set up the mailing. Thanks!

  • 8 years ago

    I grew Ellen Tofflemire at my old house, the color is absolutely beautiful.

  • 8 years ago

    Well, I'm late as usual to the party, but 'Belle Sans Flatterie' is a peerless Gallica. Actually I've met very few Gallicas I didn't like. This is meant as an encouragement to all to experiment. I have several varieties whose names I don't know: they come from a collector friend and either I lost the labels from the cuttings or he collected them himself and didn't know the names. The point is, they're all distinct, and all good roses.

  • 8 years ago

    Mad_gallica, wouild you be willing to describe your pruning of gallicas a little more? I've been growing OGRs for about three years, and my understanding of pruning them is pretty much "don't until you have to". I only have one gallica though (Charles de Mills), and he went in to the ground late last year as a band so I have roughly zero experience with gallicas.

  • 8 years ago

    I second what Melissa said: there are no bad Gallicas - there are a few real standouts in the clan, but every one I have is a beautiful rose, and the variety within this rather narrow group is quite remarkable. Even when you have fifty+ unique varieties, its very difficult to single out favorites.
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2780/4493843631_d5ed4e3aab_o.jpg

    For those of you who may not be familiar with Suzy Verrier's fine book on the Gallicas, I recommend it with great enthusiasm.

  • 8 years ago

    Spectrograph, Mad Gallica and others will, no doubt, add valuable pruning advice, but I can tell you how I've pruned my Gallicas with good results. Gallicas bloom on old wood (from the year before), so I don't prune heavily in late winter or early spring as I would with a Hybrid Tea. I prune back about 1/4 of the plant or a just bit more after bloom time (by Aug. 1 or before August begins). I also lightly prune in late winter to shape the plant and tidy the ends of the canes.

    My Gallicas have been okay bloomwise with somewhat heavier pruning in both mid summer and late winter, but erring on the side of caution is a helpful starting point. Note: I don't prune much, except light tidy-ups of cane ends and removal of dead wood, until my Gallicas put on some size. Maybe 2.5 feet and bushy?

    I applaud your rose choices! Gallicas and Felicite are wonderful! I've grown them for a couple of decades. Also, just to chime in on Paul Barden Gallicas, I grow quite a few and love them all! Most do sucker much less than some of the historical Gallicas. Rogue Valley Roses carries them and the wait list does move forward fairly quickly in my experience. Carol

  • 8 years ago

    Further to what Carol has said (great advice, that) I would point out that many, if not most, Gallicas can take 3-5 years in the garden before they require any real clean-up at all. So this isn't going to be an issue for at least the first two years, Tom.

    That said, there are many of my Gallicas that have not seen the blades of my secateurs in seven years and they are none the worse for it.

  • 8 years ago

    Oh, my. Did I say "a couple of decades"? It's been almost three decades now. Time flies! Well, either way, I've enjoyed Gallicas and Albas for years. :-) Carol

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I imagine that the life span of any given Gallica cane is dependent to some degree on climate. I can guarantee you that many of my Gallicas have canes on them that have been fully functional for close to a decade.

    But since Tom is going to be planting these roses in a zone 5 climate, like mad-gallica's, then perhaps following that advice would be best.

  • 8 years ago


    Spectrograph, just for the heck of it (and because this is my favorite OGR of all time), I thought I'd attach a couple of photos of my Tuscany Superb. Yes, the petals really look like burgundy wine velvet! :-) Carol



  • 8 years ago

    Carol, great photos, and color-accurate too, especially the second one.

    I remember back in the mid-1990s the first time I rode out to Pickering Nurseries to meet the staff and look at the roses, and when I saw 'Tuscany Superb' in person for the first time, something in my universe tilted sideways and my path was forever changed; the color is astonishing. I rode home with a plant of 'TS' in my saddlebag that very afternoon.

  • 8 years ago

    That is really interesting Mad Gallica about cane life. Because here in California, in zone 9, I haven't seen that. Canes on Jenny Duval last many, many years. I can't recall seeing any die, and I never prune her (have to rip out suckers though when she invades too much). She's been here since 1994.

  • 8 years ago
    last modified: 8 years ago

    I can relate, Paul! I'd call it a full-on spiritual conversion experience. :-) Carol

  • 8 years ago

    I am coming late to this but I'm in a similar climate in Sweden, approximately USDA zon 5b. I grow about 30 gallicas, a few are locally found roses. Cardinal de Richelieu is one of three of my roses with gallica ancestry that can freeze back in a particularly harsh winter, the others are Complicata and Ombrée parfaite.