Oh no, I don't want to ruin her reputation!

I'm sure it's my soil or something specific to me. However, I did have her in a bouquet and somebody brought up the hamburger thing so it's not just my nose. I think that she meant a hamburger with onions, not a meaty smell. At least I hope so!

BentT, that sounds terrible, LOL!

Ha! With a companion plant of dill to give it the smell of pickles too. ;-) A burger themed garden.

How gross Cori-Ann, LOL! After all of my hard work, nothing more fragrant than a drive-in burger joint!

Some of my roses do looked sizzled right now though.

Meant to tell you that we had a couple of days of lower humidity, and my Amazing Grace blooms opened right up. I wonder if our high humidity is what keeps them balled and/or shriveled up. Fragrance is lovely though.

I have Joan Fontaine in the ground, and she blooms about average, but I like her and will keep her. She was one of those little own roots twigs when I got her, but after 3 years, she finally decided to grow up.

I once thought about getting rid of Angel Face, since her flowers faded. Now she is my favorite since I love lavender roses. She no longer seems to fade much.

I have thought about getting Violet`s Pride, but it is called Determinate. Does that mean it only blooms once?

Pat, I've never heard Determinate used with roses, only tomatoes, which means they grow just so big and produce their fruit mostly at the same time. So the last part would fit with a once bloomer. Anyone else heard of this?

Nancy

I`d only heard it used with tomatoes too, but Edmunds lists it as determinate on their site.

Good lord Needsmoremulch do not say the H word!!! I agree it's been a very nice summer with some unusually cool weather for Texas and lots of rain but I'm hoping that means the gulf water will be cooling down soon and that will deter a H. I was without electricity for almost three weeks after Hurricane Rita, I'm not wanting to do that again anytime soon lol.

And for the record my Beverly smells rosy not like a onion or a hamburger lol.

Yeah, that was rough, boncrow66. And Ike. We don't need any of that for sure. I was knocking hard on wood when I said it. :D

15 yr. old Morden Blush, first rose you come to inside the arbor. It doesn't grow and blooms once, sparingly. My 6 yr. old one blooms like crazy and is bigger than the older one. There are roses that would do better in that prime spot.

Well, now that I'm thinking of it, the roses on the arbor - New Dawn, who is being swallowed by a neighboring rugosa and Jeanne La Joie on the other side, who is a dud - and their clematis companions. Sweet Summer Love and Prince Charles. I've read that Sweet Summer Love isn't all it was reported to be upon introduction, but Prince Charles is a good clem, so I will move him to another spot. That arbor is rotting away, so it's a good time to dig everything up and replace the arbor. What was I thinking pairing New Dawn with Jeanne La Joie?!

Pat m, Violet's Pride has been blooming all year here!

But New Dawn had a fantastic first flush months ago and haven't seen a bud since. Flowers, is that what she does for you?

Boncrow, happy about your Beverly! I'm sure it's just something specific to my garden.

Lavenderlace, my New Dawn has never been a good bloomer, even in the first flush. Not a good climber, either. I probably didn't prepare the soil properly around that arbor. I'm going to move her to another place and try growing her as a shrub. If she still doesn't feel like blooming, she's going to that big rose garden in the sky.

Oh dear. I wish I would have realized this before I spent so much time moving half of them to a fence because I was so tired of wrestling with them. The first flush was fabulous though and the fragrance actually wafted so was hoping that it was worth it, darn.

I also have a half dozen that I tried to grow as shrubs against a building with some assistance. They are certainly vigorous but neither location has felt like blooming again.

I think that I read somewhere that she can revert back to a once-blooming parent? Or maybe she's a sport of one? Hope not!

lavender you're getting rid of 100 roses ? Good heavens, how many roses do you have ?

Well, I'm going out to smell my Beverly and see if I get Inspired to BBQ my diner

Yikes! Lavender, I missed the part about you getting rid of 100 roses. Why don't you have a 'bring your own shovel' rose sale. Even if you let them go for $5 ea. you would at least know that some of them might continue in another garden. Or, charge what they're worth and take a European vacation.

New Dawn is a sport of Dr Somebody (I always forget the name). ND is known to revert, and if your clone has reverted it will bloom only once. I grew several NDs, purchased years ago from David Austin's website, and they all had reverted and were once bloomers. Boy, I did not like that rose, and rid myself of each one. Diane

You are right - Dr. W Van Fleet or something like that. I'm not familiar with it. I have not been very impressed with New Dawn. It first grew in almost total shade, and when it hung out over the walkway, my husband whacked it back, but it insisted on grabbing anyone in the walkway, so he eventually whacked it back so severely, it died. I bought one to replace it, but planted it on the arbor in full sun. This one didn't want to grow, climb or bloom. Now, it is totally hidden under Scabrosa and all tangled up in Sweet Summer Love Clem, and really needs to be put out of it's misery along with the clematis. It put out one tiny bud, searching for light, this season.

Yes, that's the Dr's name. I think I have a mental block against remembering it because I disliked New Dawn so much. I'm surprised your second ND is so wimpy. I think mine were scary aggressive. The ND growing on my arbor broke it--a good quality metal arbor. What a thorny monster. Diane

I'm glad mine is wimpy, she'll be easier to take out. I've heard how ND can take over houses, and barns and crush arbors! I never thought the blooms were anything to write home about. Now that I think about it, she's had her chance and failed to thrive. No point in prolonging this.

OMGosh! I feel I must come to New Dawn's defense. She's my avatar and just about the only rose I grew for years. I now have 5 and I've really noted her growth habit and what makes her happy. Mine give a huge flush, rest a bit and then give a smaller flush with continual bloom. When nothing else is blooming I can count on her and no BS either! ; ) I don't know how she blooms in shade as mine is in full sun. She will survive with little to no feeding or water, but to bloom well she needs supplemental food after she's done with her first flush. I hardly water my ancient ones, but do from time to time to ensure the blooming laterals and new growth. Be sure to cut out dead growth and when she really gets going with basal breaks, take out one old cane. I take only one out a year. She blooms on new and old wood, so don't prune the old much after the 1st flush or at all in the Spring.

I think many people say theirs has reverted, but it's unlikely that the entire plant reverts at once. More likely it's used its reserves for the Spring flush and they weren't replenished, or they don't get enough sun for new laterals and basals. Lastly, dead-head!!! I do it frequently.

This year, I was unable to do any of the above and she took a long break between flushes, and midge didn't help either, although she was the least affected. Since I've started giving her what she needs, she's giving me a second flush to almost rival the first. Growing her horizontally on a fence is best for dead-heading and encouraging those amazing long laterals, as well as helping with pruning. She's less likely to pull down a fence! Some people trim theirs back to encourage yet more laterals, but I've never done that.

In the the right place with the right care, you'll never have a more consistently fragrant, large-flowered climber that New Dawn and her special colour is not easily found. I'm hoping Viking queen is as good for a mid-range pink. Yes thorns come with the territory, but I have many that are as thorny so no biggy for me. I think some people think she thrives on neglect, but that's not true in my experience. She'll survive abuse, but that's not the same as flourishing.

I have to admit that last year I sided with Diane who kindly gave me a warning about her beastly size, but DH sided with VV and they are all now "his roses". I do point out to him quite often that mine are blooming and all ten of his are just giant though!

It was actually a few threads on here that inspired me to get rid of the ones that don't thrill me. One about annoying colors, fragrances, etc., and the other was just somebody who had a very scary thread about an out of control garden!

I had a tendency to buy varieties by the dozen because:

1) They always seem to be out of the ones that I think that I must have.

2) I thought that they wouldn't get as big as stated (most tripled in size)

3) Since I was a newbie, surely a lot of them would die (they didn't).

I didn't realize that so many dark ones would look so garish in my heat. I didn't realize that so many light ones would turned burned white. And I didn't realize that somebody's floral fragrance could be somebody else's onion!

So I'm replacing the ones that don't tickle my fancy with the ones that do!

Vaporvac, I certainly appreciate your defense of New Dawn. I just have one quibble, and that is about the reversion of the sport to the parent clone. The thinking by others, who know more than I do, was that the Austin "parent" New Dawn had already reverted, and that the New Dawn roses that Austin was sending out were actually Dr van Fleet roses. This discussion was several years ago on the Antique Roses Forum. My "New Dawn" roses never rebloomed during the whole time I grew them. Diane

Well, if that's the case it'll never re-bloom unless it sports again to ND!!! I'm sorry that happened. Did they ever correct it? My original NDs are from the early 1930s, planted soon after they became available. I think I got good ones. The natural rootings and cuttings have given 6 rebloomers. The new rooting are especially bloomiferous and one I started last summer is reblooming in its pot.

That's interesting Diane, as mine were certainly deadheaded. I was pleasantly surprised with her strong wafting fragrance and number of blooms. Just haven't seen them since!

VV, isn't one of yours really old, like fifty years or something?

Sorry VV, our posts crossed. Do you mean that mine will never bloom again, or just once in the spring?

If you have a van Fleet reversion, LL, your New Dawn will bloom just in the spring every year, but won't repeat during each season.

VV, that's amazing that you have cuttings from such an old ND. Where did you get the cuttings, or do you grow the original old plant yourself? I never did anything about my NDs from Austin because by the time the situation was explained to me on the Antique Roses Forum, all but one of my NDs had been removed, and the one remaining was 9-10 years old. Diane

I have two Mary Roses. And I adore... one of them. For about a month.
One has perfect form with minimal shaping, and is covered in blooms. Absolutely picture perfect. One is a ridiculous octopus no matter what I do to it, and is covered in blooms.

The problem is... after they start to bud they get blackspot and even with
religious spraying and leaf picking starting in March they look HORRIBLE
by the middle of June. Today, my octopus Mary has three healthy canes. The well
behaved one has zero. And today, I pruned them with a shovel.

My non-Austins look amazing. Graham Thomas looks stunning now that he's
in year three and while he could be more generous he IS in a bit of a
shady spot. Crown Princess Margareta is new this year and is starting
to look like a beauty.

Mary though? You were my favourites and you had the place of honour in the garden. So long my dears :/

(I'm not even going to discuss Gertrude Jekyl, who was almost six feet tall, gave me three flowers all year and had five leaves when I dug her out today. Eeesh!)

LL, I meant that for Diane. I'm hoping yours just might need a bit to re-acclimate after their move or more water or feeding.I hope yours aren't Dr.VF.

Diane, my ND are original plantings at my house. The original owner's kids told me when everything was planted when they were growing up including the liquidambar which was planted for Arbor Day when they were in the second grade. I see many that vintage in my daily run, but I'm sure none of the owners know their history. The two sons and both their wives have died, so I'm glad I was able to meet them and talk about the house and garden so many times.

I have a lot of old and unusual plantings such as my old peonies and Cornus Mas and twisted Carpinus. I just wish they never saw ivy on a trip to England and decide that was a good addition! My Orleans polyanthas are original, as well.

That's a wonderful thing to know about your family "heirloom" plants, especially New Dawn. You must live in an older part of town. I have read several times that the Peace clones made from the very early Peace roses were much superior to the current Peace rose clones. I suppose an accumulation of DNA damage over the years has caused this. I have several peonies that grew from starts given to me by my friend's dad. He got these peonies originally from his mother in law. This man died a few months ago at 100 years, and I estimate the original peony plants from his mother in law were at least 100 years old. Plants are so amazing. Diane

Ok days later... blooms on Sunset Dreams :)

Not super orange this time around but pretty close to what they were earlier. It blooms pretty often, and very healthy!

Oh my goodness Dingo, that is beautiful and exactly what I was expecting .How old is your plant?

I better hang on to mine. Maybe it will improve over time. It blooms continuously.

Here is my pitiful Sunset Dreams

It is very small

Kristine it came this year. I think some of the first blooms were more pink like yours. The soil here is a little on the alkaline side, clay loam, don't know if it makes a difference. Holly tone and miracle grow shake & feed is about all it's gotten this year. And water :). Don't give up yet!

Wow, Dingo, your Sunset Dreams is almost a dead ringer for Augusta Luise when she is a slightly orangish mood. For all of those who are frustrated in trying to get AL, try Sunset Dreams as a good substitute, though SD's blooms are smaller. Diane

No, definitely not giving up. Next spring the whole bed is going to be reworked so I've got weed cloth down and I really don't like it so I'm going to pull all that up and really work the soil putting in Our Lady of Shalott and I think it'll have a better chance if I work the soil a little bit more. but thank you for posting your picture it gives me encouragement to know that's what that Rose can be.

Diane I think that's why I bought it! Even if AL becomes available, I don't think she would survive here in the cold. Kristine I'm not a weed cloth fan, doesn't prevent weeds and is a pain to work around. Never goes away, and I think it's detrimental to the soil. I'm sorry I ever used it and it's a b**** to pull out. I roped my son into helping me - he's 6' 7" and a big guy - and he was having a hard time too! Now I do the newspaper/ cardboard/ mulch prep. instead. Maybe dump some compost or manure or something under it if needed.

Im looking at some of the naked roses to get rid of next year. Some I love the blooms but they just look crummy and I really don't want to spray. Neil Diamond. Twilight Zone. Double Delight. Heirloom. When I compare them to the healthy ones it's hard to justify keeping them.

Oh Dingo, that's sad to hear TZ isn't healthy. :( I really wanted that one. However, everything BSs and defoliates here, so it probably doesn't matter.

Dingo, another sub for Augusta Luise, though not quite as good as Sunset Dreams, is Crazy Love. Check the current thread about this rose. Patbama has a gorgeous one. I agree the AL would probably be too cold tender for your area. I think the hybridizers are trying for AL's look currently. Just a hunch. Diane

Dingo, I agree on the weed cloth. Terrible stuff. It doesn't kept the weeds out and it is too hard to work on the soil. It had kept the billions of bulbs from coming up. But cardboard will do that too.

Vaporvac I have 2 TZ - one is naked, one is sort of okay, I think it's the difference in sun, the naked one is between 2 other roses that shade it, so it may be okay for you.

Diane I need Crazy Love! Nice rose, and I'm sure it's a healthy one.

Two roses for me are getting the boot - White Dawn and Darlow's Enigma. The JBs just love DE. I'm tired of fighting them off. Also, both roses bloom in mid-June and that's it. No more blooms.

Welp, boncrow66, I went and did it didn't I? Hello, Harvey. :/

Bella your Darlow doesn't repeat? Is it the correct rose do you think, or is mine incorrect lol, it continues to bloom. The beetles were on almost every rose, but not so bad as last year it seems.

Nope. No repeat bloom. It is the correct rose. I purchased it a few years ago from I think, High Country Roses.

I wonder what's the deal with your DE. I grew one from a Burling band for a friend and it's been blooming up a storm all summer now that it's in the ground.

Well that's a bummer! I won't say this rose wows me, but it always has some flowers on it and it smells nice. Was thinking of moving it to more shade as others have posted nice pics of it doing well in dappled light. I think mine came from Heirloom. If you want cuttings let me know!

My guess is if it isn't re-blooming it is not Darlows Enigma. There are a couple of roses that have flowers like DE. I like High Country Gardens but have received incorrect varieties from them. I eventually stopped ordering from them for this reason. Last year I had to order again they were the only ones that listed Prairie Sunrise. They sent Golden Celebration.

Julie - My latest photo today of Crazy Love

Oops thats High Country Roses.

That's a beautiful rose! As for my DE, I'm digging her up and planting it in another part of the yard. She will be replaced by a hydrangea paniculata, either "Quickfire" or "Pinky Winky"

Crazy love is my kiND of of rose

Parry that is gorgeous! On my list for next year for sure!