Thank you Stephen this will come in handy.

It's been a while since this thread was active so I'm not sure how much interest there is anymore - it seemed to drop way off with the new generation. But I'll give it a go!

I have two 20-year-old pairs of Miele Novotronic W1918/T1515 stacked washer/dryers. These have been workhorses and I love them and am squeezing every last bit of life out of them. I really want laundry to continue to be simple, and I'm not at all excited about the computerization and increased complexity of a basic chore, though I'm capable of understanding it and using it correctly.

But one washer has finally died beyond hope of reasonable revival -- rear bearing went, would need new drum assembly etc. And one dryer, from the other set, is not drying anymore without multiple cycles. This could be a sensor issue, but I'm not sure how much to invest in repair after 20 years.

I guess that means it's time for replacement. I've decided on the WXR860 washer. I've read through this entire thread, all 991 posts, and by doing that have learned everything about the previous generation 860! But I was sad that this thread just stopped, because I would really love to hear some similar discussion specific to the newer generation. While I'm sure many things are the same (and I've taken a lot of notes!), there are some changes too.

So does anyone have any experience with or input into ways the WXR860 differs from the previous generation 860, or tips, or anything else helpful? For example I think it has something called Power Wash which is new. And SoftSteam. How do these work and any thoughts about when to use them? Have there been other improvements or changes to the actual washing capability? What does M-touch add besides ease of use -- can I use it to select Pre-wash plus other options, or do other things that weren't possible with the previous generation? I've read all the user manuals -- I'm looking for user experience to help me understand and get the most out of the washer.

I'm also undecided about the dryer. There are 3 dryer options. I'm trying to understand why I'd want to choose the TXR860 over the TXI680. I know the 860 has M-touch, but is that really worth $650? Are there other advantages to the 860? At least the 680 gives you steam, the option to use the fixed basket, and the window for your extra $200 over the 160, but $650 just for M-touch...?

I'd appreciate any advice or input!

M-touch on the dryer doesnt get you much beyond the lcd display and saveable presets. if you have little kids the lcd display can be locked preventing the machine from being turned off by little hands rotating the cycle selection knob to off.

other than that if is no different than the next model down. We skipped the lcd dsiplay model on the dryer. We did want the glass door to see in the dryer so we paid the upcharge for that. Rarely if ever use the soft steam function.

If you don’t desire the glass door and the steam function then going with the next model down saves more money. The drying technology is the same.

For the washer it is more nuanced. The 1st step down from the lcd display WXR-860 is virtually identical capability wise. The LCD display model allows for multiple presets to be saved with multiple ”extras”. Extras are things like pre-wash, water plus, allergy (hold water temp longer and extra rinse), extra rinse, etc etc. The next model down from the lcd display only allows a single extra item to be selected at the washer. if you want multiple tou must use the app.

The ability to lock the display is also nice if you have kids that like to play with the washer. We have the model with the rotaty dial and little kids. It is very frustrating to start a load and come back a couple hours later to see little hands had rotated the dial to off.

Other thn what I stated above the mechanicals are the same as the LCD display washer. As you move down the line the washers lose cycles, twi—dos dispensing, low spin speeds, lose the extra circulation pump used in powerwash, etc etc.

IntenseWash/PowerWash is the usa naming scheme for the version 1 and version 2 of this technology. Basically it uses a recirculation pump to spray clothes with the wash liquor (water/detergent mix) as it tumbles. Depending on the cycle it also alters the agressiveness of the wash action and the wash action itself. For example the drumm will spin on low speed as if to drain, but willnuse the recirculation pump to spray the clothes at the same time. This causes the wash liquor to be forced through the clothes.

The PowerWash cycles use less water hence the different wash action. If you set water plus extra to raise the wash water the powerwash is disabled. So it sort of depends on what you are washing. a few items/small load may do very well or better with power wash vs using a lot of additonal water in the main wash cycle. A large load may do better with increased water level.

There were changes in the Quick Intense wash cycle between the previous generation and the current. Many, myself included, feel the new 49 minute Quick Intensewash is inferior to the previous one. The current version increases wash time and drastically reduces spins and spin time. The previous 59 minute version did a quick spin inbetween each rinse and longer final spin. The new version eliminated the spins between rinses and the final spin was cut from about 4-5 minutes to barely one minute. It essentially gets up to the set rpm and then immediatly slows down. Clothes come out noticeably damper than the previous version. We always wind up running another drain/spin. This makes the cycle a little longer than the previous version.

Other than that the washers are very much similar. Minor changes to the cycles. The dial version (680/860) of the current washer puts the proofiing cycle on the knob and buries wrinkle free in the more options sub-menu. No one used proofing on a routine basis. Many people used wrinkle freered, which was mainly the normal cycle without the EPA energy controls. Whomever made this decision should be fired. The WXR-860 lets you arrange your most used cycles in the order you want.

Guess tou have to decide if the upcharge is worth it. My wife woshes we bought it due to the kids issues and the ability to save custom cycles. At the time I couldnt justify the upcharge. If it had fullt custom cycles like the professional models i would have paid. Since it is just picking existing cycles and saving the "extras" it was less interesting.

@luna123456 that's helpful, thanks.

I'm sorry to hear about the loss of functionality of QuickIntense wash, since I know from reading this thread that it was a favorite cycle for many people. Is there any way to roughly replicate the old QI program using other programs, extras, etc, without having to run a separate spin cycle?

Also is there a discussion of this issue somewhere that I'm missing?

Another question I thought of - is there any way to see a list of the default sequence of actions for each program? The manual for my W1918 had such a list, showing the number of rinses, spins, etc for each program. But I can't find anything similar for the W1 machines. The manual gives the water temp and spin speeds, but not the number and order of rinses/spins, much less the type of agitation or other features that distinguish each program. It's frustrating not to have detailed info about each program so I know what I would be choosing with each. I feel like this information must be available somewhere.

Thanks again!

Look at the manual for the WWH-860. it has most of it. The changes i listed above for the new model apply.

Someone on this board posted a cycle chart that has all of that info along with the default cycle time.

Quick Intense is still useful, just not as much as previously. Every wants a faster cycle. This was silly on Miele’s part. The previous version was better, but then I favor a better extraction and a little longer wash time vs an extended dry time.

Its not all doom and gloom. I am sure some like the shorter wash time, its just not me.

I have the WXR/TXR860 set and for the most part love them. I spent a little more to get the TOL versions because I really liked the idea of customizing and naming the various cycles. The TwonDos feature is awesome. It's so convenient and saves a lot of time. But don't feel like you need to use Miele detergents. I use Tide Ultra Stain Release Free and Ecover non-chlorine bleach and get brilliant results.

I figured if these are truly designed to last 20 years why not spend a little more and get the best models available. But that's just me. I don't regret my decision at all.

What are the cycles (and extras/options) you use the most on the WXR860? Aside from sheets and towels, we have a *lot* of synthetic high-tech fabric sportswear in our family, from golf shirts to more delicate sun shirts to yoga pants to riding breeches and much more. Some of this gets extremely dirty - as in actual dirt, like from working at a barn/farm! I mean a *lot* of dirt lol! In my old Miele I’ve always tended to wash this stuff with special sports wash, on Delicate with a pre-wash with Oxi-clean powder (which i put directly in the drum) which is very effective in getting dirt out. It has always seemed to work fine, But after reading through this thread I’m doubting myself that this is the best approach, and I don’t want to just continue to do the same thing I’ve always done with the new machine.

And also - for the cycles with multiple rinses (I did find the chart, thanks!), do most of them have spins between the rinses? Is there any way to tell besides standing and watching the machine run?

We also have a lot of synthetic sportswear and wash them in the sportswear cycle. It has a nice long wash cycle and does brief burst intermediate spins but still manages to thoroughly rinse everything. I use the prewash and extra rinse when I have an extra grubby load.

Nearly every cycle has intermediate spins. Usually they are several minutes long like in the normal, whites, sanitary and wrinkle-free cycles. Some are shorter burst spins like the spotswear, towels and table linen cycles. I haven't used every single cycle (it has 26) but I do remember the delicate-type cycles don't usually have them.

I never had a Miele washer before but it is louder when spinning (especially at 1600 rpm) than I thought it would be. The dryer is also a little louder than I expected.

Thank you for this helpful information! I'm adding it to my notes lol!

I am pretty much settled on the washer. But I still can't decide is whether M-Touch is worth the upcharge on the dryer... I keep going back and forth... It seems like such an excessive amount for basically just that one feature, and yet it is spread over the hopefully long life of the dryer. I'm worried that I'll end up loving the m-touch on the washer and wish I had gotten it on the dryer!

I struggled with the same decision but in the end decided to spend the extra money and get it so I wouldn't regret it later. I'm happy I did.

I'm sure you already knew this but Miele is having a President's Day sale and you can get $300 off their top tier pairs.

@littlebitdirty. I recently got my first Miele washer and dryer. I ordered the WXF660 WCS and TXI680 WP, but Miele shipped me the base model dryer. For the few months I waited until the right dryer came I found it annoying to have to deal with 2 different interfaces. It might be worth it to buy the M-touch model dryer just so your not always thinking "oh, the washer works this way, but the dryer works that way."

I've had two Miele washing machines, one of which I gave away and is still going great, and another that I sold in a Condo after 4 years of usage. The original one, that I gave away, now with a member of the family is STILL going strong, even after 18 Years of Age. Same with the Dryer.

I also have a Miele vacuum cleaner from 2012, and 2018, both Canisters, that operate as well as the day I bought them. As I tell people, really, you cannot go wrong with Oreck or Miele for a Vaccum Cleaner. I absolutely love both machines and have disposed of two Dysons in the periods of time I've had the Miele.

I also came very close to owning a Miele Dishwasher but decided to go with Bosch instead. I know several people with Miele's DW's as old as 1998/1999, and their units are still going strong, and far more advanced than other machines on the market.

I really couldn't recommend any brand more, than Miele for reliability and cleaning. While I absolutely love my Conventional Top Loader washer I've been using for the last several years, I do notice... I have to soak fabrics, and pre-treat complex stains, that I wouldn't normally have to, with the Miele... and a simple dose of Persil Powder.

I affirm all of that. Miele can't be beaten.

@Jim Hughes thanks for that! its something I was a little worried about too! I’ve pretty much decided to go with the M-touch dryer to match the washer.

But in your case - isn’t the WXI860 the matching washer for the TXI680 dryer? Or maybe the WXF660 and WXI860 have the same controls? The 4-washer, 3-dryer lineup is a little strange - though if you go to the UK site and see the 25 washers (or thereabouts), it’ll make our struggles to choose a model seem ridiculous lol!

@Laundry Mich my Miele dishwasher, like my washers and dryers, dates to 2002-2003 and still works great. I love it and have no desire to replace it with a newer model. I also have a Bosch dw in the basement - just as old but almost never used, literally 2-3 times a year - and I vastly prefer the Miele.

@littlebitdirty My TXI680WP dryer has the same 1-line LED/dial interface as both the WXF660 and the WXI860 washers. I made my choice based on the cheapest washer with TwinDos and a matching dryer. The set was still 3300 dollars (which is a few hundred dollars less than Miele's 2023 prices, although in 2022 I had to wait 6 months to get them from Germany). Perhaps it would have been worthwhile to buy the next level washer with the 2-pump intense wash, but so far I have no regrets.

Honesty, I think any Miele washer/dryer set - even their base models - are better then pretty much anything else available. I'm sure the high-end M-touch models will be great (but, having said that, when I showed my adult son a video of the M-touch interface he said all the swiping was like Tinder for clothes:)

Also, like you I have a ca. 2001 Miele dishwasher. i still use it nearly every day. If my washer and dryer last anyway near as long I'll be happy.

I just started getting water intake errors on my WXR860. It only happens when I use delay start on a cycle that has a prewash. The error happens about a minute or so into the cycle. I have used delay start many times with cycles that had a prewash and never had an issue. Very strange.

Has anyone else had this issue or know if Miele pushed out an update in the last few weeks?

i did start getting an intermitent water intake in the last week or two but only at the begining of a cycle - doesnt matter which one . No other water intake errors during the cycle . Miele tech coming wednesday

Trying to decide between the WXF660 and the WXI860. thethe main difference we are considering is the quick intense and extraextra recirculation pump (power intense). DoesDo people mostly use quick intense ssss. Instead of normal washwash? Is the recirculation pump saving a bunch of timtime on regular wash cycles?

Sorry for the weird text. Houzz keeps adding words when I typetype and I can't delete them.

@delray33483 I just got that water intake error too! Let us know what the tech reports.

@Laundry Mich

Sebo is better than Miele for vacuum cleaners. Many youtube videos explain why.

@Allen, I went with the 660 last spring and so far, no complaints I can't compare to the 860, but the price point is was put me with 660 as i wanted the twin dos which I love. Can not miss what you do not have. I think you would be happy with the 660, I know I am.

No new issues with WWF060. Have not seen water intake error after patch installed by Miele tech. Connected to wifi/remote update.

I cannot believe this issue keeps coming back for some people...mystery for sure.

I discovered that I will not get the error when I set the delay wash to start in 10 or 15 minutes (like when I am pretreating something). I previously got the error when the delay was set far enough in advance that the machine turns off. I never noticed it turning off before with delay wash but honestly I never checked. When it turns on to start it doesn't do the door window rinse when the cycle first starts and it almost seems like it doesn't know what to do with it having strange wash rhythms and not constantly tumbling while filling. About a minute later it will display the error and beep nonstop.

Everything else is working fine other than not being able to use bleach but I don't anyways.

evidently the cold water solenoid is sticky. When i use programs that use cold water there is a humming noise. The program can default if it sticks and doesnt allow enough cold water through in time. If the program calls for hot water then there is no problem .

I'm very close to buying this set. Live in Canada. Replacing a washer/dryer that's about 20 years old - nothing wrong with them, but we are remoddeling our laundry room and want something stackable, and I want something good that will last. Love the heat pump idea as I never use my dryer anyways except for towels due to how harsh they generally are on clothes. My main question is this - what is the service like in Canada? The W1/T1 combo, while currently on sale and with a 5 year warranty, is still a fair bit more expensive than the Bosch compacts and the usual LG/Electrolux stuff.

So far service has been good in Canada. Just be prepared for a clumsy website and long waits on hold while trying to get support. I have a service call tomorrow for my dishwasher so if I feel service has slipped I will report back. Oh, and every time they update the app they "new and unimprove" it! But that's a global thing, not just Canada.

To be fair the app has SIGNIFICANTLY improved over the last year or so. MOST of the original complaints have been resolved. They still have a few bugs to fix, but the app is very usable now. You just need to figure out the ”Miele” way and then it will all make sense.

I just received a msg on my washer that there is an update, has anyone done this, and if so, should we?

Does anyone know what the update is for? I do not have the app and am not inclined to get it.

Only way to possibly know is in the app. Miele doesnt always publish what the changes are. Sometimes they are updates to the wifi module if they change where their servers are hosted.

Sometimes it is firmware updates to tweak/fix problems with cycles.

Why dont you want the app?

I don't want the app because I don't like the pace society has become being "connected" all the time.

I enjoy doing laundry in our WXI860 and W1986. We also line dry outdoors when we can. Even my new Mercedes's functions border on distracted driving taking away from the pleasure of just driving

"There is no wifi in the woods but there is a better connection"

ok, upon checking my app, I have the 660, it is a softward update that says "Chlorine bleach flushing optimized" flushing of cholorine bleach through the i/chlorine compartment (pre-rinse compartment) has been optimized.

I guess this one could not hurt.

I try to avoid updating my app. The one time it happened I lost extra water on a few selections, and it also took away some higher temps on the a few of the programs.

Windsorwest - the only reason I use the app is you can get options on there that are not available on the machine. I prefer to not have things connected myself. I do not have the dryer connected. It is the only appliance that I do have connected. No lights etc.

Hi. I've had my 660 Washer and 680 Dryer for about 6 months now.. One thing I don't like is how all of the cycle information is divided into a bunch of different charts in the manual, so I'm making my own sorta quick start guide.

I have a few questions about detergent dispensing that I thought perhaps someone here could help with.

1. i know UP 1 is dispensed at the beginning of the main wash cycle. When is UP 2 dispensed? I saw a Miele Youtube video and the guy said it was dispensed 30 mins later. I can't believe this is correct.

2. When are the various Capsules dispensed? I am assuming they are dispensed at different times according to cap type.

Thanks for any help, and if anyone's interested I'd be happy to share my guide when I finish it.

^

@Jim Hughes I think it will be useful so please post. Wonder if it will change with firmware update.

Have you seen the cheat sheet for old Miele washers?

https://atticmag.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Atticmags-Private-Miele-Washer-Cheat-Sheet.pdf

@Jim Hughes you can hear the humming when the UP2 (and 1) dispense. i saw the video where the Miele guy said 30 min too. He is wrong. Surprise Surprise. i could also be wrong but i think it happens after the drenching phase ends (minute 8) for many cycles.

Would love to see your guide!

This was mine…

https://www.houzz.com/discussions/6310483/miele-w1-excellence-wxi860-estimated-cycle-times-w-options

@Jim Hughes For quick reference, I placed copies of the washer and dryer program charts in an to reach plastic binder. I too would love a copy of your more detailed guide once completed!

@jimhughes I too would be interested in you guide once compiled.

Thanks for all of your comments. @xstephen25, I have seen your time chart and was impressed with the amount of work that must have involved. Today is my laundry day so I paid attention to my first load and I think you are right - UP2 is dispensed 8 or 9 mins into a Normal program main wash cycle.

Anyway, here is a screenshot of the first page of my guide. It's still a work in progress. Pay no attention to all the MS Word nonsense, my final version will be a PDF.

It's just a rough draft, but let me know what you think.

Your opinion please. Some of my cotton shirts/ t shirts say ”delicate” on the label. i have been using wrinkle free cycle cold or 85 degrees with 1200 spin, 3 rinses. i tried the delicates cy le with 2 rinses and the results were not improved. Are the standard cycles gentle enough or is it advisable to also add gentle in the options. Prior to noticing gentle on the tag, I had not been selecting gentle and things have been ok but now after more closely reading the care tags I am worried i may have been on my way to ruining the shirts. Thank you for your opinins

I'm nearly finished with my W1 guide. Could anyone with an 860 tell me the default times for the Sneakers, Curtains and Starch cycles. These are the 3 cycles not available to me on my machine or app. Thanks.

@Jim Hughes My WXI860 does not have those 3 cycles on the machine and I do not have the app. For Curtains there is Table Linens/Drapes which defaults to 57 minutes. Let me know if I can be of further help.

Nor does my WWH860 have those cycles.

My WXR860 has the 3 cycles:
Sneakers 1:08h
Curtains 1:11h
Starch 0.28h

@Tucker Zoey Thanks for this!

Can you use the TwinDos system with non-Miele detergents?

Yes. If you haven't already figured this out, there are numbers of how-to-do-it posts here starting with the "Featured Answer" at the top of this thread. Because Houzz displays only part of the Featured Answer, you want to click on the faint "read more" line to get Houzz to display the rest of that detailed post by Luna123456.

Also, there are something like 1.1k additional posts in this thread, most of which are not initially displayed. On my computer, I have to display all the posts before I can do a full search of the thread. Houzz makes you look below the "Featured Answer" to find the fine print which currently reads "see 1037 more comments." You may have to click a "See more comments" several times to get Houzz to display all of the posts. Then you can do a terms search (CTRL-F calls up a search box on MS Windows computers.) That will get you the posts with recommendations on specific brands of detergents and oxy liquids to use with DIY refilling.

Can anyone tell me the minimum clearance in the rear of the dryer that you used? I have a small space, and the install guide says you can put it under a countertop which is 25", leaving 0" clearance. But then for a stacked setup, it says to have 2" in the rear. This doesn't make sense to me. I'd like to go with the 0 clearance. Thoughts?

The washer needs clearance in the back for the drain and supply hoses. The dryer does have a drain hose but it's very small in diameter.