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Are roses like 8 lifecycle year old shrubs

a1an
February 11, 2019
last modified: February 11, 2019

LOL. Rose Noob Here. Based on my past readings, seems like ya'll rip-n-replace with a different rose if/when it doesn't perform ?

I don't have the slightly clue how big, fast or bushy roses grow.

With a grafted root, if I bury the graft slightly, will I see more than than the 5-6 budded canes come up from the ground (in my mind, with a own root, new stems develop from the roots from time to time).

Moreso, as the roses become established and the primary 5-6 canes get older/thicker on the bottom, I often see roses in the neighborhood with growth/blooms on the top but no on the lower 2 feet ? Is this atypical of how roses grow ? I would prefer to not have *bare feet* as grows

Comments (13)

  • mad_gallica

    It depends. The big things it depends on are where in the world you are, and the type of rose you are talking about. Without that *extremely* basic information, it is impossible to say anything. Next would probably be the level of care you are willing to commit to.


  • a1an

    7A. I don't plan to spray unless I really ~ need to~. I try not to spray the vegs, and more often than not, if I know I will get some good soaking rain, I may pre-emptively spray just to mitigate things. Got kiddos that run around and touch everything under the moon, so I try to be as ~organic~ as possible.


    I'm pretty good at over-wintering mulch and all that sorta stuff....


    However, if the answer to the last question is that most blooms tend to not bloom on the thicker woody stems as they grown, than maybe it is dig/replant/rejuvintate sorta answer ?

    I would prefer the look at have blooms on the lower 24"

  • Amanda Zone10Socal

    you could get a variety that sort of drapes over or is more bushy. The hybrid teas seem to mostly bloom on the top. what kind of roses do you have?

  • a1an

    I don't have any. Ordered a bunch of DA. Looked at the multiflora/flora's, but the color was them did not appeal to me (looked like a bunch of skittles colors) wherea's the DA's seem to have a bit of depth to them

  • Amanda Zone10Socal

    I think they are mostly shrubs, have you done a google image search of the varieties you ordered to see what the grown up bushes look like?

  • K S 8b Seattle

    David Austin roses tend to be bushier than hybrid tea roses (those are, for the most part, taller and "leggier"). Some, however, blackspot rather badly, meaning that they also can shed leaves closer to the ground at some times of the year. Abraham Darby has always been very leggy for me, but it is hard to generalize about how a rose will react to a given situation. I also have Austin's Gertrude Jekyll, and she is very bushy for me in my no spray garden (she also gets some blackspot, but still maintains foliage). On the other hand, I have read other people's comments about Gert, and some find her to be very leggy and awkward. This is why we remove roses -- we try one and it doesn't work well for us or it isn't as wonderful as we hoped it would be, not because they wear out. (Although old canes can wear out -- we just prune them out and new ones typically take over). Underplanting roses with companion plants is another way to ensure that you don't have naked-looking plants. Lavender, penstemon, and Nepeta are popular. Some varieties and classes are better suited to no-spray cultivation than others. You can find some really nice bushes on some old garden roses (look at some Albas for example -- Felicite Parmentier) but be aware that some of these roses (like Felicite) only have one bloom per year (although it can be a long and spectacular period of bloom for some varieties). For modern roses, Kordes is know for breeding disease resistant roses.

  • Sheila z8a Rogue Valley OR

    As you get started a1an, you will gradually learn from experience. Paying attention to success from others on this forum in your area will be a huge help. The HMF roses website is a help with full plant/bush pictures so you can get more of an idea what varieties appeal to you. You can search in Garden web for varieties reports from members here in your area.

  • a1an

    We'll , I hope it won't be that much of a dud of a experiment. I am digging out some peonies and just transplanting somewhere else less focal .

    I love peony blooms, but they are so short lived. It's like they bloom, then a heavy spring storm comes 7-10 days after they bloom, and POOF, I'm stuck with foliage from spring going into hard frost. I'm looking to replace that look with hopefully some blossoming roses in this particular area . Need more eye candy

  • noseometer...(7A, SZ10, Albuquerque)

    Others have responded, but I’ll give you my take on your questions.

    >Based on my past readings, seems like ya'll rip-n-replace with a different rose if/when it doesn't perform ?

    Yes…and no. If a rose is not performing many of us take it out and try something else, since there is only so much room and many roses to try. BUT, how we define “not performing” is highly variable. Is it performing if it produces one flower the first season? Do you expect a rose bush to be covered with flowers all summer (if so, you’d be removing a lot of roses and getting very frustrated)? How long do you wait to see if a rose is performing? Many say 3 years, others will wait longer (I’ve waited 9 years for an orchid to bloom for the first time, and I’ve read of some rose growers who wait at least that long to see how it performs). Some people remove a rose that is not “performing” after a single season. Some people remove a rose that grows and blooms well, just because they don’t like the look of the plant/flower/thorns. But many of us also leave a plant that is not perfect for various reasons. First of all there is no perfect rose bush. We’ve got to accept that. Other times we might leave a rose because of sentimental reasons, or simply because it is so big that it would be a pain to remove.

    >I don't have the slightly clue how big, fast or bushy roses grow.

    It all depends on the variety of rose, and your climate. So when you describe your climate, USDA Plant Hardiness zones are only part of the picture. You will find that most people describe their location as well. Zone 7A could be high desert at 6500 feet elevation and 10 inches of rain and 5F lows in the winter and 105F highs in the summer (like me) or it could be in wet New Jersey. The same variety or rose may perform extremely differently when growing in these two climates. How big, fast or bushy? It all depends on the variety. Some roses grow no bigger than a few inches tall. Others can grow to more than 30 feet climbing in the trees. Some grow fast, some grow slowly. This depends on growing conditions as well as the variety.

    >With a grafted root, if I bury the graft slightly, will I see more than than the 5-6 budded canes come up from the ground (in my mind, with a own root, new stems develop from the roots from time to time).

    Not necessarily. How many canes come from the bottom (called “basal” growths or “basals”) is dependent upon the variety. It’s hard to make a rose that doesn’t make basals produce them. Some roses like Mr. Lincoln, seem to only want to produce one or two canes low down and then grow tall before branching much. An own-root Mr. Lincoln doesn't produce more basals than a grafted one, IMHO.

    >Moreso, as the roses become established and the primary 5-6 canes get older/thicker on the bottom, I often see roses in the neighborhood with growth/blooms on the top but no on the lower 2 feet ? Is this atypical of how roses grow ? I would prefer to not have *bare feet* as grows

    Again, this all depends upon the variety. This is why so many rose growers spend a lot of time researching a variety of rose before buying or planting. The best way to see, is to see a rose that is growing in your local area. There is MUCH more to a rose than how pretty the flower is. In general, those varieties like shrub roses and floribundas have foliage closer to the ground than the hybrid teas (not the same as tea roses by the way), but this is not always true. Some roses can be pruned to produce more branches low down. Others can not. I personally like seeing those tall tree-like roses with bare trunks just as much as the low bushy ones. Like crape myrtles, there are some tall ones with a lot of trunk, and there are short bushy ones. Keep asking questions, keep researching. Have Fun!

  • a1an

    Great replies. Going to re-read to digest it all

  • a1an

    Re: image search, I've been using instagram alot. When I google image search, I see MANY pics of zoomed in blossom pics. The ~gram~ at least gives me some more real life pics instead of marketing pics

  • HalloBlondie (zone5a) Ontario, Canada
    I do think based on your preferences for shape, size & flower style - Austin's would be a good starting point for you. I also love peony blooms, but agree they take up a lot of room for a week of flower power a year. I think the old fashioned looking roses are a great alternative with more bloom time. If you narrow your preferences down, ie. certain colours or sizes you want to keep to, then people here will be very helpful with suggestions. I live in a high black spot area and have numerous Austin's that are not to bad for fungal problems. I don't spray. Kordes roses tend to be very clean & healthy here as well. I do have my eye on a few that do get black spot, and may remove them if they continue to not be healthy enough. Planting them in ideal sun locations is key for avoiding spraying. For example, roses are cleaner here if they receive morning sun. Roses that are in morning shade will have more moisture on them and can easily develop black spot.
  • K S 8b Seattle

    Re: image search, Sheila mentioned Helpmefind -- it is an amazing resource. Their images are crowd sourced from gardeners, and most roses listed will have a bush shot or two in the image section for that variety. Definitely give it a try when looking for bush pictures. The images don't come up on google image search -- you usually need to go to the rose's helpmefind page to access them.

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