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nick_roy45

Whole house renovation/addition lighting design

5 years ago

Adding on to house and remodeling entire main floor. Almost all spaces are changing and that means a new lighting layout throughout. Wondering what everyone thinks of the proposed layout below? Not sure if kitchen lighting will be adequate, as well as master bedroom (bedside lamps used as well).


Legend is as follows:


Blue circle - recessed light - LED, wide spread

Green circle - flush mounted light, chandelier, drum light, etc.

Red star - ceiling fan/light combination (fan only in living room)

Yellow diamond - Wall sconce

Purple circle - Pendant light


We will also be adding under cabinet counter lighting, of course. Also, the living room is vaulted and the rest of the house is 8' ceiling.


Thanks.



Comments (26)

  • 5 years ago

    I think the fan in the back entry will be hard to fit and actually work as a fan.


    The can lights in the kitchen seem a little random to me. What is your intention with those? I'd want the light to provide light for someone standing and working at the stove or counter, rather than shine at the top of their head and highlight them. Either place the lights so they provide task lighting or so they provide general lighting, but not spotlighting the top of a head as the shadows when working will be distracting.

  • 5 years ago

    Actually, the fan in the back entrance is already there and works good for some additional air movement between up/down.


    As for the kitchen recessed lights, I should say that the leftmost cabinets will actually be a full depth pantry, which is why we kicked the light out - same with for the fridge. The other two are on either side of the sink, which we thought along with the pendant, would give adequate light. We originally had two lights, one on either side of the stove, but that seemed like they were to close to the others. We were also told that range lighting would come mainly from the range hood.


    That being said, we are posting here for advice so if there is a better way to arrange it, we are certainly interested in hearing!

  • 5 years ago

    @itsourcasa - Thanks for the info and ideas. If you want to share your floor plan/layout, we would love to see it!

  • 5 years ago
    last modified: 5 years ago

    I second adding 4 can lights in the master and also adding 2 in the secondary bedrooms. Our current master is 12.5'x14.5 and has 2 cans plus a fan with light kit. The lighting is great. I wish our secondary bedroom at 11.5'x11' had the two extra cans. It only has a fan with a light.

    In our new build, our master will be 14'x18' with 5 cans plus a fan with light and the secondary bedrooms will be 13'x11' with 2 cans and fan with light.


    John Adams thanked cd7733
  • 5 years ago

    Thanks @cd7733 - In the second and third bedrooms, if the headboards will be on the outside walls (left and right), does that can placement make the most sense? Also, are the cans and fan light on separate switches or the same?: Thanks again.

  • 5 years ago

    In the new build secondary bedroom cans are along the length of the room and will be, eventually, over beds (have little ones in twins and will be in a corner, not centered). The cans and fan/light will be on separate switches. You could easily swap the placement in your setting, if you feel that would be a problem.


    John Adams thanked cd7733
  • 5 years ago

    I can try to find ours and post it later tonight. We decided not to do recessed lighting in the kids and guest bedrooms, just a single light/fan in the center and a plug that hooks up to a switch for a lamp.

    Another thing I thought of is to ask them about adding a switch for a garbage disposal and running electrical underground for the kitchen island if it's not already there.

  • 5 years ago


    The range should have a light in the hood; a recessed light over a s.s. hood will be reflected back on the ceiling. The recessed lights at counters are properly located but they should be adjustable so they can be aimed at the work surface.

    At a sink I prefer two recessed lights directly above and at the sides of the sink.

    Why do the recessed lights have wide beams? That's usually only necessary if the fixtures are farther apart.

    A pendant light over the tub will not meet the National Electrical Code.

    Locate recessed lights carefully when they are near a ceiling fan to avoid moving shadows. I would use adjustable recessed lights to light the walls not the floor.

    I find lights in the center of bedroom ceilings and on the bottom of any ceiling fans to be unpleasant. A bedroom should have reading lights adjacent to the bed but maybe no one reads anymore.


    John Adams thanked User
  • 5 years ago

    Here is what I'd do:

    1. In the kitchen you don't need a light in front of the stove because your hood will have lights in it. You don't need a light in front of the fridge because when you open the fridge it has a light.

    You do need lights on either side of the stove for prepping, on either side of the sink and in front of the pantry as you have it.

    2. In the dining room, if you have a good chandelier over the dining table and put it on a dimmer, that should be all the light you need.

    3. 6 lights and a ceiling fan/light in the living room really is overkill, especially since in a living room you should have some table lamps for reading etc.

    4. I think you need some dimmable recessed lights in the master bedroom.

    5. In the hallway, I think you need a third light as it's a hallway with no natural light.

    6. I personally would put recessed lights in the laundry instead of one semi flush mount. I find I need good lighting to see stains, etc.

    7. In the bathrooms, you can't put a hanging fixture over a tub unless the bottom of the fixture is a minimum of 8' from the top of the tub. That's code.

    Additionally I would add an additional light because bathrooms are the one place one needs light for putting on makeup, shaving, etc. I actually put a recessed light over each sink as well as the wall sconces on either side of the mirror.

    John Adams thanked cpartist
  • 5 years ago

    Thanks a lot @cpartist, appreciate the suggestions!

  • 5 years ago

    The yellow highlighted ones are the ones I referred to as lighting someones head. I'd move the two by the sink so they are over the countertop on each side of the sink and then change the stove one to have one or two lighting the walkway/corner in the kitchen. I don't think the one by the fridge is an issue it provides light for the walk area and allows you to see to clean there too.

    John Adams thanked lyfia
  • 5 years ago

    Aligning recessed fixtures on the edge of the counter is the best location if the fixtures are adjustable (i.e. they can be aimed). Simple down lights would not be appropriate in front of cabinets but a pair of them would be OK at each side of the sink but not much beyond the side edges of the sink.; the light patterns should overlap.

    However this approach often puts a scallop of light on upper cabinets. I usually avoid that by pulling the lower cabinets out 6" from the wall but I still align adjustable fixtures with the counter edge.

    John Adams thanked User
  • 5 years ago

    Here is where we are at, as of now. We are wondering if the area circled in red, needs lighting? Additionally, we want to ensure the kitchen is adequately lit - as previously mentioned, there will be under-cabinet lighting as well.




  • 5 years ago
    last modified: 5 years ago

    Everyone has a different idea of what lighting should do and how to do it. I believe the goal should be to emphasize what is being lighted rather than the light fixtures. That was difficult and expensive in the 60's and 70's but improvements in lighting fixtures now allow that to be done at a reasonable cost but good lighting will never be cheap.

    After 50 years of struggling with residential lighting issues I have settled on first using recessed lights (down, adjustable or wall-washer as appropriate) to light task surfaces, then walls, then open areas (with the latter switched separately).

    I never put a light at the center of a bedroom ceiling or on the bottom of a ceiling fan. When a ceiling fan is required, I use the ceiling hugger type. I like to put wall lights at the sides of beds unless there is more than one bed location or a client has another preference.

    I use as few pendants over islands as possible with hidden or obsucred lamps and, if necessary, add small recessed pin spots between them.

    I don't know why a recessed light would be in a utility room or why a tub or shower would not have a light. When task, and special use lighting is adequate my clients often like to add decorative surface fixtures but hopefully they don't clutter up the ceiling or detract from the design of the house.



  • 5 years ago

    Oops, I do agree the tub and the shower need a light over it. My bad. But I'd keep the overhead light fixture too.

    While I almost always agree with RES, in this case I disagree with some of his choices. (I do like the idea of using cans that can be directed though)

    I also agree about maybe putting some bedside lights, either as sconces or lamps.

    Wall washers are ok but they don't take the place of overhead lighting. For example, if I'm sitting in the living room, I don't need my walls lit, I need my seating area lit.

    As for the kitchen, your layout is similar to mine, and so is the lighting I suggested. Along with under counter lighting, it works well. I would probably make the cans so they are a bit more over the counter, but not too far in that they wind up lighting the upper cabinets.

    My ceiling fans do have lights on the bottom and I find them a great help to bring extra light into the room when needed.

    How large a space between the island and the dining table is the circled space?

    One other thing is will you have enough lighting for the stairwell? I have an overhead on the landing as well as 2 sconces going up the staircase.


    John Adams thanked cpartist
  • 5 years ago
    last modified: 5 years ago

    @cpartist - Thanks! The space between the dining room table and the kitchen island is approximately 8'. Also for reference, the dining room is 17' wide (left to right in drawing).

  • 5 years ago

    I agree, in such a large space I'd probably add two high hats in the circled area.

  • 5 years ago

    Oh I absolutely would also put either a high hat or some sort of fixture over the kitchen sink.

  • 5 years ago
    last modified: 5 years ago

    Most people think of a house as a floor plan and recessed lighting as a convenient way to illuminate it.

    However, if you design enough houses you will eventually learn the importance of the third dimension that contains the walls and how lighting walls can transform a space.

    You can learn it now or you can learn it later.

  • 5 years ago

    I like wall sconces on switches for the master bedroom instead of table lamps on a night stand. In addition, I suggest a remote control for the master bedroom fan/light.

  • 5 years ago

    I do not believe that six cans and a lighted ceiling fan is overkill for your living room, so I would add back in the ones you removed. I have 11 cans plus a center chandelier, and lighted built-ins (and lamps of course) in my family room. My room is 20x20. The more lighting you have, the more control you have on mood and atmosphere as long you have dimmers on specific groupings of lights. Most homes I’m in are completely under lighted and also have dark blank areas with no lighting at all. My husbands study which is 16x16 has 6 cans and a central chandelier and the room has ample lighting (not overkill at all). All my lights are on dimmers.


    I would also add two cans directly above the head of your master bed. Comes in handy when you need to read or look closely at anything while in bed. Of course I would still have lamps or sconces by/on night tables, but they will not give you the kind of light you might need for reading or close viewing etc while in bed. Also advise having additional switches by your bed to control all your lights. When you’re all comfy it’s nice not to have to get up to turn off your ceiling lights.


    And even though your secondary bedrooms are not that large, my suggestion would be to add 4 cans (in addition to the central ceiling fixture) because I would want more even lighting than 2 cans can provide (would make sure everything is on a dimmer)


    One thing I would consider is smart lighting which actually helps to cut down on the necessity for hardwired 3 and 4 way switches. When we built our home I had the electricians put 3 and 4 ways EVERYWHERE which was an added expense and the wall switch plates got very crowded with so many switches. After living there for a while we started to add in Lutron Caseta smart dimmers and found that it would have been much less expensive (and much simpler) to have single pole switches installed by our electrician and just replace that standard wall switch with the Caseta dimmers. With these single pole dimmers you can purchase tiny remotes and put them anywhere (you can have a 10 way switch if you choose by placing multiple remotes wherever you want). Lutron does have smart dimmers for 3 way switches, but they are more expensive and replacing the original switches gets a little more convoluted. So....wherever you think you need a three way switch, consider doing a simple single pole and use the Lutron Caseta’s with their remotes. You can even have your electrician install the Caseta’s initially instead of the switches he may be planning on providing. There is also an app which enables you to control all the lights remotely on your phone, set up schedules, etc. That will require their hub which is around $100, but the dimmers and remotes do not need the hub to operate.

  • 5 years ago

    Thanks everyone - we are working with your suggestions to make some changes to the lighting plan. Also trying to consider where the switches will be and which lights will be on which switches!

  • 5 years ago

    LED recessed lights throw a very sharp shadow so its very important to place 2 of them at the sink so the beam cones overlap and light the sink below your hands. I would center them on the counter 3 to 4 ft apart depending on the beam spreads. Other parts of the kitchen can benefit from reflect light but at the sink the light needs to be direct.

    Very high color temperature LED lighting is not good for your eyes so use a warm color temperature. I specify 2700K.

    John Adams thanked User
  • 5 years ago

    @User - We are definitely partial to warm color temperatures when it comes to LED lighting. The window in front of the kitchen sink is 6' wide so there is certainly room to have the lights 3-4 feet apart lighting the sink. Thanks again.

  • 5 years ago

    My husband and I did a similar renovation. I was surprised by the number of lights that were installed. It seemed like overkill at the time. However, with dimmers and Lutron lighting, I have to say that we’ve been really pleased with the results.
    I assume you’re going to include under eave lighting outside your house.
    Also, just a thought, but while you’re at it, have you thought about whole home surge protection? If you have electricians in already, maybe this would be a good time to do this. (A recent storm in our area resulted in a power surge. Our neighbours had blown light bulbs, fried microwaves, furnace damage and appliance damage.)
    Best wishes with your renovation!

    John Adams thanked B T