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The World's Most Unusable Bathroom: Vol. 2

J. Link
14 days ago

Hi All,

You were all so helpful in getting us to this point in our layout journey. We are still between 2 options: basically one with a door to the bedroom and one without. As a reminder and for newcomers, here is the existing bathroom- no shower, no storage.



Here are the two plans we are between. Many of you had expressed a disdain for a shared doorway into the master bedroom, but I'm wondering why exactly that is. Our home is very strange in that the larger bedroom (with larger closet) is right off of the front door and living room, so in no way is this bedroom ever "private." We were thinking that the connection between a bedroom and a bathroom would be a halfway "fix" to this odd layout, by at least creating an official master, so the functionality of these rooms is improved. As far as (our rare instance of) overnight guests go, it would be a little bit of an inconvenience to close two doors before using this bathroom, but is that more of an unideal situation than having to walk outside the bedroom, into the hallway, past the dining room and back into the bathroom to get to the shower? There is a greater chance of a run-in doing that.

All of this would, however, come at the cost of storage and a larger vanity in the actual bathroom. A 60" vanity JUST BARELY fits, which means we're looking at custom if we don't want it to look squished, and there just aren't many out of the box options for 56" vanities. I'm also afraid that it will appear undersized in the bathroom itself. The larger vanity will provide more storage and more counterspace, and perhaps look more in scale to the bathroom, BUT then there is no layout improvement to the direct entrance to the bedroom.

Please give me your harshest thoughts with these. This bathroom is going to be a major renovation for us, and alot of money, and I don't want to get it wrong!!





Here is the bedroom that this door will open from, very much "on display" To your left in the tiled area, is the front door.



Sorry about the chair with the clothes on it.. everyone has one of those, right?


ADD THE DOOR
NO DOOR, BIGGER VANITY

Comments (93)

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    12 days ago

    @suzanne_m Do you mean you like the toilet closer to the tub? I think that is my favorite way as well. I mocked this up and you are correct, the door will not allow the toilet to be in the corner, and i'd like to if possible keep this existing door as is. I don't think i'll be able to do a pocket door because there is a vent right to the left of that door, and i'd also like to avoid touching that.

    OH yes, I didnt draw in the shower head and stuff but it would be on the left.

  • suzanne_m
    12 days ago

    I actually was saying the vanity being beside the shower. I gave 2 reasons but the 'real' one was that you are standing in front of a vanity when you get out.

    Mind you, that if you keep the same door, then being able to fully open it outweigh by far the advantage of having more room when you get out of the shower.

    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
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  • suzanne_m
    12 days ago

    One thing you might consider but I don't know if it works because you are very tight in term of inches to save here and there in the guest bathroom but I wonder if you can put the two toilets on the same location on the shared wall. That should save money on plumbing. However, this would mean to get a smaller door or a pocket door.

    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago

    I could, but it would definitely lead to less efficient layouts. I'm trying to brainstorm of the is any layout that keeps the public toilet where it is, but it seems like it puts the tub in a strange place.

  • Nancy in Mich
    10 days ago

    I will vote a hard YES to the two bathrooms. I like the one shower and one tub/shower combo solution very well, if the shower is 48x36. If it is 48x32, it will feel a little tight to me and 48x30 is too tight.

    AprilNeverEnds, your mom needs these door hinges. It should be a fairly easy replacement.

    https://www.amazon.com/Expandable-Hinges-Wheelchair-Rollator-Accessibility/dp/B0009STNNS

    J. Link thanked Nancy in Mich
  • suzanne_m
    10 days ago

    You know better what is best for you but I can't resist giving my opinion on the direction you are going. Imo, by far Karenseb 's layout is the best. You said that you don't want to touch the floor but the way Karen laid it out is that your beautiful can stay intact. You will just have more of that beautiful floor inside your new closet (plus that new closet is bigger the one you currently have). By having 2 bathrooms you make the one that you use daily very tiny for your occasional guest to have a private tiny one too. Also, Karen's layout keeps the toilet in its original location. To me it is a win-win, it is a lot cheaper and the bathroom is more spacious for you to use daily.

    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago
    last modified: 10 days ago

    @suzanne_m

    I definitely appreciate looking at reworking this entire part of the house. It isn't possible though.. I have already spent money to outfit that closet with an organization system which included moving outlets and light switches out of that space. I had also upgraded the french doors with hardware and panels that fit my style. All of this work so far had been DIY, so it was alot of blood sweat and tears to just work with the layout that was there. These items are what turn me away from considering reverting the plan back to the way it (likely) was prior to someone else's renovations. I don't care for the bathroom tile at all, and its also been ruined by someone not cleaning it properly, so the whole surface is etched and porous, and would probably need to be refinished. There is a bunch of crown molding in the bedroom and closet that would also need to be reworked.


    5x8's are normal sized bathrooms, so they are only tiny compared to the gigantic 'powder room' that it is now.. right? If I did run with the 1-bathroom plan, it would absolutely have to keep the entrance to the bedroom where it is, and if that is the case, does that change your mind about the experience of walking out around all the public areas to get to the bathroom?

    (I have been trying to do minor DIY upgrades in the 5 years i have lived in this home, so reworking the entire floor plan was never on my radar as an option.. :/ )

    What are our thoughts on this?

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago
    last modified: 10 days ago

    So actually you would be voting for the plan originally shown (more or less) with the vanity fully extended

  • emilyam819
    10 days ago

    You know I vote for two baths :)

    J. Link thanked emilyam819
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago

    I guess I'm just saying it's alot more work than it seems to change the bedroom entrance and much of it is undoing prior work to facelift the existing layout :/

  • aprilneverends
    10 days ago

    You did it yourself? Chapeau!

    Second vote for two baths

    If possible of course. You know much better than us what you're willing to spend in terms of money, energy, and time.

    J. Link thanked aprilneverends
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago
    last modified: 10 days ago

    @aprilneverends my dad visited for several days and laid the tile, and did the moving of the electrical over the course of a few weekends. (he lives a few hours away and still works FT so I don't like to rely on him too much) We demoed and painted and did everything else more cosmetic ourselves. I have become quite a pro at installing outlet and switches :p But that also means everything takes 3x as long lol. We could do the same with the bathroom but someone would definitely have to come in and do the plumbing, waterproofing, and the "hard stuff".


    I have anxiety every day about if I made a serious of small mistakes over 5 years by thinking modest and working with what was there. For that, I'm super glad to hear all of your comments that have made me consider thinking out of the box type plans.

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago
    last modified: 9 days ago

    Another point perhaps worth mentioning is that we assume that this home is not our "forever home". Mostly on account of being on a main busy road, so so schools and a backyard unfriendly to kids) We have tossed around the idea of keeping the property and possibly renting it. (mostly because we did put alot of DIY into it and would like to know it remains maintained /passive income etc)

    That would be a sound argument for 2 bathrooms if it were roommates rather than a family. It was too funny because @emilyam819 didn't even know that part upon her suggestion


    That being said, I totally get the argument that this one bathroom would not be shared except on rare occasions, which was where we started the post on whether there is a connection or not. Maybe 5x10 bathrooms are smaller than I think. Do any of you have them and hate it?


    Thanks all for chiming in. I do consider each and every response.. Trust me!

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    10 days ago
    last modified: 9 days ago

    Also I did this.. Do you think I'm crazy yet?


    For reference.. Closet system and crown





    Door detailing /wood floor to recreate with a relocated br door

    And we have to hope there is 6 more inches of wood floor under this wall to replicate the detail


  • Karenseb
    9 days ago

    I can see why closing off the bedroom to the entry hall is a no go.

    Personally, I really like the way your bed looks on that wall in your bedroom and I vote for a plan that keeps the bed there! Love your two closets. How clever.

    Two baths would be nice, but if the expense is too great, I think one bath would certainly work.

    The difference between the distance from the hall way or a new door entry to the toilet at night is not that great. For privacy, an entrance from the bedroom is nice, but I am not a big fan of shared bathrooms with two entrances. It might work in your case since you are not sharing with a whole family (like someone I knew). If you decide on an entry door from the master bedroom, I would try to do a 28 inch or 30 inch door. Skip one of the nightstands if you have to.

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    9 days ago
    last modified: 9 days ago

    Thanks! The closet system is Ikea Pax. We scribed trim pieces and painted them out to appear built in. (another example of blood sweat and tears for modest projects) the former closet was just a single bar across, and the small nook was just stationary shelves.


    There is an outlet pretty nearby that corner which is probably going to set the size of the door. I'll have to check on the size of the wall that remains in the model. The current bed size in the photos is a full. Partner's feet hang off the bottom lol so he wants to upgrade. I like it best on the side wall as well..

  • Val B
    9 days ago

    Hi - I haven’t read the comments, but if this were my house, I would move the entrance to the master bedroom to where the closet is now (the area marked in blue below) and but a closet where the existing bedroom is located now (marked below in red). I really dislike using bathrooms with 2 doors. This way, you don’t have to pass the living room to get to the bathroom, the bathroom has more storage, and the room is more private overall.

    J. Link thanked Val B
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    9 days ago

    @Val B Oof, sorry Val B.. This was probably the way the house was originally set up, but there are lots of obstacles preventing me from reconfiguring the entrance. If you scroll up just a few comments I have some photos. I also retiled the hallway that the french doors open up to, and making that a wall would mean cutting that floor. But I appreciate the feedback about the 2-door bathroom. If the entrance stays as is, does that change your mind about the experience of walking around the living room to get to the bathroom?

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    9 days ago
    last modified: 9 days ago

    Upon further investigation I still don't think I can make the guest bathroom work. I seem to be short 8". The overall length is 7' 2". I can't see how I can make this layout work with the code of keeping the sink drain 15" away from the corner wall. .. Help..

  • emilyam819
    9 days ago

    18” pedestal sink?

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    9 days ago

    If "offset flanges" do what I think they do, I might be able to move the existing toilet over 3", which buys me enough space for the 60" vanity in the original layout, with the double entry. I don't know if it is now silly to spend that much money on a 2nd bathroom for 18" pedestal, or a narrow tub? Is this a major dealbreaker? Or still worth the 2nd bath?

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    8 days ago

    The other option would be to do a narrow tub, but that seems to be moving farther away from functional as well, and possibly hard to find.

  • aprilneverends
    8 days ago

    It wouldn't be a major dealbreaker for me, but I'm from Europe and everything there is half-size from what it is here, so I'm in constant state of cultural shock twice a year)) Here, I have quite a small kitchen, normal tub, etc, etc, and when I come back it seems to me everything is huge, and one can bathe in the kitchen sink...

    "a question of adjustment of the lens"

    What I do worry about, looking at the pictures-the width of that dividing wall. Having experienced myself problem with framing..has to be calculated very well..and no mistakes, not even half an inch. I 'm not in your place of course, it might be the space is sufficient. Just make sure it is.

    J. Link thanked aprilneverends
  • suzanne_m
    8 days ago
    last modified: 8 days ago

    After you mentioned that a 8'x5' bathroom is standard, it made me check my own bathroom and it is 9'x5. So you are right, an 8'x5' is not as tiny as I thought. I must say however that what I didn't like about the other layout is that you have only 3'2" in front of the vanity for you to stand in the bathroom that you use daily. The bathroom with the tub has exactly the same layout as mine.

    The layouts below have pros and cons. I thought it was worth showing it to you:

    Pros:

    - more space in front of the vanity in your own bathroom

    - 60" vanity

    - feels overall more spacious

    - 24" vanity in the guest bathroom

    Cons:

    - bathroom door is in the middle of the wall where you currently have your bed

    - need to steal 6" from the guest bedroom

    - guest bedroom door is moved

    - guest bedroom closet is close to the entrance

    I don't know if you see it as a pros or cons but the guest bathroom is more private.

    The second layout is very similar to the first one. It just gives you more space in front of the vanity and more storage but the shower is smaller.




  • J. Link
    Original Author
    8 days ago
    last modified: 8 days ago

    Hmm it's a good brain storm, but I don't think the hallway door can be reconfigured. If I'm understanding your drawings correctly, the bedroom door would be from the dining room, or you close off the hallway early, and are extending the carpet into the new area.. If we had dinner guests, (pre covid this was regular) they would have to go through a bedroom to get to a toilet. Interesting idea to turn the whole thing 90 degrees though!

  • suzanne_m
    8 days ago
    last modified: 8 days ago

    The new door would be here where the red circle is and the guest closet would be where the blue circle is:


    EDIT: I think I drew the wall behind your closet on the layouts above in the wrong location. It should have been more towards the South, like this:


    Ok. I just remember now that you said that it was the only bathroom you have. I understand that this would not work.

  • suzanne_m
    8 days ago

    BTW, do you have a powder room somewhere on the first floor?

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    8 days ago

    Gotcha now. Nope, I labeled everything on that overall floor plan. This bathroom is the only one.

    There are almost equal pros and cons for the 1 large vs 2 small:

    Large:

    Pros:

    • More spacious
    • Less expensive
    • Double entrance(?)
    • Larger vanity

    Cons:

    • Double entrance (?)
    • Feels "vast" or inefficient with the extra floor space and slightly cramped vanity and otherwise standard sized fixtures (with door) This problem is alleviated without the door, but then there is no door.
    • would have to have a tub

    2 small:

    Pros:

    • True master
    • Good for future renters / people who desire a "kids bathroom"
    • Can phase project into two parts if we have to

    Cons:

    • More expensive
    • smaller footprints and fixtures for twice the money
  • aprilneverends
    8 days ago

    At this point, I'd talk to several GC's..maybe it's not twice the money if you try to move plumbing as little as possible. They get to work a bigger project after all, maybe will have its appeal.

    More fixtures-yes..one can try and save on them some (which is what we did but it was such a PITA that I hesitate to recommend it. )

    J. Link thanked aprilneverends
  • ital mover
    8 days ago

    I highly recommend doing a photo search here on houzz or a general search on google for toilettes or salle des bains in Paris apartments. Most are small but very functional and attractive

    J. Link thanked ital mover
  • suzanne_m
    8 days ago
    last modified: 8 days ago

    I cannot say I like it that much. Just consider it as more brain storming. The advantages I see with that one is that when you have guests, you can lock the door between the tub area and the toilet/vanity area. Your guests would have only one door to deal with and they will enter in a room that resembles more of a powder room. If you have guests that stay over night, you can give them access to the tub area. Both rooms are spacious. The toilet stays in its original location. The only true disadvantage is that you have to look at 3 doors on a daily basis (but since there are only wo of you, you won't need to deal with them as you can just keep them opened):


    EDIT: The more I look at it the more I like. I think what I like the most about it is that your guests who don't stay overnight will go to a 'powder room' instead of a full bathroom. It is also one of the least expensive option. The only thing is that it is a layout that you may find strange at first but I think the functionality and the cost of the renos outweigh the first impression you can have. I have friends who have a similar setting and they love it. Only one toilet to clean :).

    I forgot to mention that it is possible that you need to steal few inches (maybe 2-4) from the guest bedroom to clear the window where the tub is.

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    8 days ago

    I have two developments.. 1 is that there is this offset 24" sink that has some counter space and meets the 15" requirement.


    https://www.lowes.com/pd/Swiss-Madison-St-Tropez-Glossy-White-Ceramic-Wall-mount-Rectangular-Bathroom-Sink-with-Overflow-Drain/1002434384?cm_mmc=shp--c--prd--kab--google--pla--130--sosbathroomandpedestalsinks--1002434384-_-0&placeholder=null&gclsrc=aw.ds&ds_rl=1286981&gclid=Cj0KCQiA7NKBBhDBARIsAHbXCB4fntK8zSI8SrLC1kj22-ENjddpYX47req4MBkfT6UXRSDPtBxJxm8aAno-EALw_wcB


    Two is that a 54" tub can work in the guest room, buying the master 6 more inches. Since the tub is only for babies anyway, the length of it doesn't really matter, and the width remains standard, so it still functions as a shower.

  • Sara S
    8 days ago

    I’m not sure this is a better idea for a two bathroom layout, but it the sprint of dreaming up options:

    If you are up for switching the guest bedroom closet side, you could do some type of division that’s not a simple rectangle. This makes it a little easier to have your open floor space more consolidated so gives a more open feel to the master bath.

    J. Link thanked Sara S
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    7 days ago

    Here is an updated plan with offset sink an d 54" tub:



  • suzanne_m
    7 days ago
    last modified: 7 days ago

    That could work but I think I would put the 1'5" between the tub and the toilet as it is tight to reach for the faucet and also if you bath a toddler you will be really close to the toilet. You might consider putting a 24" door to see less of the toilet.

    I like the offset sink where you get a little bit of a flat surface as a counter top.

    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
  • Sara S
    7 days ago

    What kind of door are you planning for MB shower? If it’s a sliding door, then it might be nice to go one step wider for the shower (and steal a little more from the guest closet), so the shower opening gets larger. Or maybe you’re planning for it to have a swing open door towards the window, in which case it can be larger then half the width of the shower.

    J. Link thanked Sara S
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    7 days ago

    @Sara S I actually would be open to either. I'm good with a swing door if it keeps the other closet in tact, good point about the width!

  • Karenseb
    6 days ago

    I think it looks good and would move the toilet a little closer to the vanity also as suggested by Suzanne.

    I would also make the master bath 5 feet wide and take the extra 3 inches and add it to the hall bath to give you more room in front of the toilet. I would go for a 28 inch door if possible.


    J. Link thanked Karenseb
  • suzanne_m
    6 days ago
    last modified: 5 days ago

    To help free the counter top on the hall bathroom, I would put tiny shelves where you have an empty space. Guests can put their tooth brushes, tooth paste, hair brush etc.

    Make sure the left wall is thin (like just a giproc sheet) so you get at least 6 in. wide shelves. I would not make them too deep to make it easier to grab things and to clean.


    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
  • J. Link
    Original Author
    5 days ago
    last modified: 5 days ago

    @Karenseb @suzanne_m as a reminder the master bath is on the right.. I am working off of standard tub sizes on the left and went with 54". (is there anything else between 60" tub and 54?)

    That is driving the width of the guest bath on the left. Love the idea of shelves. A little nervous about them since they would be part of our DIY scope.....

  • suzanne_m
    5 days ago
    last modified: 5 days ago

    I am not completely sure about making the hall bathroom 5'0" as I like to have more room in front of the vanity and when you get out of the shower in the bathroom you use daily but both options have pros and cons.

    If you choose to make your hall bathroom few inches wider, I would also move the tub to the left. Not only you will have more space in front of the toilet but you would also have more space when you get out of the tub or when you bath a toddler. By moving the tub, your wall shared with your master ensuite vanity could be deeper. That could be a good place to add a deep niche with multiple shelves where you can place shampoo but also small toys for toddlers.

    You might also consider to put the drain of the shower in a place where you don't stand directly over it when you shower. It is more comfortable to the feet.

  • Karenseb
    5 days ago

    I was thinking that the master bath would be 5 feet wide ( that is a standard width, but more is always better).

    Your hall bath would be 3 inches less than standard at 4 feet 9 inches.

    As Suzanne said, the 54 inch tub would be pulled left to the left wall and you would have a 3 inch dead space behind the tub. With the wider hall bath, you would have a 27/29 inch space in front of the toilet instead of 24/26

    I like Suzanne's idea for shelves nest to sink if it works out.

    J. Link thanked Karenseb
  • suzanne_m
    5 days ago
    last modified: 5 days ago

    To save space in front of the toilet you may consider a tankless toilet (that would give you more space when you get out of the shower). I am not familiar with these toilets but here is a link about what you need to know. I did not read it:

    http://toiletsandmore.com/what-you-need-to-know-about-tankless-toilets/

    J. Link thanked suzanne_m
  • Cherie
    5 days ago

    Is the tile hallway the only issue with moving the master bedroom door? I think replacing a few tiles an dry walling an opening would be significantly less than installing 2 bathrooms.

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    5 days ago
    last modified: 5 days ago

    @Cherie There are lots of issues with moving the bedroom door. There is a post shortly above this one that shows pictures describing these items: There is crown moulding in the bedroom that would need to be reconfigured all around the 'nook' behind the french doors, and i'd probably have to purchase new crown to extend the entire length of the wall instead of piecing together existing pieces. Reconfiguring the closet and walls in the bedroom would also affect the carpet in this room, which does not need to be replaced (not worn or too dated) if I don't move walls around. The layout was like this when I purchased this home, so thinking modestly, I face-lifted the hallway tile (DIY). I also added closet shelving and lights inside the 'nook' and the closet. (DIY). It used to be a single bar across, and no other storage. These built ins and light fixtures would have to be taken out and relocated to a new closet space, but they were sized to fit this one. The detailing around the guest bedroom door is unique, and I would need to recreate it on the new bedroom door on account of them being across from each other. This would mean exposing the space under the existing wall. This space is hardwood, so i'm not sure if the hardwood continues under the wall or not, since it was a renovation from a previous owner. If the hardwood does not continue, then there is that issue. I also replaced the door slabs and hardware to match my style on the french doors, since the doors were already there and french when i got here, again facelift purposes. I'd be just throwing that all away by undoing it.

    Basically, extending the renovation beyond the scope of the bathroom has huge snowball effect construction implications, undoes alot of DIY work I've already done, (which doesn't look bad, considering they were modest upgrades.. there are photos in the description) and is an easy way to blow up the budget on something that was supposed to save me money.. ya know? (Unless I'm wildly missing something.. )

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    5 days ago

    @Karenseb I edited the plan to make the master bath 5'0" even. I like this. It seems to split the difference better between the two.

  • J. Link
    Original Author
    11 hours ago

    Update: the two bathroom plan with us doing everything DIY except for moving/locating plumbing is 15k. We will probably have to revise these plans, or go back to the one-bathroom.... which is pretty much square one with this post, lol. Just FYI for anyone who is wondering how much moving plumbing costs, or if it was going to be a wash between one bathroom and two smaller ones

  • emilyam819
    11 hours ago

    What’s the estimate for doing one bathroom?

  • suzanne_m
    10 hours ago

    One option where no plumbing is moved. Personally, with minimal change to plumbing, I would rotate the vanity to fit on the South wall.

  • suzanne_m
    7 hours ago

    The plumbing of a tub or shower cannot go on an exterior wall (or maybe yes if you live in a hot/warm climate). However, you could maybe install a plumbing for a shower if you add an extra layer of wall where you current vanity is. That would be nice because I think the shower should be in that location.