Maybe or maybe they are just concerned with the bottom line.

Check Armstrong. They provide all types of commercial flooring in vinyl. At least Armstrong will have commercial ratings for their products.

https://www.armstrongflooring.com/residential/en-us/vinyl-flooring/luxury-vinyl-tile.html#

The vinyl they use = the best deal for the company per square foot needed. Nope. Not kidding. Even a savings of $0.50/sf = hundreds of thousands of dollars at the end of the build.

Remember: these developers DON'T CARE! They really really really don't. For me, vinyl *might sound 'better' than laminate but it is SEVERLY limiting!

Vinyl: HATES direct sunlight (SoCal...oh dear)

HATES direct heat (SoCal...oh my)

HATES under pad for acoustics (Condo/apartments/multifamily units = OH NO!)

HATES RUBBER...as in rubber-backed mats in front of the balcony door, kitchen sink...etc

For me, a high-end laminate ($4 - $5/sf) is much better than low-grade or mid grade vinyl (that's the same price).

Laminate: HATES WATER (no kitchens, no bathrooms, no problem)

That's it! That's all laminate hates.

Laminate LOVES: THICK UNDERPAD (like 6mm or 12mm cork underlayment)

Loves rugs and mats (no issues with rubberized mats).

The option is yours...right now the WORLD is HOT for vinyl. The salespeople are making HUGE amounts of money off of their 'target' materials (maker, vendor, importer...doesn't matter...there are kick-backs). These same sales people do NOT have that incentive from the expensive European Laminates. Why not? Because the Europeans don't need the US/Canadian markets. They have enough business from Europe. And Japan. And Korea....etc.

If I am in a multifamily unit, my favourites are cork (I'm a cork expert...so I'm TOTALLY biased ;-), Laminate with THICK cork underlay (6mm or 12mm) depending on the building's HOA requirements.

Which is the biggest issue with a homeowner renovating their condo....they MUST check with the condo association/HOA, etc to ensure the noise requirements are met. Vinyl doesn't do it. And it can't do it...because it HATES underpad.

Thank you. I hear you re laminate advantages, from now having read enough. I just can’t find much selection at floor stores and certainly not what you’re calling high end European product. What are the names and brands I should look for and hunt down? Most floor stores push vinyl as you say, but even a couple of those that do sell it said they’d install laminate in their own home not vinyl,nbutbthen tehy show me their laminate and there’s few choices and can’t even find a simple light toned natural wood like version....all are either trendy grays, too dark, feel and look (and are) cheap. So I’m lost.

re laminate and water, those who do like laminate in floor stores all say no to bathrooms but that kitchen is ok because wetness for 24-72 hrs (depending on which laminate) should be fine on the ones designed for water ”resistance”. Is that just a sales pitch too? i see plenty of homes where people put real wood (eg maple maybe w a sealant?) in kitchen and say it is fine as long as wipe up a spill, but water drops hit a problem. I assume lamI ate is at least better than hardwood w water? Or no?

MOST IMPORTANT: what specific European laminate should I hunt down? Sounds promising mostly.

I got a great laminate at Floor and Decor that my store had as a closeout. I wanted a light oak classic in color with a texture and not something that looked like printed paper. The laminate is not as gray as it appears in these photos.

Thank you. Did you install and it works well and holds up under use over a long period?

I did find a laminate color at Floor and Decor that is ok for me, but was told by a flooring pro that it’s click system is cheap (ie not one of the more durable patented tongue and groove systems like Uniclic) and risks not holding up. This the exact product/color I liked at floor and decor:

https://www.flooranddecor.com/laminate-flooring/lambent-blonde-oak-water-resistant-laminate-100578947.html?externalVisit=true

I just don’t know if I can trust it? Great price if it is in fact good and durable! Anyone with real world experience on their products like this one?

But it’s certainly not “high end European laminate” another user says is what really does the job right and looks good. I am willing to pay up IF you need to for a product that you can rely on and looks good too. But haven’t found such a product here in SoCal. Very frustrating,

Oh also, thanks for the photos, what sku is that or send a link to that product and color?

Swiss Kronos laminate or Lico laminate. Both of these are from Switzerland. They are magnificent. Outstanding. Impressive. Amazing.

Aquaguard is a laminate (the paper photo on top) that sits on a black plastic (?Polypropylene??) core. It is tough to cut...the black dust gets everywhere. It is stupid tricky to install (the thin plastic edges are VERY brittle). And they also have problems with temperature (the plastic core is what gets upset...not the surface like vinyl).

Is there a reason you really want water proof? Condos/apartments in SoCal don't see a lot of water. Not like Seattle or Vancouver.

Very helpful SJ. btw, what is your background and experince where you figured all this out?

As for why was hoping for waterproof, I was looking to install same floor in all rooms incl kitchen and bathroom. AND, I live 5 blocks from beach, so moist air is a concern as is walking into the condo from having been at pool, etc. Just easier not to have to be super careful was my hope.

Re F&D's Aquaguard product is the click lock system also a serious problem? overall you'd say avoid that product, or just get a v good installer and it is ok (at least better then vinyl)?

Thanks Steve F - I'm a cork flooring expert who also has training in a medical technology (EEG). I'm used to looking at HUNDREDS of documents just to find one nugget of information.

The moisture in the air isn't very concerning for laminate...especially a good one. The sand from the beach isn't a problem for a laminate. And coming in from the pool (are you at ground level? where you take 10 steps and walk into your apartment...a la Motel style?) should be an issue as long as you have a minute or so walk.

I know you want vinyl or water proof. I get that. The amount of heat your sun through the windows will create is your biggest downfall for vinyl. Until you know how hot it gets in the summer in the areas that have direct sunlight, you are going to have one HELLAVA time getting vinyl to work for you (imagine updating those windows to UV block 75 - 97%; OR black out blinds pulled down every day...to stop the sunlight from hitting your flooring).

Btw, SJ MCCarthy, for laminate you have seen that you strongly prefer to LVP, are there ways to make it not make creaking noises? I've heard that's a big issue with laminate?