The problem is the duct work is not larger enough to handle the air flow of a 4-ton unit. You pay for a 4 tons but only get the effective cooling of 3 tons. In addition the constricted air flow creates additional noise.

What is the size of the current unit? The right way to do this is to do a load calculation to determine the proper size. I thought load calculations were required when replacing HVAC equipment in California.

I think we have a 4 ton furnace now, and be honest our vents rattle a lot when the heat is on.

Load calculations ARE required for building permit applications in California.

The less rigorous (less competent) HVAC contractors sometimes don't get building permits. Or, plugging the input numbers into the software, to get the desired answer on the backend, is easy enough to do.

Mr Avocado, I bought a second home in Socal. A bit over 1500 sq feet in a free standing home, a mile as the seagull flies from the sand. The biggest issue I've found for our place is poor attic and wall insulation. The sun is strong even though the air temps are mild. And, the sea air can be a bit humid. And, stack effect (hot air rises, the upstairs is always slower to cool than downstairs).

My contractor's honest calc came to 2.5 tons. He suggested either 3 tons (for faster cooling) or 2 tons (for better comfort but longer time to cool a hot place). I asked what he would choose for himself and he said 2 tons, longer run times to remove humidity.

We went with 2 tons. It works great. The house can get up to 80 degrees and even a bit more upstairs on a hot day. The system can drop the indoor temp about 3 degrees per hour, so we start it to come on at 5pm when we're not home during the day. The cool down is plenty fast enough, and humidity relief (on such days) is noticeable in the first hour. And, more importantly, it operates more economically and will last longer because of longer run times and fewer on and off cycles.

I should point out that one of the required seller's disclosures when selling real property in California is whether any work was done that requires a building permit, for which a permit wasn't obtained. Does that matter to a potential buyer? I don't know. The permit and required HERS testing (for duct leakage) added about $1000 to my project. I think it was money well spent.

I should add - It was prewired and plumbed (copper tube lineset) for AC but it hadn't been previously put in. The place had a 80% 65K (Gross input) furnace that was awful. Waay too big. Like getting BBQ'd by a blow torch, off for 10 minutes, then back on again for 5. Rinse and repeat.

The load calculation spec'd a 40K (gross input) furnace. We went with that. It works MUCH better, much more comfortable when the weather turns cool and a bit of heating is needed. It reaches the set temp much faster than the AC but of course, it has about 35K BTUs per hour when the AC has only 24 K to change the temperature.

@Elmer J Fudd this is super helpful, and your furnace situation sounds a lot like ours currently. It’s a big old thing from the 80s, comes on at super high intensity for say five minutes at a time, and makes the vents rattle. Our friends have a 3 ton AC, and I could barely hear that it was on but the house, but the place was nice and cool. This is our current beast on a furnace.

Crazy to know you went with a 2ton. Is there any concern with electric costs because it’s on or consistently?

I missed your comment above, Senior Avocado, when you said

" I think we have a 4 ton furnace now ".

Furnace input and output are sized and measured in BTUs, not tons. AC is measured in tons as shorthand, 1 ton=12K BTUs per hour.

There's no necessary relationship between "If you have a furnace of X BTUs, then you need AC of Y tons." The Load calculations for each are separate and in our area, typically more cooling capacity is needed than heating capacity. If that gas furnace has been there for several decades, you can assume it's oversized and a smaller one would be more suitable. But, subject to the load calculations.

Your photo shows a gas furnace but no AC coil. Are you adding AC to your existing HVAC equipment? If Yes, and that furnace is more than a dozen years old, I'd get a new furnace at the same time and get a matching coil and blower capacity to match it (and your ducting).

That's not a big furnace cabinet. That cabinet could produce heat over a wide range of BTU outputs because inside it could have two burners, or three, or four, or ....... You get it.

That cabinet should have a source of outside air. Are there any air grills in the floor, walls or ceiling to provide combustion air from the outside? If not, you should have that added. And if the outside of that closet is the inside of the house, I'd recommend that outdoor-quality weatherstripping be added to the frame of the door to seal it off in case there's a gas leak or break in the exhaust ducting.

At our two places, one has just one system and it's in the attic. At the other, one furnace (and coil) are in the garage, the other is in a sealed closet like that with outside air grills in the floor (open to the crawl space and the other high on the wall, open to the outside).

Good luck

@Elmer J Fudd Hi, yea we're getting a new furnace too. There is a source of air from outside, the vent at the bottom has an escape to the outside as well as inside (facing the hallway). Hear you on sealing it off though, someone else mentioned that.

I am thinking we'll got with the 3ton AC, especially because we have to put the condenser on our deck (no space in the backyard), and we'd prefer to keep it low/out of clear view from neighbors.

Thanks for your help.

My advice is to get quotes from additional contractors. You want a contractor who will apply for the proper permits and not leave you with a bad installation and several code violations. Improperly and over sized equipment will never operate properly. It will cost more money, but if you plan to live in this house several years but it will be worth the extra money in my opinion.

The furnace utility closet is too small for the current furnace. Hopefully the new furnace will be smaller and have more clearance.

There are upright outdoor compressors for ducted systems intended to be space savers. I have a Carrier one, it seems to have been discontinued. They're upright like a cereal box. And look like this

PS - I agree with Mike's advice about getting several quotes. '

Don't let anyone upsell you regarding multispeed units or very high efficiency furnaces (like 98%+). In the mild climate of coastal SoCal, the functionality differences are not needed and the added cost doesn't get you much. Get basic functionality from quality brands. Choose the best contractor who will do the job properly (as mike outlines) and rely on them to choose the equipment to match your requirements.

Ya thats what were hoping to get. But if we go 4ton it’s twice as tall, double stacked.

I wouldn't go 4 tons unless that's what an honestly done load calculation calls for. And if it does, I'd poke and prod the contractor to understand why, because I'd doubt its accuracy.

1 ton per 500 sq feet used to be the old and long ago discredited "rule of thumb" before load calculations became more common. The rule of thumb results in oversizing. Including, in other parts of the country where extreme and incessant heat and humidity for weeks on end is the rule. And before the downside of oversizing became better understood

The contractors' attitudes were - more profit in a larger size, and customers don't call to complain if they're cool.

In my main house with two systems, still in warm (not foggy) coastal Calif but to the north, I have 4 tons for 3600 sq ft, and 2 tons for 1400 sq feet for a two story connected addition on the west side. The house was built in the 1970s and is not tight or all that well insulated. My equipment is perfectly adequate even on days well up into the 90s. When it's a bit hotter, as happens for some days most years, it takes longer to cool down but it's comfortable. I still wouldn't want more tonnage.

Get basic functionality from quality brands.

Pay attention to which refrigerant type is coursing thru it's refrigerant circuits.

In my opinion R32 is better (right now) which cuts your choices drastically.

R454b is in the rest. Europe has already banned R454b, largely due to PFAS chemicals.

For less poetry and more HVAC info / regarding refrigerants -- the life blood of AC's and or Heat Pumps to make them efficient and operate properly asside from proper sizing / things code official will not check.

My guess for USA will be a new turn possibly as soon as 2032 -- not likely past 2036 when exemptions end, California is most likely to lead that charge under a PFAS national emergency or something similar.

I've been covering this debacle since 2021. Largely classified as a Red Herring, and here we are.

5 parts, each part about 30-40 minutes. (It's complicated)

I service the Katy, Texas area.

They’re saying R32 condenser, Bryant furnace. Any particular condenser that’s best? Bryant furnace ok?

All 3 of my systems are Bryant (1 furnace and 1 AC on each) and they've been rock solid. Over 10 years on 2 systems, 9 years on the other. Recognize though, Mr A, that in our area, the hours of use can be less in one year than in one month in many other parts of the country. It's a light load, not a heavy load, and properly sized and installed equipment can last longer.

I can't speak to the coolant but they'll provide what's allowed. Ignore what the guy who's still hung up on the previous administration may have to say, he makes everything into a political outrage.

Good luck.

Thank you Elmer! Really appreciate it yet again.

Love this dialogue over AC! Ha.

Mr A, the guy is predictable. It's no surprise he has plenty of spare time during the work day to spend here posting nonsense that does the opposite of attracting business.

Edit to add:

Up above when mentioning the upright outdoor systems, I just noticed I said the one I had was Carrier. I said that to keep the story easy - in fact, it's badged as being Bryant as I just mentioned. Bryant is a brand name owned by Carrier and its equipment is mostly the same model to model with Carrier, just a different name on the box. The Carrier versions of the same thing can sometimes be more expensive.

The upright one I have is single stage from the midrange product line. The two are the conventional cube shape in the other locations are single stage from the lower model line. All three furnaces are matching with the respective AC units and are also single stage 80%ers in the lower line.

Would you like to explore a ducted heat pump?

Whole house heating using a heat pump is needlessly expensive in California EXCEPT for those with adequately sized solar arrays or living in areas with municipal electricity suppliers. The only such system in coastal SoCal is a small stretch covered by City of Los Angeles DWP. Mr A can identify if he has that or otherwise the much more costly SCE or SDGE. For these latter two, the lowest usage rates begin at nearly 40 cents per kWh and usage beyond (the base level varies between the companies but can be as low as 400Kwh per month) is about 1/3 higher.

The rate systems are in flux right now but these two investor owned utilites in the south and PG+E that covers much of NorCal have very high rates.

Heating interior spaces and water with natural gas is much cheaper. Natural gas is widely available in built-up areas. There's a place for small heat pumps for added-on space or rooms with poor air flow that can't be remedied otherwise. But, again, they're not commonly used for whole house systems.

edit

I found a photo of what I have. Also, here's a link

Bryant Side Discharge conventional split AC condenser

Love this dialogue over AC! Ha.

The land of the haves, have nots and the soon to "no you can't have that either".

Well we hate anything political, except HERS testing, pulling a permit, performing Heat Loads, but any other rules or problems we'll just ignore those. We want to know which brands are good, from a time period long ago in which those models are no longer made. (not even close)

Processes change, efficiency requirments, physical equipment sizes with possibly double the number of joints that are often times now sealed via a chemical process versus spot brazing.

Then from our brethern across the sea, who saw the falsity for what is happening?

We'll phase out R410a for the global warming it is causing... all well and good.

We'll replace it with R454b, that is mildly better for global warming but will pollute our water supply with forever chemicals that don't break down. Seriously? You want to ignore this?

Charles hate's AI because it's smarter than he is and he can't bash it for not taking chemistry class like he did, even though the chemistry folk didn't want his logic either and he had to beat up nails for a living. (How am I doing Charles?)

I find it interesting how people navigate things like this. (We'll just pretend honey, ignore it and it will go away.)

I'm up at the crack of dawn and partake in these things while I drink my morning coffee, so no I'm not in here during the day... let the discussions bake awhile. I'm patient, HVAC is only getting more troublesome.

The days of my brand equipment is better than your brand is over. The folks calling the refrigerant shots are winning this game... the equipment makers rejoice because they get to sell new equipment over and over and over.

We're sorry, that refrigerant was too bad. I don't know what we were thinking. Here's some new equipment that is much better with an all new refrigerant.

How do we know this is what they are doing? Once, twice... three times a lady. Yeah my chemistry skills are lacking, but I'm universally certified to handle any refrigerant they dream up. Not only certified but also know how to use those refrigerants. Charles? he's got HVAC contractors on speed dial.

The Equipment manufacturer warranty fine print. (click to enlarge - they have known for a long time what to cover or not)

I couldn't make this up if I tried. It was California that came up with R410a refrigerant sales ban. Let's see how long R454b can navigate those rules. It's set to take place in 2030, you know so there will be those who say well it's not banned yet.

So good plan, just ignore it. Then wake up one day, the AC isn't working has sprung a leak. No worries if you're rich with a fat wallet. But we are here looking for pointers as to what we should buy for fear that what we are buying isn't any good?

Yeah make that make sense? No, just ignore that too? Fun times in HVAC. Circa 2025 -- in case you visit here in 2030 and wonder what the hell went wrong.

" We're sorry, that refrigerant was too bad. I don't know what we were thinking. Here's some new equipment that is much better with an all new refrigerant." You seem to believe that an entire industry exists for the purpose of cycling refrigerants so they can sell new generations of equipment. I don't share that view. In fact, I don't believe anyone of reasonable intelligence who invests a few minutes exploring the history of mechanical refrigeration will either.

The search for the ideal chemical refrigerant has been ongoing since the discovery of mechanical refrigeration, Ray. Most of the research began in the 1920's. Since then, refrigerants have routinely been replaced with alternatives which are more stable, less toxic, and less hazardous (e.g., flammable, explosive.) While it's fairly straightforward to determine hazards, it takes more time to understand effects on human health, and the environment.

No one is ignoring the health or environmental consequences of chemical refrigerants. Researching answers just takes more time than downing a cup of coffee and typing out an uninformed stream of fearmongering.

Most of the research began in the 1920's. Since then, refrigerants have routinely been replaced with alternatives which are more stable, less toxic, and less hazardous (e.g., flammable, explosive.) While it's fairly straightforward to determine hazards, it takes more time to understand effects on human health, and the environment.

I grew up without air conditioning Charles. Air conditioning was largely attributed to Willis Carrier whose initial design was for industrial printing purposes to control humidity.

The first residential air conditioning system was installed in 1914 in a Minneapolis mansion, though it was a massive and expensive unit. Widespread use of air conditioning in homes didn't become common until much later, with smaller, more affordable window units being introduced in 1931 and central air becoming more widespread in the 1950s.

First one was installed in a Mansion. Hello Mr. Dead Presidente.

More wide spread in the 1950's. (I still grew up without it.) It wasn't until the 1980's that I personally experienced any form of Air Conditioning in my life, except that used in Automotive in the 1970's. (R12) -- they sold the cans in the automotive stores for $1 a can. (hello dead presidente - G. Washington)

R22 became the favorable choice for Residential AC's in the 1950s. (I still grew up without it)

Is R22 the same as R12?In the 1950s, R22 took over from R12 as the leading refrigerant of choice for residential AC units and fridges. It didn't cause as much wear on compressors, and didn't need as large of pipes to flow through. While R22 is still widely used in America, it's an HCFC compound. (R12 still remained as the prominent choice for Automotive, until 1996 with the introduction of R134a (blend refrigerant)

Is R22 still used today? 75 years later from when it was introduced. YES. but it's prohibitively expensive. (hello dead inventor B. Franklin) -- fat wallet reduction therapy.

What took over in Residential from R22? R410a. (it's a mix of 50% R32 and 50% R125) Was introduced in the late 90's, but adoption was very slow. (cost -- oops more dead president's to consider, just ignore that).

In the year 2000, I had been an HVAC service tech for approximately 6.5 years by this time. I sold my first R410a HVAC system. By 2008, I was still selling new R22 Freon systems. Because R22 was still cheaper than R410a. (That began to change by 2010). -- After 2010-- Manufacturers discovered a loop hole in Political Regulations. (They ignored it) -- They found that shipping condensers dry with inert gas known as nitrogen, they could continue to sell R22 condensers. The caveat then was product warranties for these eventually dropped to 5 years parts only.

By 2008, I obtained my Texas HVAC license. I still sold R22 units slightly after the 2010 period if I could find units with the coveted 10 year part warranty. It was probably an even split as I also sold R410a units during this time frame. (refrigerant doesn't matter other than cost -- dead president - ignore the political aspects while talking about political aspects.)

Communicating systems make their debut; all the new rage around the 2013-2014 era. These required all new everything. Typically 2 stage AC's with 2 stage furnaces, proprietary thermostats. -- a few years later I discovered the con of these systems. (there's always a con, if you don't ignore things from a policy perspective. -- it wasn't a refrigerant con, but a con none the less.) Dupe you for your ignorance.

By 2017 / 2018 a new entry... inverter systems. Da Bosch. no communicating mumbo jumbo. Works well with practically anything. Premium? yeah. Better dehumidification than 2 stage communicating, yeah. Without the con job of communicating, yeah. No proprietary thermostat. yeah.

2019: Bosch distributor comes to Katy. June 2019 Install my first Inverter. Customer raves so much I can't believe it. (cuts electric bill by over $200 a month.) October 2019, I install Bosch Bova 1.0 at my own house. (BOVA 2.0 wasn't available yet here). All of these were R410a.

2021: R410a phase down and eventual ban becomes known. (I make video that is largely mocked, criticised -- claimed to be cartoons -- Red Herring fishing expedition.)

December 31, 2024: The hard cut off. The end of R410a equipment production. No dry units, no nothing. 2025: The last year to install R410a equipment.

January 1, 2026: It becomes illegal to install new R410a equipment. (Repairs are still legal but complicated as it will greatly depend on what you need and if you can find it)

Those with communicating systems of old, probably looking at replacing the whole thing again or a major part of the system. (Mildly Flammable Mitigation Controls)

No one is ignoring: Ignore what the guy who's still hung up on the previous administration may have to say, he makes everything into a political outrage." I think the post above is ample evidence of Elmer's claim.

The debate over refrigerants and PFAS

The U.S. government's regulation of HFCs is primarily based on their high GWP, but the connection to PFAS creates additional regulatory complexity.

• EPA's position: The EPA has clarified that it does not classify common HFC refrigerants as the same problematic "forever chemicals" that are the focus of much of its PFAS regulation.

  • HFCs and their breakdown products, like trifluoroacetic acid (TFA), behave differently in the environment and do not accumulate in the human body like other, more toxic PFAS compounds.
  • In 2024, the EPA even proposed excluding one refrigerant, HCFO-1224yd(Z), from the list of volatile organic compounds (VOCs) it regulates, arguing that its low GWP poses minimal health risk.

• State-level definitions: The federal government's position contrasts with that of some states, including Maine and Minnesota, which use a broader definition of PFAS.

  • Their definition includes any substance with at least one fully fluorinated carbon atom. This would cover many common HFCs and HFOs used as refrigerants today.
  • Some states have moved to ban products with intentionally added PFAS, which could eventually include certain refrigerants.

• International perspective: European regulations on PFAS are broader than the U.S. federal approach, and some fluorinated refrigerants are expected to be restricted in the European Union.

Impact on the HVAC industryThe diverging regulatory landscape at the federal and state levels has created uncertainty for the HVAC industry.

• Phase-out of HFCs: The AIM Act has already set new deadlines for the transition to lower-GWP refrigerants in HVAC equipment.
• State-level restrictions: HVAC companies must also track state-level restrictions, which could lead to a patchwork of different rules and compliance challenges.
• Shift to alternatives: The industry is moving towards alternative refrigerants, including non-fluorinated "natural refrigerants" like propane and CO2, which are PFAS-free.

R410a was promoted as a Enivronmental "perfect refrigerant" when it was introduced. Classified as Enviro-Friendly. (how soon we forget)

Europe? They say something completely different on PFAS and what they will allow. (They've banned it) How could Europe be so different? You think global manufacturers are going to continue to play devil's advocate between US and the rest of the world? -- Psst: Europe has been using R32 for over a decade now. um yeah. Well that's merely a coincidence ~ there are no coincidences.

The move is to "natural refrigerants" -- Yes, HVAC is always about what is next.

Well, we have to sell you something until then. Dead Presidents. The end, until we come up with something else to bamboozle you with.

----------------------

(quote) You seem to believe that an entire industry exists for the purpose of cycling refrigerants so they can sell new generations of equipment. I don't share that view. (/quote)

New generations of equipment come about thru a variety of means, not just refrigerant alone. Efficiency regulations can and do effect these kinds of things. If there were no efficiency changes invoked by politics ( you know the thing we are supposed to ignore via Mr. Fudd's aspirations)

But they've muddied the waters: 10 SEER was largely the standard prior to 2000. Compared to 14.3 SEER 2 as a southern state requirement. (Yeah they've separated the line from what is allowed versus what is not)

Prior to the SEER 2 implementation the requirement was 14 SEER (old equation) So what the efficiency actually is? We'll leave that to the imagination or something more to ignore if you're in the Fudd camp.

The industry exists for cycling refrigerants. Um, no. Government regs decide that. If Government bans a component this means you have to move on to something else. If you're building new all the time... you just select the new thing whatever it is.

If that structure exists a home builder is not likely going back a single time? So a HVAC repair contractor comes in... because a builder's job is to build, not go back an service something they put in new.

"AAC: It wasn't until the 1980's that I personally experienced any form of Air Conditioning in my life, except that used in Automotive in the 1970's."

Interesting. I/my family had air conditioning in our houses ever since the one built in 1964. The last extended family member that I recall getting air conditioning was my maternal grandmother in the early 1970s (two window units).

You often post essays about the industry changing/updating refrigerants in response to questions asking for opinions on which is the best option between a choice of systems.

What is the point of that?

Are you advising that no one should buy an air conditioning system at the present time (or ever again?) due to the cyclical industry changes in refrigerants (and energy standards)?

The OP in this thread didn't ask anything about refrigerants (do any of them ask about that?). His concern is about appropriate capacity for best comfort.

At this point it’s just hilarious. Thank you all.

Especially Elmer!

You often post essays about the industry changing/updating refrigerants in response to questions asking for opinions on which is the best option between a choice of systems.

What is the point of that?

Service ability. Equipment life, from a national average is 15 years. That isn't a hard number just an average. If a refrigerant is banned / or the refrigerant replacing the banned refrigerant is not a good choice? How will that effect the financial decision being made?

I've only been posting these types of posts when in 2021 I became aware of the changes coming. (2025, they are here... hard line January 1, 2026)

R410a is a bad refrigerant due to high GWP. R454b GWP is still high but much better than R410a. BUT ample evidence it will pollute water supply due to PFAS.

R32 is a better choice, but not perfect. (You have to choose something -- HVAC is a financial decision more often than not... for some areas it's more of a luxury -- mild climate)

I've been to countless homes with refrigerant leaks on fairly new equipment sometimes as little as 1 year old. Most of the time it might be between 3-5 years old.

Never have we been at a crossroads such as this in HVAC where about 95% of the market is using R454b (my opinion it's not a good choice) vs 5% of the market is choosing R32 -- while not perfect either -- it won't pollute our water systems.

I like clean water. I don't want liver cancer or any other health detriments caused by PFAS chemicals. Do you want clean water? That's not the only point, but the primary one. (financial would be the other one -- R454b costs more and is likely to be that way indefinately until the day comes in which they ban it.) ~ They will.

Are you advising that no one should buy an air conditioning system at the present time (or ever again?) due to the cyclical industry changes in refrigerants (and energy standards)?

No, make better decisions. Equipment manufacturers have numbers they hit every year, regardless what they do. They make more money with new equipment than honoring or having to honor a product warranty. The product warranty only supplies a part, it doesn't not provide you with refrigerant (if needed) --- if the refrigerant is banned? supply vs demand -- price goes up. (simple) If prices exceed the cost of new equipment would you not choose new equipment with a better cheaper refrigerant?

Read again what they wrote: The push is to newer natural refrigerants with little to no GWP whatsoever. But those options are not available yet.

Oh, so you're telling people to wait another decade? No, I'm telling you where we are going. It's up to you to make the decision for yourself.

Buy a new HVAC system now (whatever it is, I don't care as long as it doesn't pollute my water) --- Then prepare yourself to buy another one in about another decade... that will likely revolutionize HVAC as we know it currently. (My thoughts are R290 -- why? Europe is using it now) If Europe is using it, that must mean Global Manufacturers are making it. (simple)

The OP in this thread didn't ask anything about refrigerants (do any of them ask about that?). His concern is about appropriate capacity for best comfort.

People never do. They'll pick equipment by a brand name someone else used with little trouble thinking that a brand name will make everything nice and comfortable. Carrier knows this all too well, they make more AC brands than any other manufacturer. You could chose a new brand the rest of your life and you won't run out of brand names. Yeah, Hilarious.

If there was no refrigerant debacle going on right now? I'd be recommending the Bosch Bova 2.0 with R410a. But alas, that is not the case.

If R290 is the better choice why didn't US manufacterers choose it? It's known as refrigerant grade Propane. (highly flammable, not to mention explosive.) More political things to ignore like building codes and so on.

It is the future though, in time maybe another 8-9 years (unless something better comes, which I doubt) we'll begin to see building codes fall in line and develop requirements. In it's wake it will destroy the refrigerant cash cow as we know it. (Refrigerant recycle industry) as because R290 is a natural sourced refrigerant it won't be required to be reclaimed.

-------

At this point it’s just hilarious. Thank you all.

Especially Elmer!

So what are the odds that Elmer's recommendation is that good? (not that any option right now is truly good... that's a fleeting statement in terms of what might be better right now)

Click to enlarge (Bryant Equipment complaint)

From Pissed Consumer reviews, 172 complaints on Bryant equipment, versus one recommendation here. Overall Rating 1.5 out of 5.

Honestly you can do this with any brand, even ones I would recommend. Just showing the value of selecting something by a name.

Bryant AC's will be using R454b refrigerant. (Carrier product, they make more brands than any other manufacturer, so one fails pick another name they make.)

Hilarious! Indeed. (provided you're not polluting the water supply, that is)

If there was no refrigerant debacle going on right now? I'd be recommending the Bosch Bova 2.0 with R410a. But alas, that is not the case.

What heat pump model are you now recommending for new installations for the residents of Katy, Texas?

" So what are the odds that Elmer's recommendation is that good? "

Thanks for asking. I wasn't making a recommendation, I was sharing my own experiences as a homeowner.

I think most of the regular readers here know how to recognize and benefit from the advice of experts. Don't assume anyone gives any of your comments any credence.

What heat pump model are you now recommending for new installations for the residents of Katy, Texas?

I live in about a 99% gas furnace market, so I haven't necessarily put one brand over another. Bosch is an option, but because they chose R454b I'm on the fence with that.

If someone called me, had a heat pump, wanted another heat pump -- it might be an interesting conversation. It depends on what the comfort goals are, the budget, the time horizon of how long they plan to own the home, etc.

The discussion of R32 vs the R454b discussion, costs if something goes wrong. (It doesn't always go wrong) I tell it like it is and a good number of folk like that. Some don't, some want to believe fairy tales of one name versus another... and there's little I will do to convince them otherwise.

It's not always about what I want, it's the customers decision. I'm merely a hefty guide with over 30 years of doing. If I am called in after a mistake was made? Yeah I'll still call it as I see it. Most of the time these are financial decisions in my market. (9-10 months of the year we operate in AC mode. It's going to be in the 90F's here today.) -- so while heating here is used it's no where near as important as AC.

I have a customer with 3 heat pumps, and one of them is having problems. But he's issued statements that they plan to sell the home in 5 years, and he's only lived there around 3 years. I've been servicing his equipment for a couple of years now. -- so no telling how this one will play out. Just out there recently with one of his 2 speed condensers off on locked rotor compressor trip. It's only 3 years old tied to an air handler that is 14 years old. There's more complications than that... but it provides you with a few elements. I was able to after several attempts get it going again, I have doubts it will last as when it goes thru it's trouble, the compressor sounds like it's dying a slow death. -- not good for a 3 year old heat pump. ( I didn't install it, have no idea what was done that should be, or what should not have been done that was. -- I've installed a good number of these on my own, that don't have these kinds of problems even at double the age old of this one.)

Thanks for asking. I wasn't making a recommendation, I was sharing my own experiences as a homeowner.

Yeah I know, I was just listing the fallacy (as I see it from an HVAC contractor view point) of doing so. You know to suggest that anything someone could pick now in equipment from only a brand name perspective and have similar performance that you have had. It's not impossible, but highly unlikely. (odds game)

I think it was 2023 when the SEER 2 requirements kicked in and upwards of 80-90% of equipment had to be reworked to meet those requirements, to now those requirements PLUS we're using a different refrigerant. R454b there is no data, you're essentially the guinea pig with that option.

With R32, it's already been in use for over a decade in Europe.