It might not be of concern to you since you didn't mention it, but I would first rebuild the wall at the bottom. Looking at that every day would drive me nuts.

Yeah I hate it too. I plan to replace it with natural stone when I can afford it. There will be new sod in front up it soon that will make it look better.

In my opinion, if you're serious about gardening under them, get rid of at least one of the maples. Preferable the one closer to the house, since, if you plan to stay there >= 15 years, it will be scheduled to fall on your house around that time 🤣.

(Northerners will say I'm being a doomsayer. Fine. Drive around old Atlanta neighborhoods and see how large maples overhanging houses are holding up. Maybe I'm wrong. 🤷‍♂️)

The trees must stay. Sugar Maples don't get that big anyway. The one close to the house is probably at or nearly at full height. They aren't real limby like Silver Maples can be. I can control the limbs close to the house with no problem. The roots are always an issue with almost all maples. Drought brings the roots to the surface where they stay. I can work with the roots. It just might take a while to get ground covers to work. I'm more interested in advice on soil amendment, water retention, and plant varieties for the dry shade conditions. And do the solid sandstone ledges beneath the top soil make larger plants a nonstarter.

It may be the time of year but that slope doesn't look all that shady to me. Indirect sunlight is quite a different gardening situation than shade and the plants that will suit it and grow well there are not just shade loving plants so selection will be much broader. The fact that both the junipers and azaleas, neither of which are shade lovers, did reasonably well there supports that.

I'd also take some time to understand your soil. 'Solid sandstone ledges' allude to a higher soil pH which may limit plant selection far more than shade or sun concerns. Also, it is rarely ever advised to amend individual planting holes. Either amend the entire slope or plant high and add better quality soil around the plants. Then mulch.

Sugar Maples don't get that big anyway. Really?? 50-100 feet is generally considered large by any tree standard and there is potential for even larger heights.

I would also replace that cement block wall before I planted anything. It is an eyesore. Hardscaping is always suggested before any planting and with proper height you can reduce the degree of slope and add soil, improving the planting conditions. Always prepare the site with the future in mind before decorating with plants. They are the last items to be considered and installed.

Always prepare the site with the future in mind before decorating with plants. They are the last items to be considered and installed.

Brilliant advice!

I agree the cement blocks are ugly.

Starting from Williamsburg, VA, and points south, you can grow the perfect for this situation Ficus pumila. I'd be 95% sure it's hardy enough for Atlanta...but maybe not the very northernmost or high elevation parts of North Georgia. Not as crazy vigorous as Ivy, but covers as densely - probably more densely. TBH, I'm not sure of its sun tolerance tho - I usually see it in a bit of shade. There could be another dense growing vine to help cover it. I say this because hardscaping is getting EXPENSIVE. A family member recently told me about the shocking estimates they got for some stone retention walls. All > 20K. Granted they are in the suburbs of Philly, a more expensive area.

Appreciate the inputs. The sugar maple here is a southern variety called Caddo, which only get to 30 - 50'. Ours is about 30 feet right now. I'm not worried about it, and I can't remove it anyway. The HOA won't allow it unless it is dead or dangerous, and neither is the case. And the second one is my neighbor's and I'm not about to pressure him to do anything with it. That wouldn't be fair. So, it's not helpful to dwell on that which can't be changed.

I understand about killing a maple with dirt. I've done that before. I plan to pocket plant periwinkle around it.

As I said, I will be installing drip irrigation. I've got 500 feet but don't expect to need that much.

Winter is deceiving as all the shade is from deciduous trees. A few small areas get about an 1 or 2 hours sunlight. The area on the SW side of the maple (furthest away to the right in the images), for example gets about 2 hours from the setting sun. This is why the illicium is over there along with Gardenia and knockout roses (not visible). This is the sunniest spot in my whole backyard and it's barely adequate for roses, but we are trying them.

The lower east-most areas (left in photo) get about an hour of midday sun. The rest gets zero direct sun when the trees are leafed out. I planted shade tolerant Azaleas and they are very happy so far (planted last March), as long as I can keep them watered. They are already putting on new growth and buds. I know from 30 years of growing azaleas. They'll be just fine. Azaleas are easy. Just give them friends, some acidic fertilizer, and leave them alone.

You can look at the lawn and see that it's poor in front of the embankment. The neighbor gave me some left over zoysia that I patched in there as a small section. The rest is sparse Bermuda grass and poa annua weed. That tells you there is no light for the Bermuda grass to grow, and the lawn gets far more sun than the bank does.

I do have to measure the PH before planting or applying top coating. I'm expecting some variability in that based on depth. But we'll see. I will tailor PH for the plants used in a given area.

I understand the advise on not wholesale replacing the soil when planting. But some of my plants require constantly moist soil. For those I will be adding biochar and organics to help the soil hold moisture. The sand won't hold moisture at all. And, yes I know how to charge biochar. And in all cases I will not be replacing all the soil, but likely just half of it, mixing the new blend with the indigenous sand.

The wall isn't as bad you make it seem. The lack of topsoil/grass makes it look worse than it is. When I put in new zoysia sod and raise the ground level enough to cover the bottoms of the block, it'll look much better. I can easily replace the block anytime without disturbing the plants or damaging the lawn. A new stone wall and larger river rock for the dry bed will just have to wait until next year. Unless someone wants to give me a $1500 to buy stone :). I'm not going to replace the wall and have to look at that barren bank all summer because I can't afford to do both at once. The plants will take time anyway. So best to plant soonest.

I'll look up Ficus pumila. I'm not familiar with that. If it climbs trees, fences, or walls, I don't want it though. That's what I like about small leaf periwinkle. It stays on the ground. Big leaf not so much. We'll also be putting in carpet bugle and common primrose to help fill bare spots. Likely a few other ground covers too. but no vines.

I'd like to have some breadbox sized boulders strewn about but I'm getting too old to horse those things around any more. So there will be less hardscape than I'd like.

Posts/threads like this one always amaze me. Why go to all the time and effort of a fairly detailed explanation, photos and a request for feedback and advice when you resoundingly contradict or discount all that has been provided??

Cut out the middleman (us) and do whatever you want.

"We have removed most of the junipers but removing the Sugar maples isn't an option."

I wish you'd told us this was because of the HOA. I knew HOAs could be restrictive but, sheesh, I never knew they could be that restrictive. "We've planted junk trees in your garden, and you're stuck dealing with them".

Even where my parents lived, I checked on whether I could remove a hideous (to me) maple in their backyard. It would have been OK (granted, I just checked w/a neighbor, but she was a retired RE agent herself, long selling in that retirement community) but our RE agent told me to just keep it.

UPDATE: all hail the power of satellite imagery! I can see that the family that bought my parent's house got rid of it! Selling a parent's house is even more stressful than selling your own LOL. I'm glad I'll never have to do that again! They actually hardscaped most of the back yard, which seems to be a trend these days. At least the hardscaping isn't going to fall on their house. 🤣

Sorry you feel that way Gardengal48. I appreciate everyone's input. I was just trying to clarify information. I got some advice and I'm hoping for more. I learned about a new vine that you suggested and I like the vine. Just not in my current situation. I learned that Gardenias in the shade may be a viable option. I was reminded to check and set the correct PH. I was warned about too much dirt at the base of a maple, and about wholesale soil replacement. Things I knew but it's good to have that reinforced by others. I'm thankful for that.

I'm not a novice at this by any means. I've been gardening for nearly 40 years with great success with just about anything I plant. I've built some amazing hardscapes too in my lifetime. Though there is much I can learn especially in a new geographic region. What someone suggests, I'll listen to and take it under advisement. I may do different based on my own experience, money, time, ability, unique conditions, or whatever. I wasn't asking about the aesthetics of my wall, and I made it clear the trees have to stay and the block wall has to wait. I live here; I know the soil and light situation. Sometimes you just have to take what people state at face value, even if no reason is given or whether you agree based on a photo. You gave me your inputs and I am thankful for them.

Perhaps I needed to be clearer about what I need to know more about: (i) how to make a sandy, dry, low light embankment best suited for flowers, shrubs, and small trees via soil amendment techniques; (ii) plant suggestions that work best in these conditions. Still looking for inputs on techniques to amend the soil, plants to use, and drip irrigation considerations.

An update. I tested my soil. I took 3 samples from different areas on the embankment. Also tested unaltered tap water for a baseline. The tap water was 7, all the soil samples were closer to 6. Slightly acidic. Evergreens will be amended with straight compost. A mixture of biochar, manure, and commercial garden soil mix will be furrowed into the open spaces of the garden. Plants that like very moist soil will be planted with this same mix in each hole.

Currently working to remove all the liriope in preparation for spring planting.

We planted 3 dwarf mugo pines at the base of the maple to help hide the roots. Used small seedlings that were easy to plant.. Hopefully, they'll take and find their way through the maple roots. If at least one survives, it'll be a win.

Planning to use periwinkle and ginger for ground covers.

Will be purchasing tall white camellia for the fence line, most likely "White by the gate".

We discovered Fatsia recently. There will be at least two of these planted, standard and spiderweb variants, one each. Looking to source these locally, but a bit too early in the year for the nurseries.

We have one Florida Sunburst Illicium. Seems happy, will probably add one more for its brightness.

Considering "Wolfpack" azaleas as a second row in front of the Formosa azaleas (which are thriving). Or might use gardenias or dwarf camellias. That spot remains a question mark.

Still looking for plant and irrigation suggestions.

The way to deal with roots (and rocks) is plugs. It's much easier to plant plugs than a bigger pot. I wouldn't go with periwinkle. It's invasive. I like tiarella/foam flower for a ground cover in shade. It's native. You can get plugs from The Pollen Nation. I've bought a lot from them, they are very good.

My extension service wasn't very keen on biochar. They said:

biochar isn't an amendment I recommend in most cases, even if a soil test shows a deficiency. There are usually better options for garden improvement. If you are trying to renovate a very poor soil site, however, it's a good option for helping condition that soil from the start.

I haven't read anything to suggest that biochar is helpful in amending sandy soil.

If your soil is sandy, on that slope, it's going to be fast-draining regardless of what you put in the planting holes. That mean you want to stay away from anything that likes it wet. I've had good luck with Marginal Wood fern and Christmas fern in dry shade, but many ferns like it wet.

Thanks for the input, Sigrid. We did plant mugo plugs. Easy to plant. We'll see if there is enough room in there to grow roots and thrive.

I have a lot of experience with periwinkle. The big leaf is the most invasive, and we don't like it and won't plant it. It will even climb into bushes, much like wintercreeper does. But the small leaf periwinkle is excellent for around shrubs as it does not climb. Yes it can smother tender herbaceous perennials. However it is easy to control with shears. Mostly it'll be around the evergreen shrubs at the top of the embankment.

We've had no luck with foam flower or Heuchera. From experience, we know that the Brunnera will spread like crazy and we'll leave it where we need to fill a bare spot. We will also be adding other ground covers too, like Ajuga, low Veronica, pachysandra, forget-me-nots, and common primrose. Probably a lot more Epimediums too.

Indigenous ferns are easy. We have a few but they were being smothered by the liriope. They'll be much happier when the liriope is gone, assuming we can get the liriope out without killing the ferns. Easy enough to add back as filler though. We also already have about 20 hostas in the ground.

Yes, biochar isn't for all situations. I've only used it in raised vegetable beds. It made a huge difference in both reducing watering needs as well as fruit production. On this bank, there is no poorer soil than what we have. It also is a very dry microclimate here. January & February we get some rain, but the rest of the year is crazy dry. So, we need something to hold moisture, at least somewhat better than sand alone. Applying Biochar is a well recognized method to retain moisture. We won't give in to the sand. Hence, we'll be adding biochar pre-charged with a lot of composted manure, added to bagged garden soil, and then mixed with the indigenous sand. We will apply biochar at levels appropriate for the plantings. For example the maples and azaleas won't get any directly at the root zone, but will just receive a topical application of manure and leaf compost, then covered with pine straw mulch. Whereas, the cimicifuga, ferns, spigelia, astilbe, etc. will be planted with a generous amount of the biochar mix in each hole. Other plants that like a more alkaline soil will get a little more biochar and less compost. At the very bottom of the hill where water likes to collect, we will use biochar more sparingly.

I've seen first hand how plants struggle on this bank in the hot dry summers we have. So, the bank will be supported with drip irrigation. The plan (as of right now) is to install drip irrigation sectioned off in two separately timed zones (to manage flow rate). Within the two sections there will be several valves to further control watering for specific plant needs. Plants that need a lot of water will get it; those that don't won't.

Update: We planted camillia along the fence at the top of the hill; added 3 Fatsias, and 4 Gumpo azaleas. Then today we planted 22 bareroot plants comprised of Bugbane, Astilbe, bleedinghearts, brunnera, and cinnamon fern. Looks like a stake garden right now.