We've been having the hot and dry weather too. What I do with my pots that aren't hanging is have large saucers beneath them. I also put mulch in them. I water them so the saucers fill up. This way I only need to water them every 3 days. These pots are all in areas that get the sun from very early morning to about 2pm. My hanging pots all have saucers. They are mulched too. I water my hanging pots usually every other day. You can buy these clear plastic saucer things that you can put on your hanging pots. They'll keep the water in so you don't have to water every day...unless you're in Vegas or Phoenix. :) Also I've heard some people use those pellets that hold water. You mix them in the soil. That's supposed to help too. Next year I'll try those.

Kat

Katusha, what kind of saucers are you referring to? Do you mean that you water your containers and then leave them in standing water? If so, that is something that I go to GREAT lenghts to avoid! I can see how it would mean you would water less, but this is not good for your plants to have no drainage at all. Or maybe I am misunderstanding what you are describing.

If you plant your plants in one pot, then set it in a larger pot, and fill in the gap with mulch, it will help with moisture. All containers should have good drainage, this is the most important thing!

Watering containers daily in August is just part of gardening! Yes, it is tiring, but why would this year be any different than others?

If used properly, the pot in saucer is not as strange as it seems. Try taking a typical plastic hanging basket apart. They come with saucers, and it's not just to keep water from splashing out the bottom. EVen the "saucerless" hanging baskets have internal saucers. They are designed to hold a resevoir of water at the root zone.

I very much agree you want drainage, and not to have roots drown. But, if used how intended, the resevoir doesn't keep that much water handy in full sun/blistering heat it doesn't go dry between waterings.

When it gets to near 100 degrees with full sun intensity on a cloudless day in our zone.....many plants........no matter how well watered just sit and simmer.

I've never had to water my containers daily, even my clay ones. I don't use straight potting mix - it dries out too quickly. I mix about 50:50 potting mix with topsoil, it retains moisture far better while still allowing adequate drainage. In past years I could go three, sometimes four days without watering and the plants were still top-notch and lush. Its just too hot, dry, and windy here this year. It *is* different this year in terms of growing conditions here in SE Michigan, at least in my opinion.

Must be rough in Michigan, it has been rough here this year. Though I dont know what the climate is like there normally, I would guess that if it is unusually hot and dry then some folks wouldnt know how to deal with it. It's just a way of life here in zone 6 Missouri. Can you really normally go that many days without watering containers? Wow.

I agree that allowing standing water in these conditions isnt too big a deal, everything will dry up quickly. However, be really careful not to do this in cooler weather and in the first couple of months of summer, because the standing water will cause a problem then. I had many people asking me what was wrong with their containers, and the problem was that there was no drainage holes in the containers at all! It still surprises me that they even sell such containers. No drainage like this will cause big problems in spring and early summer, when your plants are still young.

Ellen, like Calliope said, mine don't constantly stand in water. After 3 days the water is gone, but the soil in the pot isn't totally dry. The containers have drainage holes that take it up as needed. Like you, I wouldn't buy pots to put my plants in unless they had drainage holes. I've only been doing this for 7 yrs and in those 7 years we've had only one really wet summer. But then it only rained once or twice a week. But that was enough where we didn't water our lawn once(and it stayed green) and I seldom had to water the gardens. It was a very hot long summer then too. But that's not the norm for us here. It gets hot, but normally we don't have a couple of months of hot dry weather. Using these saucers has really helped in cutting down the time I spend on watering and my plants do well.

Kat

I just took some of my annuals out of the pots and put them in the ground. My beans didn't sprout very well, and I have empty space. I had to do that a few years ago when we had the drought.

Sally

I almost feel like apologizing, but I have containers by the dozen & the only one that looks bad is one with begonias in it which was hail damaged around Mem Day. Something fungal is going on with the stems & the plants are bedraggled. Aside from that, everything is lush & blooming well.

Al in Bay City, MI

Hi Al, I know that you are a container expert, do you allow your plants to stay this wet? Even during hot spells? I guess I am just in the habit of making sure that there is never water in saucers (outside and inside plants). Maybe I am concerned for nothing. Habit, I guess.

My containers look great also! Except for the ones that I didnt add topsoil, compost, and peat moss to the cheap potting soil I purchased for a mass container planting. Is generic potting soil quality getting worse? I have always used it for containers (because I have so many), mixed with compost at least. The past couple of years I have been really disgusted with Wal Mart brand. Who can afford to buy Miracle Grow p-soil or Shultz for 50 or 60 containers?! You get what you pay for I guess. Homemade compost is the BEST!

I build all my own soils from scratch & I try build them so containers are able to go 24 hours between waterings in the hottest part of summer with plants having well established roots in them. I attribute the good condition of my plants to a highly aerated soil that always drains well & the fact that over the years I have worked out how plants in the soils I use react to supplemental feeding. I also take great pains to insure foliage does not get wet while watering, and admit to using a fungicide regularly.

This year I am using Messenger, too, but am having some difficulty determining if it is working. I think it is causing blooms to last longer, but after 6 applications cannot say that it definitely is or isn't helping plant vitality.

I have many containers that are needing water twice/day now. Some of them are bonsai and about a dozen of them can't get through a day now, but most are just individual blooming plants I have planted in small containers (actually some are large containers, packed tight with established plants) scattered through the gardens, decks, etc. If I was asked, I would discourage the use of a soil that will remain moist after 2 days at this time of year. Air is as important as water for root health & the cause of many shabby looking containers is soil collapse & too much water retention which goes hand-in-hand with poor aeration.

Highly aerated soils have a price - frequent watering and fertilizing, but the rewards are great. Our job as container gardeners should be to guard aeration at all costs & worry about EVERYTHING else later. We can easily change the important things like water, sun, and nutrient supply, but what to do about soil after the planting is made? Probably absolutely nothing in near all cases.

I realize we all can't stand over our plants with a hose in our hand, and the soils we use need to be a compromise, balancing how much time we can afford to spend on watering with the water-holding capacity of soils we grow in. I can say that plants in a medium that requires watering every day will in (virtually) every case be healthier and grow better than those grown in a slower soil.

There is another benefit to a healthy root system. The healthy roots yield a stronger plant that is better able to fend off pathogens - fungal, viral, and insect related.

Also sorry to say that I can find no room in the soils I use for compost. The reason most cite for it's use is it promotes microbial activity and adds micro-nutrients. Microbial activity in a near 100% organic medium needs only N for huge populations to develop. As far as the micro-nutrients are concerned, there are other, more efficient delivery vehicles that will not impede drainage like compost. Compost is already in an advanced state of decay & breaks down very quickly in containers. For that reason, I leave it to the gardens.

In case there is a tendency to discount the above because of a feeling I might have exaggerated the condition of my container plantings, I'll be happy to snap a few pics & mail to any unbelievers. ;o)

Al

Al, I am a believer! :)

I always add compost to my containers because I love compost so much I want to put it everywhere!! I am actually now questioning what I use and why........why do I add the amounts of things that I do? Where did I learn just how much of this and that to add? It has been so long since I have analyzed this, I really dont know why anymore, I just do it. I reuse my container potting soil every year, after storing the containers in an unheated shed over winter. Then, I dump them in the wheelbarrow with all the other stuff. No real science to it. But now I am questioning myself of why I do it. I believe my reasons orginally were to improve the quality of the soil (to the touch) and to stretch potting soil out.........I mean, years ago I would purchase quality potting soil and generic, and mix it, just to make it stretch out. I still do this, however I do add all the other amendments as well. Yet, do I really know what I am doing or why????

Al, you have provoked me to research this a bit. I have seen your posts regarding your potting soil mixtures. Since I have been doing some mixing, it is time that I learned to do it with some meaning behind it. Though, I wont ever again try using a different seed starting and transplanting mix other than Pro Mix. I made the mistake of using a cheaper mix for this and the results were disastrous. What are your feelings about Pro Mix?

Post your photos here Al. There is nothing better than inspiring photos when feeling discouraged.

Thanks for your detailed response, it is always appreciated!

In the years I've been gardening, since 78, I've learned there are more ways than one to get plants to grow well. Before I had even heard about not letting indoor plants sit in a saucer of water, I had been doing that for years. I watered my plants till the water would fill the saucer. When the plant got dry, I watered it the same way....for years. Never had a problem. I've had African violets, amoung other houseplants, since the mid 70's. I've done outdoor gardening since 78, mostly annuals and a few pots. Since 97 I've gone into perennials and have 12 pots/hanging baskets (not a lot compared to others). For the past 5 yrs I haven't bought any soil for my pots/hanging baskets. The only soil I have added has been from the few hanging pots I've bought over the years. My pots stay outside over winter in one of my gardens. I don't pull the old plants until Spring. When I plant them in Spring, I always have worms in pots. It's just too expensive to buy soil for them every year. My planters turn out fine unless I have a new plant I tried and it just didn't work out well. I know there are many other gardeners who do this. I've found out over the years that if it works, then do it. People have many different opinions about how to garden. I've seen threads where people who do things the way a book says, get upset when others do things differently. They have actually told them that their way won't work. The one thing I won't try are chemical sprays for diseases and insects. If I have a plant that's prone to something, I won't buy it again or I'll get rid of it.
I love gardening. But like many others, I don't have the time or money to spend on things I really don't need to do.
There is more than one way to garden and they do work well. I depend on other gardeners ideas more than I do on books. Even though I've been gardening many years, I have still learned so much just reading on garden forums.
No matter how you garden...ENJOY!

Kat

Ellen asked a question of me & since it was on subject, I answered & expanded a bit. I didn't suggest that anyone changes anything they are doing, I only indicated what I've learned about soils & container plants over the years. That some one has been doing something the same way for a number of years doesn't make it the best way and often times you'll find it's not even a good way, but as long as some one is happy with the results of what they are doing, it's fine with me. For those that aren't happy with how things are going in the growing department, I offer some things to reflect on. I set down very good reasons that will hold up under scrutiny regarding what makes a good container soil. I don't mind disagreement with what I put forth. There are a few on the forums that can't wait to disagree with what I say. That's fine. Most times, when I find disagreement, it's after I describe certain things I suggest a grower not do & it happens to be what one of the readers is doing & they end up taking it personally - it's bound to happen.

FWIW - some info about plants in the heat: Maintaining a soil, at any time - cool or hot, that is anything more than moist will have an adverse effect on plant vitality. Plants need O2 in the root zone at all times to function properly. Roots deprived of O2 begin to die almost immediately - within hours. Roots are constantly in a state of flux. They die & regenerate constantly. The first roots to die are the important ones - the hair roots (tertiary roots) that are responsible for water & nutrient uptake. It takes energy to regenerate new roots - energy that could be going into foliage and or blooms. Soggy soil kills roots. If the soil remains soggy long enough, the secondary roots die (these are a little thicker than tertiary roots). When this occurs, the plant is already well on its way to collapse. Add the fact that the roots of most plants we grow in containers begin shutting down when actual root temperatures are between 90-95* F., and you can see that even if soils are properly moist, the plant is largely unable to take up water in extreme heat.

So, add together the loss of vigor via roots inability to function in an anaerobic setting and the energy drain from having to regenerate roots constantly, then factor in the heat, and it's easy to see why soggy soil is NOT a good idea at any time.

Though this is a technical point, it is a good illustration: If you have a container planting with a saucer under it and conditions are such that if you water the plant at a particular time & fill the saucer, the plant uses all the water, including that which was in the saucer and is just getting dry at the same time the next day, everything should be well - right? Not exactly. Because there was a period of saturated soil, some root death will have occurred. If the plant had been watered once in the morning and once in the evening so that the soil was never saturated, it would have been better than watering once. (If any disagree, please don't bring extraneous issues like washing fertilizer from the soil or other non-aeration/watering issues into the discussion). In addition, the two waterings would have offered more in the way of gas exchange at the root zone, another very important consideration. Each time we water, it pushes stale air from the roots & draws fresh air in behind it.

Building your own soils requires some effort. Effort to locate suitable ingredients and effort to build the soil, but they are much less expensive than prepared potting soils. I had used commercial mixes for years until I started to research soils. I'll never go back to a commercial mix. How strange it is that every disagreement I run into is from a person that has not tried a soil like I described - if they had, there would be no disagreement.

Yes, we garden to ENJOY, but any with empathy understand there is little joy in displaying a container in which the dirt (OK, soil) ;o) is the best looking part. These are the folks I'm talking to. A few of them will find some sense in what I say & want to try something different. Those that "have it down" can disregard whatever I say, or even disagree - we all learn from a good discussion.

Those that don't even wish to consider something different from the status quo, might do well to remember my old friend, Joe Pye. Joe would get up every morning before work and bang his head against the wall. One day he got tired of banging his head and kissed his wife goodbye instead. Joe never did go back to banging his head. Moral: If your happy with how things are growing, please continue, but at least allow there just might be a better way.

Al

Hey Al, wonderful reply!

I spend a lot of my time talking to gardeners---brand new gardeners, knowledgeable gardeners, old timers. I strive very hard to grow every single one of my plants (from seed to maturity) to the fullest of expectations. The plants that I grow in my display beds are like a "reference" for my gardening friends (who are now my customers). I am very much a perfectionist when it comes to this. However, I have learned that everyone has a different gardening style. Some take it very serious, some are just casual gardeners. Some take great pride in their blooms, some are just happy if they ever get one bloom! Some dont know the first thing about annuals/perennials, nor could they pronounce the names of their plants in their beds, some have the botanical names memorized that I dont even know. Some I have had to beat with a stick to get them to water regularly, some are wanting me to help install 50 soaker hoses in their beds next year. I have learned that I need to be very careful about how I comment on their flowers and displays, because, while I may know that the plant is not growing to its potential, and that it does not look like mine do, they may feel really proud of their accomplishment. It is totally the same here on gardenweb. I know that lots of folks want to tell some of us to get a life!!! However, gardening and all aspects of it pretty much is my life, and I have much respect for all those "perfectionists" and anyone and everyone who has devoted their careers to improving our gardening materials. What would it be like if plant breeders were not so meticulous with their work? What if they didnt take the time to learn and understand the small details along the way?

I know that what doesnt work for several of us will (miraculously) work just fine for someone out there. And every single one of us will have a different reason why. We are all different and all learn different and have interests in different things. But I do think we all have something to offer each other, whether it be gardening expertise or photos to share.

Al, my whole point was that there is more than one way to grow things. I think you do a great job, but many of us don't have the time for all the things you do, like watering twice a day. That's what MXK3 was saying and that's why I suggested the saucers and mulch. I never let my plants sit constantly in water. They do get dry on top, but having them in large saucers helps to keep them from drying out daily. In this heat and dry weather, the soil in my containers isn't soggy. As I said in my previous post, I rely and learn from helpful hints from other gardeners who have been in the same situations as I've been, whether it's watering, diseases or bugs. It's always good to listen to more than one opinion.
MXK3, after listening to us, I sure hope you're able to save some of your container plants. :)

Kat

You're lying about how well your plants are doing, Al. ;-D Now you just HAVE to post those picks! LOL [manipulative lil devil aren't I?]

Al, out of curiosity, have you ever tried watering your plants with a compost tea? I've run into several folks here and there who've mentioned doing so.

: )
Paul

First, if you want pics, you have to send me an e-mail. I don't know how to post to forum & am, for some reason, unable to send via GW mail. I am, however, able to send them in a reply to a GW message. I'll snap a few tonight if it doesn't storm (supposed to, thank the Lord). ;o)

Never used compost tea, but I hear it's good stuff. It surely is en vogue. I don't think I remember any specific posts reporting on its effectiveness, but would be interested in hearing from users.

Al

Al, not long ago, several of us learned how to imbed photos. Look for a post a few weeks back entitled "testing direct imbed of photos" or something like that. The instructions there are step by step. I would register with photobucket, very easy to navigate through. It wouldnt take you long to do this.

We are all dieing to see your pictures!!

I've read several places now that aerated/aerobically brewed compost tea is extremely helpful with fighting or preventing fungal/disease problems. I msut say, I've used it and had good results, but I haven't done much comparison to other methods.

That's all!

My containers are surviving,but it's a constant struggle with the wind and heat plus the lack of rain.
All the watering in the world doesn't make up for a regular drenching shower.My containers were so much more vibrant last year..ahhhhh the trials of a gardener!
Mother nature always has the last word,but then there's always next year...

Eliza Ann

just be thankful we aren't farmers depending on our crops!