Hi, Coey. No need to call yourself names :). Some people are more risk averse than others. I don't particularly like pests, but I'm not scared of them because I always won whenever some pest and I engaged :)

I've kept orchids outside in summer for at least five years, including catts, oncids, and phals. I had a few dends, cymbids and the odd this or that for a while as well.

I grow on a second story deck, but I've had no particular bug problems to speak of outdoors. I actually have had more problems with mites, aphids, mealies, scale on jasmine, gardenia and all sorts of other plants as well as orchids *indoors* in winter, where it's usually dimmer and more crowded and they have a better chance to multiply for a while before they are noticed.

I enjoy looking over each plant in the evenings as the heat of the day dissipates, and this may help catch them before they get a big start.

Outside, there are natural predators, as well as wind to keep the nasties from getting too comfortable. The light for catching on to them before they get a big foothold is also much better. And there's the hose to spray some of them off with.

I have had a couple of visits from grasshoppers, and some "butterfly" worms ensconced in thinner-leaved orchids a couple of times. One or two scale or mealies here or there. But this is a couple of times. If you take days x years x # of orchids as the denominator, you will see the probabilities are pretty small.

Indoors in winter, I've had real horror at times seeing what had been happily multiplying seemingly just outside of my view :)

What I have found to be the hard part of orchids outside is getting the shade right. Orchids want good light but most suffer if they get direct overhead sun at midday. It's not always easy to provide the right shade.

If you put any orchids out now, be sure to acclimate them gradually to the increasing light. No sun for at least a couple of days. Then g-r-a-d-u-a-l-l-y.

Good luck whatever you do.

Bugs live outside, you put orchids outside the bugs will find them. Absolutely count on it. I use the following home made mixture which works well on the little buggers.

1 part soap
1 part alcohol
8 parts water.

409 from the kitchen works well, HD sells agricultural insecticidal soap which is probably better.

Rubbing alcohol is good enough, if you want the little critters to feel good before they die use Jack Daniel, black label.

Tap water works for me, if you live in an upscale neighborhood use Perrier, I'm sure the bugs expect no less.

Whatever you use, remember you only kill the adults, to get their cute little babies you need to repeat after 3 days and maybe repeat again.

Nick

Whatever pests you have to deal with is a regional issue. The worst place, IMO, is the South for orchid pests. Number one problem is roaches. They will absolutely do in a mini if given the chance, and I suspect that there's a toxin in their saliva that will do the rest of the job even if you get them before they eat everything. I've lost several valuable plants to them. Another problem some people have is scale, especially the tiny white scale that the southern magnolia is host to. If your plants are anywhere near a magnolia, expect trouble.

Since you're in Washington, I would expect snails and slugs to be the worst you have to deal with. These pests will only be a problem for potted plants that afford them easy access. You may have the occasional opportunistic grasshopper experimenting with a leaf here and there, but nothing else I can think of.

The problem with orchid pests is that most of them are nocturnal, so that by the time you discover there's a problem -- even if you inspect daily -- the damage has already been done. I have a greenhouse, and must be proactive with my countermeasures. Lately I've been using a spray with .25% Permethrin which seems to be driving the roaches away.

You probably have other dangers (i.e. wind, too much rain, etc.) that are more serious.

-Bruce C.

Ever since the newly forming seed pods were eaten clean off my Sprekelia bulbs, I've been more paranoid than ever to bring my plants outdoors, even though I know that they would benefit greatly from the sun and the changing seasons. Here in Central Illinois, the pests are many... slugs, snails, caterpillars of various types, and the mass amounts of Japanese beetles that are presently devouring everything in their path!

I have a pink French Pussywillow shrub that has been absolutely destroyed by these beetles, and it's only taken them about a week to completely strip the poor shrub of every green leaf it had!

I've sprayed with insecticide, hosed the beetles to kingdom come, and even tried a systemic feed/insecticide to rid the shrub of these shiny black and green monsters... to no avail! They choose the plants they like most, eat them, and then move on to the next plant on the menu!

I really hesitate to use strong chemicals in the gardens because I don't want to kill the good bugs in the process of eliminating the bad ones... we have awesome Praying Mantises that hunt the gardens, and lots of frogs and toads that help, too. Unfortunately, they just can't keep ahead of the beetles!

I've decided it's safer to keep my precious orchids indoors, and watch vigilantly for mites and scale and all that, than to find out the hard way that orchids are a favorite appetizer to these voracious beetles!

Those of you that can summer your orchids outdoors without too much insect damage are extremely lucky! I'm fearful as all get-out that if I bring mine outside, they'll be history by the next morning!

I can sympathize with those fighting the Japanese beatles, this year, no chemicals or sprays, just the old fashioned way...pick them off and drop into a bucket of soapy water. For me this works, since I each day there are fewer and fewer, maybe word got out among the pests that a drowning is their fate... Interestingly, they were devouring my clematis and roses, but they left the vanda alone!!

as to the orchids, I never had luck with them until I speant some time researching how to grow them, and everything I read said to give them lots of light and fresh air with humidity. Now, all orchids in my collection bloom since I keep them outdoors in the spring through fall. In fact, I don't know how to get a plant to bloom without subjecting it to at least some outdoor air...and the fresh humid air in the spring and fall gives the best blooms. The vanda, oncidiums, and dendrobiums, bloom like gangbusters ever since that one summer when I placed them outside. Friends who are die-hard indoor growers and would never think of setting their precious orchid outside are amazed at the substance, fragrance, and size of the flowers on my plants, comparred to thier coddeled, baby-ed plant with no leaf imperfections, since it never got a little sunburn. I tell them I raise orchids, not foliage plants, lol!! I see a little scar on a plant, and I get excited since I know it will flower well.

Hear! Hear! Well said, bradarmi. My orchids have always responded with growth and spikes to being outside, too.

My plants have always had dinged and sometimes burned leaves, too. But the growth response to being outdoors is astonishing, and new leaves and growths keep coming at a fast pace compared to inside. Something like 2:1. Worth squinting past a few dinged leaves, IMO.

But it's also true that pests have always been more of a problem for me indoors than out. It's also true that the pests are more likely to appear on an ailing plant than on a healthy one.

On my upper level deck the orchids are not near any bushes or trees that might be afflicted with something, and there's a nice wind there except at the hottest part of the day, when it dies down.

I can't grow at ground level because there are armies of marauding rabbits to eat everything but petunias (poisonous) down to the roots. Gratefully, I don't get mosquitoes up there, either. A couple of little toads have come, tho :).

Hi jodik -- my apologies for straying a bit off topic, but it is possible to get the upper hand on Japanese beetles. I'm originally from upstate New York, where they can get bad like you describe. Since beetles usually don't stray far from where they emerge from the ground, a couple of simple strategies can do wonders. Combining the use of bait traps as well as milky spore (both inexpensive) will greatly reduce their numbers.

Of course, if your next-door neighbors treated their yards similarly, you'd see exponential results.

Good luck!

-Bruce

If my orchids can just hang on another year, there will be a greenhouse in which to grow them. We've got a 10'x12' Harbor Freight special sitting in a box in the garage. Other projects are a bit more important, so the greenhouse will have to wait a little while, but once it's up, and the water and gas are all hooked up, the orchids will be much happier! In fact, all of my plants will be much happier, and much healthier, too!

I live out in the country, and can barely see a neighboring house from here! There are wonderful advantages to living out in the boonies, but one of the disadvantages is masses of insects! We have ticks, biting flies, mosquitoes, beetles, snails, slugs, aphids, spiders... and many, many more! We also have a fantastic praying mantis population, but they just can't keep up with the marauding beetles!

If I were to hand-pick these beetles off the plants in the gardens, I could literally devote all day to the project... and I'd be lucky to make a dent in the numbers! They were so thick on the pussywillow shrub, there was actually a discernible layer of bug manure under it... I kid you not!

I know my plants would grow much better, and would most likely flower sooner, if I brought them all outdoors for the summer... but my paranoia of losing them to some hungry pest, be it insect or furry critter, is too great. Next year, they'll have a greenhouse for protection, and I will finally be able to give them what they need, without fearing their loss!

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news jodik but you will get bugs in the g/h too :>)

Brooke

I think they like the greenhouse even better, healthier, juicier plants make a better meal.

Nick

Brooke is right, GH's don't do away with bugs but it does make debugging a lot easier to keep up with. I use to have orchids strung all over the yard under the trees. Having them in one place has made a lot of things a LOT easier.
Pat...

I agree pcan, I have mine all over the trees and this morning I speant 2 hours watering/fertilizing them (also known as putzing around, by friends and neighbors). A greenhouse would be easier...hopefully this year.

if you sprinkle diatomite on the medium or add it to the medium, wouldn't that help in controlling bugs?
sue

In NY I have Japanese Beetles all over eating my husbands roses. I don't use insecticides so he can spend hours handpicking and dropping them into a coffee can of alcohol.

The beetles have never touched my orchids. I have over 100 outside and have never seen one on them. I don't think they like orchids! Some of my plants are on the ground and the biggest annoyance are ants. I leave them alone all summer, but they get drowned before coming in the house in the fall.

The amount of growth and health outdoors is worth more than worrying about bugs.

Jane

I fully expect some bugs in a greenhouse environment, but I would think they'd be a lot easier to control... I can spray, and not feel guilty about killing the good bugs!

I'm probably a bit more paranoid about bugs on my orchids because my collection is so new and still so small... once I've killed a few more plants, and collected quite a few more, I'll most likely not feel this way. But for now... call me paranoid!

The plants grow so well outdoors during the summer that I feel it's worth any risk. I do take precautions, however. I keep them up off the ground and slip the pots into hanging baskets so that no creepy crawlies will get into the pots. Then I inspect them periodically for insects or damage.

In the middle of the summer I give them a dose of Bayer Advanced Rose and Flower systemic spray as a preventative. And just before they come in at the end of the season they get a couple of doses of the systemic spray a week apart, both the leaves and the medium. This last treatment is the most important, as insects love it indoors and they thrive beyond belief. This way there is no gamble or guesswork.

Diatomite is great for snails and slugs. The big ones you can see are no problem but those annoying little 'Bush Snails' which live down in the roots and come out at night are controlled beautifully by the Diatomite. As are the root dwelling slugs. I don't know that it does anything for any other critters.

The biggest problem with Diatomite is getting it out of the bag. I got some sitting around and I use it much less often than I should.

Nick

Hi, Coey,

As you can see, there are pros and cons, with most of the cons being manageable. Much of it depends on your comfort level.

One option would be to put a few orchids out, acclimating they gradually, and see if your concerns about bugs change.

My orchids are inside this summer and were outside the 2 summers before in a (theoretically) squirrel-proof lathe house on the stone patio. Also, the shelves were about an inch off the ground, which may have helped w/ snails and slugs. (Lathe house is my romantic term - everything's plastic and from HD. :))

A couple of leaves got sunburned, and grasshoppers chewed on a couple of others, but that was about it.

The plants got a systemic twice before coming inside.

This year, I decided to leave them inside because, when it was still too cool for anything outside, wind blew over the lathe house twice in a week or so.

Also, other parts of life have needed extra time and energy, and I didn't figure out a way to secure the lathe house to the 4"x 4" wooden supports for the deck above that would look even halfway decent for 'burb neighbors. The orchids are still inside, with the lathe house still unassembled.

Last summer:

{{gwi:172485}}

This spring/summer, we've had unusually pleasant weather, so the windows could be open more than usual, which has let me feel a bit less guilty.

No matter, every time a plant shows the tiniest bit of unhappiness, I think, "See, that wouldn't have happened if it was outside." :)

All the best with your decision,

Whitecat8

Being in NY myself I can verify that JBs are REALLY bad again this year. They were really bad last year as well. I used grubX this spring and have 2 traps out. I've caught THOUSANDS this year. Last year I caught 5 quart sized jars full. That's a TON of JBs!

But have you found JB's on your orchids? We always have tons on the rose bushes and the Hibiscus get totally eaten, but I've never found one on my orchids.

Maybe mine have just have a taste for roses...

Whitecat, you kept your plants inside? Make a comparison this Fall. I'd be curious.

Jane

Jane, yeah, we'll see how they do. Not as well, I'm guessing, unless the whole structure blew over while they were outside. We've had unusually high winds this spring and summer. WC8

Tommy your Japanese Beetle traps are calling them to your yard. You need your neighbors to hang the traps to call them from your yard :>)

Brooke

Hi Whitecat, I'm just around the Big Lake from you in NW Ontario; I have nearly all of my plants outside again this season ad I was curious to know what the "systmeic" was and is used for?
Thanks!
Karmen

I've, also, heard that hanging out the Japanese beetle traps only attracts them more! The traps contain some kind of pheromone that draws them in, I believe. I've nixed the traps, and use a systemic on the roses. I spray the plants I don't want them to destroy, and hope they go for the plants that I can bear to lose, instead.

My comfort level is just too low at this point in time, and I really don't have a decent spot to summer my plants outdoors, anyway. With the greenhouse still in boxes until next year, it'll be at least until then that my comfort level stays this low.

I've already lost important seed pods, and seedlings, to the insect world... I'd be devastated if I lost an orchid!

A systemic is a product that is absorbed by the plant and is spread through it's entire system. It does not wash off. An insecticide or fungicide can be systemic, protecting every part of the plant. Bayer Advanced Rose and Flower spray, for example, is a systemic insecticide that lasts for several weeks.

I use the granules, and water them in after sprinkling the desired amount around the base of the plant. It doesn't seem to matter which brand of what I use... the Japanese beetles keep feasting! I'm afraid I'm going to have to use the Sevin, and I really didn't want to...

Karmen, hi, neighbor! Systemic isn't the right word for 1600 X-clude, a time-release insecticidal w/ natural pyrethrum as the active ingredient (from chrysanthemum flowers).

Despite what the Web site says, I wouldn't use it in the house w/ our dogs and cats. (Don't remember what the label says.)

The advantage for me is that you can group a lot of plants together and spray all of them at once.

Hope this is helpful.

WC8

Here is a link that might be useful: 1600 X-clude