The pumping mechanism which moves water from the soil up into a plant requires transpiration from the leaves - no leaves, no pumping. I don't know how much time is required to move the Bayer soil drench product from the soil up into your plant but it would be pointless to apply it before the plant has started to leaf out. The Bayer label says much the same thing: "Begin application in the spring when new growth begins".

Logical response, Mike. Trouble is, here along the Jersey shore ... and jess in PA may have the same situation, hence her question ... is that there has been new growth all winter long! From reading these threads, apparently I'm not the only one in the 6-7 zone range whose roses never truly went dormant. As a matter of fact, the leaves on Gourmet Popcorn are amazing, even with some nights in the the 20's and even down to the teens.

It's certainly nice to see some green, and to see new leaves coming out so soon ... but it sure throws a monkey wrench into the pruning and pest/disease management routine.

I recommended in another thread to start application when you would start fertilizing, since Bayer Advanced All-In-One contains a fertilizer. I think the fertilizer part is the driver.

I still contend that you need an additional fungicide to provide prevention during the time it takes Bayer Advanced All-In-One to become fully effective.

I have a question about the Bayer drench for blackspot. I adore Angel Face and know it is one of the worst to BS. My plant is in the ground, blooming [bought it in Houston at a nursery, it already had lots of buds] but it is to get 31 degrees here tonight, raining now. I was wondering if I used the systemic Bayer drench in addition to spraying with my hand sprayer, if this would help contol the blackspot. But since the drench has fertilizer, not sure if my newly planted Angel Face should have that. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated! Thanks!
Judith

Alameda, my thoughts, for what they're worth: The soil drench has so many disadvantages, including greater cost, greater effort, lack of flexibility in fertilizing, season-long use of an insecticide, use of at least twice as much pesticide per season and probably inferior blackspot protection that I figure the main reason why people use the darned stuff is they're afraid to spray a fungicide! So...if you're going to spray anyhow, why not just spray and forget the drench?

What Mike said...

Diane,
Has anyone tried this stuff for midge? Since we can't see 'em, maybe a drench is the answer. Does that Bayer Soil and Turf product actually enter the plant or is all the dirty work done in the soil?

What Mike said . . .
If you do that, you can use the least-harmful material that will do the job, rather than using a sledgehammer to kill a skeeter.

Jeri

I started using it ever since my blaze climbing rose got black spot one year and lost almost its leaves and flowers. I was not spraying on a regular bases and once it got it it really did a number on the Blaze that year. Last year was the first year I used Bayer and no black spot and I stayed more on top of keeping a eye out for black spot. I seemed to be happy with the result.. That is the only reason I wanted to use it again this year.

Harry, I have used the Bayer Advanced Tree and Shrub granules successfully for midge. The label says that the active ingredient (imadacloprid) stays in the plant for a year. I kinda doubt it, but I applied it in late Feb. as in the Oregon State University study and it was effective all summer. It completely eradicated my midge problems last year. I applied it again last weekend after pruning. I believe it kills the pupating midge in the soil, and also goes into the plant to kill the larva that feed on the tender shoots and blooms. I just sprinkle a little around each rose after pruning.
Kathy

Let me chime in here by saying THINK TWICE before you use a product like this. There's a downward cycle that happens when you kill all the beneficials wasps, earthworms, and microbial life in the soil--and that's what happens with products like this. A systemic is the equivalent of chemotherapy in humans-- think twice. I took over maintenance of a garden where this product had been used and it took the bushes at least a year to recover. We have LESS insect damage and better foliage without the 3-in-1 than we did with it.

Not to hijack the thread, but Harry, if you are using the Bayer Advanced Complete Insect Killer for Soil and Turf hose-end product to drench around the soil, then you are getting a much higher level of concentration of imidacloprid (and the addition of beta-cyfluthrin) than in the All-in-One. Ideally, we would only use it for a shorter period of time than one would use the All-In-One. Ideally, we would only need two (mac three) treatments to be rid of midge. Ideally...

Diane,
But is the Bayer Complete Insect Killer for Soil and Turf hose end product actually entering the plant as a systemic or just killing the devils in the soil?

Hmmm. I don't know why imidacloprid would act differently whether applied as a drench from a bucket or applied as a drench via a hose end sprayer. So, I would say it is having both actions.

Whether the systemic action is enough to affect the midge on the plant, I don't know.

So, the Bayer Advanced Complete Insect Killer For Soil & Turf Ready-To-Spray site says this:
This product is a totally different way to control the insects that want to destroy your prized lawn, roses, flowers, and other ornamental plants. The unique two-way blend of insecticides controls current insect pest problems and prevents reinfestations for up to 90 days. The residual component is actually taken into the plant. Rain or water cannot wash off this internal protection! Insects are killed when they come into contact with the product or when they attempt to eat the plant.

So, they are saying that there is a systemic action as well as the contact.

Thanks Diane. I never thought to read the container.