Ladybugs are cheap. I would go get a big amount of them

Leslie - I so feel your pain! My Charles de Mills & Soleil d'Or looked like that - till I used the insecticidal soap (the pet & kid safe one) in desperation after washing them off did not help. I've lost a lot of buds on Renie des Violettes to these monsters as well! This is the worst year of Aphids I've had - never seen it this bad. I got two bags of Lady bugs but as usual only a few stayed behind - and those are all gone now too. The Aphid problem has gotten a bit better as well - Thank God!

Good luck with these buggers - they really make my skin crawl. urgh!

Aprille

We, too, had a remarkable early show of aphids.

Then, the bushtits showed up, and in about 2 days, that problem was history.
Love them lil' bush tits!
;-)

Jeri

Thanks for sharing my frustration and disgust:) I did buy 1500 ladybugs and set them loose according to the instructions. I can find on any given day maybe a dozen on them. Sometimes they're just busy with each other:) Maybe they're making new ladybugs??

Birds aren't coming in the yard with all the cats. We had several hundred Cliff Swallows last year about the first of April sweep down and eat up all the white flies, which I have in over abundance also. The home owners destroyed their nests that they kept trying to make last year and this year I noticed only a few came back. I hope these same neighbors have as many whiteflies as I do, there's poetic justice for you.

So my next hope is when my 100's of toads arrive I've got plenty for them to chow down on. I got this off of a rose yesterday also. This will be the 3rd year for the toads, so I sure hope they show up on schedule. They like eating the rose slugs and budworms and other misc catepillars or worms or whatever. I can't tell them apart, I just know how much destruction they caused last summer.
{{gwi:245939}}
Can't say I've ever seen any Bushtits around Jeri, sure would like to:)

Yes Aprille, I got the one too that said it was safe for animals and ladybugs:) I looked last night Kate and didn't see any difference, I applied more. They coat me too just getting near the bushes, they're all over me.

Ugh, that sounds (and looks) awful. I hope they disappear soon.

Can't say I've ever seen any Bushtits around Jeri, sure would like to:)

*** They're grey. VERY fast-moving.
About the size of a Hummingbird, and they hop around the plants and chirp quite musically.

Took 'em about 2 days to eliminate our bumper crop of aphids.
I think they left just enough behind for the sparrows to feed their babies.

Jeri

I have been fighting mine for weeks. I have been using the insecticidal soap or the hose every couple of days. Yes the soap kills them. I can't wait until they are gone but of course then it will be JB time! yikes!

I know there is a ton of aphids there... but that doesn't look like aphid damage... Any idea what it could be anyone?

Well, there could be some thrips.
But really bad aphids could do that.
If you want to see really ugly aphids, tho -- y'all ought to see BLACK aphids.
-SHUDDER-

Jeri

It might be soon enough for thrips also, but the aphids are so thick they've crawled inside the sepals and coated the bud from the inside as well as the outside. Then the underneath side of these buds just opening are coated with aphids as are the underneath side of the sepals full opened. All the blooms even open have a coating too. There are just that many of them. This one rose bush is Irresistible and it's almost 5 feet tall and easily that wide covered with hundreds of ruined buds/blooms. I know what thrips damage looks like also and my whites and blends will have them also, haven't seen too many yet of them.

I let the insecticidal soap sit on for two days and haven't watered for 3 it's been too cool, but I'm going to wash these off tomorrow and spray again.

Thanks for the help, I appreciate your opinions.
Les

I feel your pain! I have them on my roses in the front garden but not out back. Too weird. Mine are the green kind and I don't remember when I've seen so many. We usually just get a few on the BP Icebergs and maybe the Westerlands but this year they are on all the roses. The good news is I've seen lots of ladybugs in the last few days and hoards of some type of fly/wasp looking insects that are swarming the roses and seem to be eating the aphids.

Maybe it's a CA. thing this year? I hope you and your roses get some relief soon!

Jeri, we had those black aphids on some black locust trees that came up as suckers from a purple robe locust. Nasty things! They so infested the trees that we had to take them out. They made a complete mess of the white fence. We haven't seen any since the trees were removed, thank goodness.

I live in So Cal and we had them really bad this year too. Just kept hosing them off. After a week or so they were mostly gone. We also had tons of thrips this year. I ended up spraying just the buds and blooms with Bayer insect for roses and flowers, seems to have done the job.

Big infestation of aphids and slow startup of ladybugs this year. However, the ladybugs are going to win the day shortly. I keep finding them two at a time making new ladybugs.

Must be something to do with weather conditions, good for aphids, not so good for ladybugs.

I won't spray because I know the good guys will soon have re-enforcements. I bet by the weekend, the aphid population is considerably reduced.

I've had them build up and be this thick though for the last couple of weeks though. I keep thinking it'll be the end soon and it's not. I have both green and brown aphids, haven't seen any black. At first they were only on the grass green foliage and then the darker green. The red edge and red foliage was last. Interesting Chicago Peace has the very least aphids of any rose except the Hybrid Bracteatas.

I was of the opinion that though our temps are swinging cool to warm and back to cool, that it was lack of rain bringing out so many. But, I had less aphids last year and a lot less rain. So, that theory went out the window. Ladybugs don't stir until it gets above 55 and to be really active 60's and above. I'll probably get rid of these just as the thrips arrive in force. I had hoped to have a few months of my whites but guess I'll have to wait until fall now. That is so disappointing.

Aphids are usually that bad here in the early summer. I just squish and squish and squish - use gloves or paper towels. Sometimes I just use my fingers - but what a mess! I don't let it bother me too much....just keep on squishin'.

Carol :)

Forgot to say that someone on this forum (I'm not very good at remembering who said what) had the idea of putting flour inside a nylon stocking. The flour is shaken over the aphids and suffocates them. Haven't tried this, but sounds like a GREAT idea!

Carol

I squish too and then the brown/green stain gets in the dry parts of my fingers and nails and won't come out. It's especially disgusting when I want to eat sunseeds thinking I'm sucking bug juice off, ick. *LOL*

I thought about the flour, but the sprinklers water over head, I figured that would make a real mess.

Leslie I wonder if there is something you can plant that is even more enticing to aphids. There must be some other plant that is aphid nirvana besides Roses.

Kate

This is probably the angle I should have shown to being with:) The aphids crawl inside the sepals when the buds get a certain size and when the roses open they've already been discolored by the aphids. That's why I sure it's not just thrips in them too.

This pic is after two days of spray and I didn't stint on it either, the bushes were dripping when I was done.
{{gwi:245940}}

Nope Kate, I haven't done anything different, just we had a wet winter that was supposed to be normal for us instead of a really dry one like usual with the drought. I have some weeds growing on the side of the house where nothing is but some CA popplies and these are all over them too. Garlic is supposed to keep them away, I have a couple of plants and it doesn't make any difference. I'm about to go try marigolds and I really don't like them:) They're thick in a few of the daylillies which are going to start blooming too.

Les -- Do you spray regularly?
I thought I had a larger group of aphids than I normally see, but you have shown mine to be nothing.
Somethin' not right here.

Jeri

No, I don't spray because my garden is so young and most of the subdivision is only a year old. A lot of homes haven't put yards in yet and I'm trying to encourage the beneficials to come and multiply. Instead I get these. The only thing I have but it's been there all along is a ponding basin behind us to one side in the back. It didn't matter previous years. In another week or so there should be literally 1000's of little toads emerging. I get several hundred that stick around my house and yards. I even put up homes for them to encourage them to stay and give them shelter from the sun and heat:) For the first month there are just waves of them crossing the streets. The neighbors hate them but I think they're great. They eat the white flies and the aphids and the rose slugs. We had a multitude of Cliff Swallows coming in the past and the neighbors washed down their nests so many times last year that only a few showed up this year. They usually take care of the bugs pretty swiftly and keep them down. I have a lot of ignorant neighbors.

I did not have this many previous 2 years here and when I lived in Visalia before never had this many aphids on my roses.

We were in OSH tonight and I picked up another batch of Ladybugs, 2 praying mantis egg cases, which won't help me right now. Those are supposed to have 200 each in them. I also went ahead and bought Marigolds which do stink and I don't like. I found some different colors though. We'll see if this helps. I washed all the roses off today so they were clean of soap for the Ladies:) I hope more of this batch stays. If not this year, maybe they'll show up to help next spring. I had that happen once when I bought them previously in the mtns. The following spring there were just clouds of them and every year after:)

I don't let the pest guy spray the garden and the fences either. I've got a lot of bees visiting all the blooms I have and I really hate to spray anything stronger than the Safer Soap I tried.

Thanks for the thoughts though, they're always appreciated.
Les

Jeri, would these be the black aphids you're referring to? These are on an awful Dr Hey that has massive aphid infestation as well as PM. Just curious, I caught this on a pic and thought I'd ask. Thanks, Les
{{gwi:245941}}

Looks like my black aphids, only those look bigger.
The ones I've had (not on roses, I see them on epiphyllum blooms) -- I'll get photos later today, or try to. I'm sure I can find one or two of them left.

Les, the only thing I can think of on your overall problem, is that since the development is that new, no real overall ecology has developed there?????
Maybe something to do with fill dirt used?
Something's just not "right" there, it seems to me.

Jeri

I think it all is a circle, an over abundance of something and nature creates another over abundance of something else to balance it out. Mine is just whacked out this year with them driving off all the birds. They put up those reflective strips so they won't make their mud nests on their houses. I get that they're messy, they don't get they're considered an endangered species and everytime they washed the nests off and after they were built with babies they were violating it.

You're right they take all the good top soil off, I've spent the last couple of years amending it to encourage worms to come. I do have nice big fat juicy ones of several kinds:) I'm doing well with the soil, it's above ground that's bad.

More of the ladybugs I bought stayed, so I'm going to pick up some more this evening.

I appreciate your help. I keep a file and notes with the different pests on it for reference to help others too. Thanks Jeri, pics always help.

These little guys are hard to photo, they blend in so well. There's another really little one top of the pic by a piece of bark, you can see his face peeking out. He wanted to join these two sitting there catching flies. They drove him on by when he ventured close. I might have too much time on my hands sometimes. I was out taking pics and catching budworms to throw to them that early morning. The biggest toad there I think was like 2" body:)
{{gwi:245942}}

Have you ever sprayed with water set on high where the flower stems bend with the stream of water and all the little aphids go flying into the air? It's hilarious!

Les I love the little frogs. I think they're great and apparently quite helpful. So they have begun arriving apparently. Hopefully they will get right down to the good work of waging war on the aphids.

Kate

Yes I get great satisfaction from blasting the little buggers, sets the white flies off too:) Then I have to brush my clothes off before I come in.

Nope Kate, that's from last June. I was sitting out watching them. They got my attention when these two got together when I quit moving and I call it a 'meet and confer':) They sat there catching flies on each other and that piece of bark. I'm easily amused, LOL*

I LOVE THOSE FROGS!
Gosh, I sure wish we had frogs. I gotta settle for lizards.

Jeri

Actually Jeri they're kind of fascinating to watch. They don't hop they walk. See that one has it's back legs stretched out, I caught him walking as I got this pic:) I didn't say these little guys will climb bushes which is why I'm so happy when they arrive late spring. I've caught them up inside the mums. They sit there and wait for bugs, therefore they climb the roses too. One day I was looking out the window and kept seeing the mums wiggle, this is a large, tall bush with no breeze. I finally caught sight, there were several toads up inside it. They use them for shelter too.

I like lizards too, I caught sight on a couple last summer. They like the corner fence where I have the rugosa at.

There are aphids like that in my garden every year. I never thought it was unusual. I can always tell when they're out of control because I will see residue on the leaves. Blasting them into the wild blue yonder a couple of times takes care of them.

As the aphids began to take over in my garage grow room late this winter, my grandson and I would gather up all the ladybugs we could find each day in the house and put them on the infested cuttings in the garage. We could only find some of the ladybugs after a few days, but the little sweeties deposited clusters of eggs before they left. It's my understanding that parent ladybugs lay eggs near aphid infestations so their young-uns will have plenty to eat when they emerge. So, if you find something on the underside of your leaves that looks like a double row of little yellow or orange beads, the ladybugs have been at work and their larvae will be the cavalry that you're expecting to come to your rescue.

Some photos of ladybugs, and eggs, and larvae can be found at the site below.

Here is a link that might be useful: Ladybug Photo Archive

Take an old piece of panty hose, make a cup, and fill with plain flour. Dust the aphids with this and many willcash in their chips immediately. The flour clogs their pores so they can't get rid of the Sun Dew they are exuding and they drown in their own juices. In a few minutes, you can wash the dead ones off, put the duster in a zip lock bag, and be set for the next infestation. Using flour is the "green" solution, because the flour is biodegradable and won't contribute poisons to the environment.

I've been 'blasting' the aphids off for several weeks now, they come back just as thickly later in the day even. All the roses now show the effect of way too much water because it cooled off here. One rose is about totally defoliated from it. When it's hot the extra water doesn't matter much. So now I have double trouble, bad foliage and 1000's of buds and blooms that look like this.

Great site Connie, thanks. I'll be on the lookout for young ladybugs. A lof of the ones I bought were more interested in each other than eating aphids. I have a few but the amount of aphids is way more than they can consume. I had seen some of the larva before and didn't realize or remember they were ladybugs.

With the bees all over the roses now I don't want to spray. Guess I will try the flour thing, wet flour will be as bad looking as the aphids anyways:) I'm out of other options.
Thank you for your opinons and observations.

We had them this bad a few years ago and I used pyrethrin spray 3 days running without letting up at dark and it really eliminated 98% of them.

Yes Patricia but what would that do to all the bees, ladybugs I do have and the toads in residence? I don't want the aphids but I'm afraid of killing everything else. Sooner or later they have to leave or be eaten by something else if I keep trying. I found out the hard way last year that my minis don't like the spray. The large roses take it in stride but I defoliated all the minis for two years running. I really don't want to do that again.

Thank you though for the information. I have a friend growing large roses with a similar aphid problem, I'll pass this info on to her. She's in a long established area here.

I used to have aphids galore, here in zone 9 calif. but now there are almost none for about 3 years now. It seems to be the bushtit birds I call my buddies do eat the aphids especially to feed thier babies with. There was a nest in one of my trees, and i discovered it was thier nest it looked like a bag hagging from a tree stem up high. Oh and that green worm with white stripes comes from the hummer type bees laying eggs on rosebuds. They gorge on aphids too.

Les, are your neighbors that hate the swallows also going to figure out a way to prevent the frogs from coming through your neighborhood? If they don't know any better, do you think they might...? Have you told your neighbors about your aphids, the birds and what the frogs will do?

I hope the flour treatment helps with the aphids; I'm going to try it tomorrow morning too.

Well, if it affected my bee and bird, worm population, etc., I never saw any evidence of it. We have to walk amidst swarms of bees (if you have ever seen pictures of my garden, there are nearly always bees on my roses) and birds by the dozens at my birdbath each day. If you do it before daylight or at sundown, it should not be a problem.

Hummer bees I mean bees that look different than a regular honey bee. I don't get to see them very much (hummer bees or hover bees)but I believe they are almost as big as honey bees, but are dark grey and white, or black and white.

Don't know why I call them Hummer, I guess they should be Hover? bees. They fly and hover around the roses and then fly in and lay some eggs.

Hummer--hmmm maybe they humm as they hover? I am referring to the green worm pic which has two white stripes, it looks like the hover bees larvae which gobble up aphids.

I haven't sprayed anything but blasts of water at aphids in the past, years ago. Which also helped as Berndoodle and maybe others has mentioned. But anyway, things could be different in other zones etc...just letting you know the aphids aren't bugging my roses as much in last 3 years or so... maybe the blasts of water, the birds and hover bees have helped the problem here:)...Watch, now I will get swarms of aphids, Murphy's law!

les,what is that white stuff on the buds in your pictures (with the black aphids).I have it on some of my roses and I'm not sure it's something I have to worry about.I think it might be aphid residue.

Deebs, I have 5 trees planted, 2 in the back, but it'll be awhile before they get large enough for the birds to nest in them. They used to use my large climbers too. With all the cats they'd have to make them up really high. One is a redwood though hitting close to 20 feet tall now, not as easily climbed so maybe. I can't distinguish really between all the worms on the roses, most eat holes through the buds and eat the roses, others the foliage too. I'd like to think the ones I miss are eatting aphids:)

Duchesse, they tried to petition the subdivision owner on the claim they didn't know the ponding basin was going to be there. That's a lie, I went through the same process they did to pick the house I wanted. It was right there on the site plan and the layout. In fact we paid extra to get a larger lot to be sort of behind it, about 20ft. They bought their houses knowing that was behind them, they were all sold at a premium price for that much yard. They wanted the basin filled in. Won't happen, by city law there has to be a basin at each new subdivison for the water to go when it rains to help on flooding. The only activity I ever see at the basin area is a couple times a year they come through with a tractor and take out all the weeds. The basin is home to mud ducks and others and geese off and on all year. I like to hear the honks and bullfrogs over dogs barking anytime. I think some of them walk around and squish them on purpose. I saw one of the neighbors vacuuming them up with one of those shop vacs one year. These are all relatively young people that have never owned a home before. They have no idea what they're suppressing and the price they'll pay. They just want to complain about nature. This was a walnut orchard and home to all the birds in the past. I imagine there are so many toads because nature is responding to the masses of white flies. I imagine over time the number will diminish especially with all the poisons/chemicals they'll put out on their yards and bushes. Sorry, pet rant:)

I've admired your roses and gardens Patricia, I'm only resistant because they've already ruined those roses, I can't reclaim that now. It's too late. That one rose in the pics above is Irresistible, a mini. There isn't a bud that doesn't look like that. I found 14 ladybugs on it yesterday. The white looking bush behind it is a floribunda hitting over 5' tall for size on this rose. You can barely see the canes behind the redwood even taller. This was last night and these bushes just don't photo well for me in the sun and not enough light, but it gives you an idea of how large.
{{gwi:245943}}
I did try the flour on some of them yesterday skipping where the ladybugs were. That was almost as much fun as blasting with water, some were startled into flight. Some washed off easier, but others are crammed into every nook and cranny of the buds and leaves and new growth. It irritated the bees, lucky they don't like me:)

As far as Murphy's Law goes, I was too pleased with early spring and all the healthy looking bushes. I was last year too and spider mites devastated them about this time. So, yeah you better knock on wood, LOL* I know what you're talking over on the Hover Bees but I think they're called something else, Deebs, still I have all different colored ones. Dark green, light green, stripped not stripped.
This one had stripes too, from last year's infestation:)
{{gwi:245944}}
I have a terrible memory so if I find one of these, I kill them.

Thanks for all the help, I do appreciate all the advice and thoughts on this. Patricia I may yet resort to that spray.

Here is my disgusting aphid photo of the day:

{{gwi:245945}}

Oh Good, misery loves company. I was hoping some would join me, thank you Buford:) You've got both colors too, wonder if that's camaflouge or just different brands. Excellent pic with the profile and everything. So, would you call the white ones spider mites then? I have a hard shell round one with legs I call spider mites. They cling to the leaf and you can't blast them off. I crush every one I see, they're on top and bottom of the leaves. I have these white ones on your buds too.

That's a good closeup, Buford. What ARE those white things on the buds? I'm not sure those are the same white things that are on my buds. Do they look like little threads to the naked eye?

I am having an aphid population explosion also. I have sprayed Conserve for the first time for thrips, misting the buds. It doesn't seem toxic at all to aphids. I still have ladybugs too, but apparently not enough of them. One amazing thing I've noticed is that some roses taste much better to aphids. I have plants with practically zero aphids right next to infested plants. Maybe in buying roses there aught to be a designation for roses unappealing to aphids.
I don't like the "honeydew" all over the leaves either. Does anyone try to wash it off? I was reading that an ugly black mold can grow on the honeydew. Great.
Linda

mike rivers thinks they are aphid skins that are shed. Also I see a white aphid. And green ones and brown ones. Honestly, with my naked eye, I just saw the white stuff, not the other aphids. I'm pretty sure it's aphids because there is a sweet smelling residue left on the buds. I guess that's the honeydew.

Spider mites are smaller and usually on the leaves. I started a thread thinking I had spider mites, but now I realize it's just aphids. They do seem to be bad this year. Of course I have a lot of lady bugs, but they seem to be congregating on my butterfly bushes for some reason.

I tried the flour last night on some aphids I found; I don't have that many but was curious to see if it worked.

So it rained last night and this afternoon I couldn't find any aphids where I'd sprinkled the flour. but maybe the rain washed the aphids off? It was a good steady almost 1" last night.

Has anyone else tried the flour? Have the frogs shown up yet?

mike rivers thinks they are aphid skins that are shed.

I identify insects professionally for my livelihood. I am certain that's what they are.

they seem to be congregating on my butterfly bushes for some reason

Careful examination will probably show they are infested with something the ladybugs are eating.

York, thanks. Ann also confirmed that the white stuff was aphid carcases. Meanwhile my aphids have lessened. I think because it's been raining and heating up during the day.

I'm glad I didn't spray anything. I'm going to try to get through the entire year not spraying any insecticide. Usually the worst aphid problem I have is on my milkweed, which is just coming up now. Last year with the drought was the first time I've had viable milkweed left for the monarchs when they came back in September. I actually had 4 monarch caterpillars make cocoons. It was exciting.

Checking for aphids every day. I saw babies on my Clare Grammerstorf only. The thing what I did was burn them with a lighter. Doesn't know if this is good for the plant. Suppose it isn't. lol