I took this pic today in Maryland. This large shrub is smothered in fragrant flowers, especially welcome in November. Leaf margin is entire and spineless. Who else has flowering shrubs in November? Can you name it?
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That's a mature form of Osmanthus heterophyllus.

My Osmanthus heterophyllus 'Gulftide' is in full, fragrant bloom - a great shrub (that is also very useful) for those who can grow it. Stefan are you sure that the photo is heterophyllus - that translates to 'different leaves' and refers to the fact that some are holly-shaped (toothed) and others not.

Love that Camellia - that may be the first Camellia that I have ever seen that I liked. I am going to have to try to hunt that down, thanks for posting that photo!

Thanks for posting, though I'm experiencing zone envy.

My in-laws have a couple of Ericas/Heaths blooming right now. I thought they usually bloomed late winter, but perhaps they have gotten enough chill to want to bloom now, or perhaps they are a late fall-blooming variety. I'll try to get a photo in the next few days.

Sadly, I just discovered that Fairweather Gardens does not ship to California...too bad, as they have some lovely selections in addition to the Camellia.

Nuccio's has listed the straight species for years, as well as multiple other species camellias.

I have a Sheffield Mum just barely blooming, does that count?

Most plants dropped leaves and blooms for that matter in early October.

Zone envy here as well...

This osmanthus is especially nice, perhaps 6' high and 10' wide and dense. The leaves are totally lacking lobes or teeth or spines, can someone provide a cv. name?
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Knock-out roses are a common sight anymore. Judging by the flower buds, these should be blooming well into December. I really can't fault this rose group.
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Osmanthus americanus?

I should have been more clear, the two pics of osmanthus are the same plant, can anyone name this cultivar? I can't.

It's probably already been answered. Definitely a hollyleaf osmanthus, not definitely a cultivar.

stefanb8 wrote you didn't mention anything about the bark.... and he's right. Here's the bark of C. oleifera 'Lu Shan Snow', one more attractive feature of a mature specimen.
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With this thread I'm trying to squeeze every drop out of the Fall season that's possible. Afterall, the Winter Solstice doesn't occur for another 21 days.
Here's C. sasanqua 'Yuletide' taken today:
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Here's an unnamed seedling of C. oleifera, pic taken today at the Nat'l Arboretum. The large shrub is absolutely smothered with flowers. At least for us, the first week of December is supposed to be mild, it will be a great time for these fall-blooming plants.
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Winter Sweet lives up to its name during the mild spells that we've been having. The perfume is really strong. This one has Fall foliage color and flowers at the same time. Pic taken today
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This magnolia was acting up on Saturday...

Pic taken today in downtown Baltimore. Never seen roses in January before. If this keeps up we will have cherry flowers next month.
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Great post!

Sam, how large is your 'Lu Shan Snow' now? I have an oleifer seedling that is blooming after only about 2 years in ground. That's pretty good. I'll need to move it though, but maybe I should get a 'Lu Shan' instead, since it seems to be a superior cultivar.

The shrubby Osmanthus is likely heterophyllus. Osmanthus americanus has much larger leaves. Hard to know if it's a cultivar though. So many look alike. Its epithet 'hetero-phyllos' means both immature (holly form) and mature (entire) leaves can exist on the plant at the same time. If you look closer to the ground, likely you can find the immature leaf form.

It's been a great year for camellias. Mine are still in bloom since October (some varieties). Knockout Roses still blooming too...into January. Amazing.

The magnolia is one of the Asiatic evergreen ones, formerly Michelia.

'Yuletide' belongs to Camellia x vernalis, C. sasanqua does not produce red flowers. The cultivar would get the redness from the C. japonica half of its parentage.

Hi Daveinnova, the 'Lu Shan Snow' in my op is 8 or 9'high and about 6' wide. I might mention that the foliage is dull and not glossy. I like the single flowers of this one and others because only the single flowers are fragrant. I really feel like the more sun the better for this plant to make flowers.
Regarding Osmanthus I remember seeing an entire hedge of them at Tufton Farm which is next to Monticello in Charlottesville. (actually I smelled them first) The foliage was as you described. OTOH the Osmanthus in my pic was found in an unremarkable front yard in Queen Anne's County which is probably zone 7b, there was nary a spine on the foliage, I looked! I think Stefanb8's observations are accurate, he also pointed out to me that this is a fruiting specimen. Am going back to the site next June and ask to take cuttings.
I see by your member page that you like evergreen oaks, do you have any interest in Lithocarpus? They would do well for you.
If you come to Green Spring Gardens Sale on May 18 there will be a non-profit vendor there with many camellias.

Sam, I got my small C. oleifera seedling at the Camellia Sale at Brookside Gardens one Spring. I'm a member of the Camellia Club. And I do live not far from Green Spring, so have attended those sales on occasion.

regarding Lithocarpus. I like any BLE, so Lithocarpus is on my list. I have some seeds starting, but still not sure where in my yard it would go. I also have many other BLEs in pots that still need a spot. LOL!

Regarding evergreen oaks in general, I currently have, in ground, three Q. virginianas, two Q. myrsinifolias, and one Ubame Oak (Quercus phillyraeoides). I have some Q. acutas that need to be planted out.

Here's a shot of a nice O. heterophyllum at the National Arboretum. Getting to be huge. It reminds me of an old olive tree.

Sam, here's a closeup of that Osmanthus at the arboretum.

There are no spines on this mature foliage.

Known over 22' tall in Seattle (USDA 8).

I took this pic of the original Lu Shan Snow today at the Nat'l Arboretum. This plant was unphased by the great camellia freezout in the '90s and Snowmegeddon did not bother it in the least. I understand that in China it is not considered an ornamental but instead it is grown for oil production. This is the plant that lends cold hardiness genes to its hybrid offspring.
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Sam,

I am enjoying your great photos of plant with 'winter interest'.

In addition to a seed-grown C. oleifera, which is sort of interesting (gift from Dr. Ackerman), I also have a 'Snow Flurry' in the ground. That one was also an Ackerman hybrid I believe. It is a double-flowered late Fall bloomer. Picked it up from Lowes for $9 if you can believe that! Am wondering how large it will get. I suppose, like most camellias, it can get quite sizeable....just needs time.

I wonder if those spineless Osmanthuses were grown from cuttings of mature wood -- that is, from their spineless form and then maintained that form. There is a mostly spineless variety 'Rotundifolia', but it has more rounded leaves than yours show.

Hi DinNOVA,
About one year ago I was traveling north of Centerville on 213. I saw the osmanthus, covered with white on the left and slammed on my brakes (you can figure out the rest)
The reason I liked the plant so much is it is not at all leggy or bare at the base like the ones in Asian Valley. I saw something similar at Tufton Farm, nr Monticello.
Rooting cuttings of these is child's play. Now let's see if they will overwinter in my area which is a cold Z 7.
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Sam, are all osmanthuses easy from cuttings? Nice cuttings you have!

What is your rooting technique -- baggy covered pot? Did you use heat at all. What time of year?

Oh yes, I understand the 'I brake for great plants' mentality. LOL!

My Sansanquas are still in the bud stage. I started them from cuttings from an unnamed plant.
Sam, I envy you being so near the National Arboretum and can easily visit it at different times of the year.
I spent a day there a few years ago and loved it. One day was not near enough time. It surprised me the 'rocks' in Rock Creek were actually bricks. I exited at the Gotelli Conifer Collection into a newspaper parking lot where I got a ride with the Foreign Editor to the subway and back to Foggy Bottom near the Watergate Hotel.
Fun trip!
Mike

I don't know what the heck happened to this thread, but since it's something of a hodge podge anyhow:

the great freeze out at the National Arboretum was in the late 70s, not 1994. Literally hundreds of cultivars were killed, most of them so completely they didn't even return from the roots. That winter was so severe that some American hollies were outright killed. Part of what's little discussed it is was accompanied by a drought of several months...the plants were already under stress. This is discussed in various sources like the old Washington Star Garden book and the writings of Henry Mitchell. 1994 was a bad winter, but not quite as bad as those of 77-85. I had a Dr. Tinsley survive 1994, albeit with severe damage. Most of SE Virginia did not go below 0F in 1994...all of it did in 1985.

How big does a O. heterophyllus have to get to undergo the "heterophyllation"? (haha) Mine - non cultivar - is over 8' now and has not converted yet. Not a single leaf yet. And...these plants are always reproduced by cuttings right? So, are nurserymen just striking cuttings of the immature form, or will a cutting of a mature form realize that it is now a juvenile plant, and revert to the spiny foliage? Of course some forms supposedly never convert, which is the point of cultivars like Sasaba, which I also have. Both have flowered, the fragrance is nice but not particularly strong. I'm buying an O. X fortunei for that now...kinda wish I'd just gotten that one instead of the O. heterophyllus in the first place.

This post was edited by davidrt28 on Mon, Nov 18, 13 at 20:45

hi davidrt28, you're right about the great freeze out, I got my decades mixed up. Here are some of the survivors in the camellia collection:
C. japonica 'Berenice Boddy', 'Leucantha', 'R.L. Wheeler', 'Blood of China', and most notably 'Variety Z'.
As noted earlier the original 'Lu Shan Snow' was unphased and a relic C. sasanqua 'Agnes o. Solomon' survived.
Down near the river's edge stands two seedlings from a cross of 'Leucantha' X 'Variety Z'. The better of these has been named 'Anacostia'
A little bit OT but its important to note, the Nat'l Arboretum is only open Fri - Monday for the indefinite future. Lets just say it has fallen victim to budget cuts, parts of it are completely given over to English Ivy. From here the only way to go is up.

Sam, since we are posting photos of Fall Color, here's a nice fall-blooming camellia in my yard as of this Nov 20th. Ashton's Supreme (Ackerman hybrid).

Yes, it's sad how the arboretum has had its budget cut back. I'm afraid large sections might eventually just get overgrown. We'll see.

How interesting. I have a video about Lu Shan. It talks about a grandma ...

http://youtu.be/21OMD6tD1VU

Here's a nice pic of what I'm calling Osmanthus heterophyllus 'Fastigiata'. Tight and compact with smaller leaf size. One might think it is prickly to the touch but quite the contrary. The foliage is soft and billowy. I'm hoping that they don't become bare at the base.
Although I did not see these bloom I'm certain that the flowers are not as showy as the one in my 11-16-12 pic.
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Here's a picture of a Camellia blooming now in my garden. I don't know the name of it. I took a cutting from a friend's garden years ago and he didn't know the name.
Mike
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What follows is a hodgepodge of pix taken this morning.

The Whites predominate at the Nat'l Arboretum's Asian Valley.

Winter's Hope, more spreading than upright. I like the yellow stamens which the double forms lack.

'Shishigashira' in the bonsai collection.

Oakleaf Hydrangea at the Bartholdi Garden, still very nice.

Great to see you bringing this thread back to life. Winter's Waterlily was amazing! I finally made it to the arboretum last week.

Did you see 'Mieko Tanaka'?!

Good to see 'Mieko Tanaka' blooming outside. It has been a mild early winter and if I had more outdoor sasanquas I assume they'd be blooming too. Still have a few flowers on 'Survivor' which is the latest it has ever had some. It probably started around early October so it's 2 months now it has been going.

Whaas, I can commiserate with you! But more to the point, I too still have some Sheffield-derived Chrysanthemum in bloom in one of the city beds! Can't recall the cultivar...maybe 'Samba'. Hey, a great late bloomer is a great late bloomer! Even if not a shrub.

+oM

These 3 were the best if you ask me!

is there such a thing as a january-blooming camellia? Or the November blooms, and then the japonica blooms in... Feb? March?

"is there such a thing as a january-blooming camellia?"

In mild enough climates, sure. When I was in California in January, certain camellias were in full bloom.

Here I asked this question of the distinguished panel and the variety 'Spring Promise' was recommended to me as one that would periodically bloom during mild spells in DC winters.

matt, I agree with davidrt28. In my yard, I have a Spring's Promise, which starts to bloom in December and CAN bloom during warm spells until around early April, I suppose. Also, my Winter's Fire can bloom throughout early winter.

Check out Korean Fire, a single red 'wild' species, which is also blooming now and through warm spells in winter. There are many others which bloom in winter, but again - only during mild spells, which occur in increasing frequency as you move south! Of course, with every freeze of about 30 degrees, all the opened flowers die.

'Korean Fire' at Longwood (NOT MY PHOTO).

My 'Winter's Fire':

Spring's Promise (not my photo):

Have been searching for a local example of a sasanqua called 'Snow on the Mountain' or 'Mine No Yuki' mentioned in To Kill a Mockingbird . It is apparently dense and sometimes used for hedging. Anyone have a pic?

I believe I had it in my yard Sam. It was one I bought at Lowes years ago. I lost the tag but as best as I was able to recall, it was that one. But it died way back after last winter, so I removed it. It looked beautiful until then. I'm relying on hardier hybrids at this point. Don't think I have any photos though.

C. japonica 'Anacostia' is a superior camellia introduced by the Nat'l Arboretum. They used 'Leucantha' which had proven winter-hardiness and pollinated it with 'Variety Z' which was selected by a Dr. Zimmerman from NYC which had proven winter-hardiness. Here is a plant on the Anacostia River.I like the quote from Dr William Ackerman: "Dr. Zimmerman found that it takes at least two years for camellia plants to become will established after being transplanted outside. Contrary to popular belief at the time, he found that outdoor camellias send their roots very deep into the ground." My experience in NE Maryland is that winter hardiness is greatly enhanced if the plant gets its roots deep into the ground and protected from winter sun. I have 'Anacostia' and it is blooming beautifully now, no winter damage.

The above pix from USNA's Asian Valley.

Haven't visited this thread in a while. Yes, the key things are really getting them established and well rooted, and avoiding winter sun. I'm strategically (well, sort of) positioning various conifers and BLEs in my yard to create "pockets" where future camellias will be protected from the winter morning sun)

It probably helps to start with a bigger plant, too.

Mine is not blooming yet. The Arboretum is definitely milder than my area! 'Zhuzhou Fuchsia' is likely the hardiest of the Loropetalums.

Mine is just starting to bloom a little. It's been a strange year for ordering of bloom, because the mild early to mid part of winter seems to have to 'activated' some things but not others. My earliest rhododendron this year is completely unexpected because I've seen it blooming at a normal time at Rarefind.

Earlier on this thread I posted about Osmanthus. Here is another specimen, blooming today, I took the pic @ http://www.swanharborfarm.org/

They have actually been allowed to grow into small trees that one can sit under. I am glad that the county has resisted the temptation to hack them back to small, round meatballs which horribly damage the integrity of the plant. Flowers on this plant not as showy as the ones on the 2012 pic.

Wow, I'd never heard of that place but now that I think about it, I have a vague memory of seeing a sign for it on Rt. 40. I guess it's next to the well-known drug treatment facility? So much of the western shore of the Bay above Baltimore is taken up by the military's playpen for blowing things up or shaking helicopters apart. (or more recently, unintentional launches of ill-fated dirigibles) Anyhow, glad they are letting it be all it can be LOL. I'm sure I don't need to again bemoan the paucity of broad-leaved evergreen trees planted in our climate.