Ingrid I've been seeing these small green caterpillars all over my roses this year too, luckily I don't have as bad damage as you do - lots of birds around here helping me out - and I also walk around the garden inspecting and squishing those that the birds don't get - I do have some damage though.

Aprille

The culprit most likely to make perfectly drilled holes through many layers of petals is the Rose curculio, a red weevil that should be crushed. The Rose curculio is found in flocks on native roses in Northern California. I've been told that it is rare in So Cal, but I have no personal experience to confirm that, especially since Baldo says it's found throughout the USA.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rose curculio

I've never seen them here -- but never say never.
A negative isn't much proof of anything, and we DO bring roses in from Northern CA, so anything's possible.

Jeri

I am in Northern California and have never seen those buggies before, though that does not mean they aren't around. The main problem I had this year was the wind. I lost many blooms due to the high winds snapping them off at the abscission point. I lost about half the blooms on Blush Noisette and most of them on Devoniensis (bush). One morning I came out to find that 10 beautifully opened MAC blooms were lying on the grass--the poor things looked like someone had come along, cut them off and discarded them. So far only few blooms with holes and I have seen some green catepillars on the roses.

Down in our neck of the woods, I'd be more likely to suspect some sort of worm or caterpillar.

Jeri

Hoplia beetles chew right into the flower buds, too, perforating the blossoms. They've just started in Sacramento. I pick them off but can't get ahead of them with all of the roses in the cemetery. They prefer light-colored flowers - Sally Holmes is a favorite of theirs.

I get flowers snapped off at home, particularly along the fence, but the culprit is squirrels, not wind. We get a lot of wind in the cemetery, but have rarely seen buds snapped off - bushes blown over, yes, and sometimes entire canes snapped off.
Anita

If it looks like a puncture it's more likely to be a weevil (curculios are weevils) than anything else. Caterpillars ("worms") cause a different kind of chewing damage than a puncture. Their mouths aren't formed the right way to cause a puncture.

I've got the same symptoms on my roses. Many, many deformed buds with punchture wounds in them. And I've seen the culprit - the rose curculio weevil. The recommendation is to hand pick them, but they are wary bugs and I often miss and they get away. As well, you have to be vigilant all day every day throughout spring - impossible!

Has anyone tried using beneficial nematodes that parasitize the larval stage in the ground?

I think one of the culprits on mine is rose midge, Veilchenblau, first buds I've had, will try to get as closeup photo as I can in the morning. Now one of the roses I rooted, I was looking forward to seeing it bloom, and its buds are partly eaten away just as you describe, can't see any signs of what may be chomping on that but I think it is something different. I have a second one of that by the alley, and I think it is ok.

I'm so mad I didn't get Bayer sprinkled sooner. Now it is too late for this batch of peskies and I have to wait for the ground to dry out and don't think I should put it on roses that I gave a full dose of fertilizer (every 6 weeks I think for that).

I don't think Bayer will work for every single problem anyway.

I had buds eaten like that last year, too, just on a couple, no sprays at all, just fertilized and mulched.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rose Diseases and Pests - no photos but good descriptions

jbfoodie, I agree with cemetery rose that the roses you found on the ground were snapped off by squirrels. At least, that's what's been happening in my garden. I woke up from a nap on a completely still day and the beautiful bloom I'd admired on News a few hours earlier had disappeared without a trace. The day before a bud ready to open on the same plant had met the same fate, and I've seen a squirrel scampering away from that area several times. I haven't quite figured out the solution for that except to beg the roses to grow tall really quickly. I did make a nest of tree branches around Sister Elizabeth who was planted practically on the doorstep of a squirrel's home under a boulder. So far that seems to have done the trick although it doesn't look at all pretty. I'm trying to accept a certain amount of damage because I'd drive myself crazy otherwise trying to solve each and every problem. I never spray so I'm hoping natural predators will help out with the damage control.

Ingrid

Sorry if I'm hijacking the thread w/photos, and they aren't so good because I just couldn't get the autofocus to lock and DOF is too shallow, I know what I could have tried, won't go into it.

First the good news. Harison is clean, better bloom form this year but small still but May was cold overall. In front, no leaf mulch, has been mulched w/cypress but doesn't seem to care, keep the weeds down.

{{gwi:248894}}

Now these mulched with leaves from last fall may not have been a smart move, east side took the worst hit but there are a few on roses in front and backyard w/same. Plus it's been damp from all the rain. I'm kind of devastated as these are once-bloomers but will soldier on. Bayer might have helped if I'd gotten it done in time. If I'm going to have roses, I'm going to have to do some treating.

I had the same problem last year but think it was thrips that time, haven't seen any caterpillar-type wormy things.

Next one is Veichenblau, I counted 16 buds in the full cluster; this is a tight crop at 100%. I think they are rose midge. What do I do to prevent this from happening next year?

{{gwi:248895}}

Here are two shots of an unknown I rooted, parent plant has never shown any evidence of deformed buds like this, again on east side mulched in leaves, plants otherwise look very healthy so far. V will no doubt fall prey to BS later.

{{gwi:248896}}

{{gwi:248897}}

I have been finding these green caterpillars eating rose buds. Not the small drilled hole but from one side the intire inside tender bud tissue is eaten leaving only the other side. I still can not find this caterpillar ID but it most resemble the tobacco. I kept one and added buds to be sure - and was shocked to see how many droppings it left!
{{gwi:248898}}
{{gwi:248899}}

bodica, I agree it resembles tobacco hornworm, but I'm certain it is not that one. The caterpillars in that family of moths all have small "horns" sticking up off the end of the back, like small tails sticking up in the air.

Unfortunately, I don't know what caterpillar this may be.

Aliska,

Is that a caterpillar in the top left of your second shot.

Boy, this year I have had everything! I have had those baby size underside leaf eating caterpillars, the big bud eating ones as shown in the above photo, thrips which just kind of dry out the bud leaves or discolor the blooms, and one punctured blossom.

I suppose I should spray, but hand picking has sufficed to date. I may grow weary

F.L.

I made that 2nd photo smaller because I hate making people have to scroll horizontally. Some may have to hit refresh to pull the smaller photo into their browser because of the cache, dunno. It's fine for me now, don't have to scroll horiz.

I don't see anything on the left of the shot but now that you mention it, I distinctly see a gray-colored fuzzy that looks like some kind of caterpillar to me on the right which I circled in the below photo which incidentally is a different shot I took, turned out about the same. Is that what you mean?

I'm not sure it is midge now; photos I've seen they don't appear visible to the naked eye like these obviously do even though I don't see so well.

Yes, I've had those underleaf worms, think those are sawfly larvae, but I only actually "catch" a small percentage of them to brush them off before the damage is done.

Do you think those are thrips? Those white thingies? I don't know, but I got so mad and went out and blasted them with the hose the other day, didn't get them all, much better today, just gave them another blast and the other rose, too, but probably too late to save most of the blooms on that one. They appear almost clean now, will keep an eye on it.

It wasn't so good for some of the leaves, but I may have salvaged some blooms on V, we'll see. I don't know how much blasting buds can tolerate. So far these are intact.

Neither gets much sun at all which may affect the blossom size, but at least they both set buds. V is later than I expected but many sprays of them now.

{{gwi:248900}}

The white things are from the cottonwood trees which can pile up into huge drifts here about.

It looked like it was snowing here yesterday.

A friend of mine had it pile up in the front of his house and someone (not me - I smoke stogies) flicked a cigarette into it and it exploded; just like gunpowder.

I have hand carried some lady bugs to the aphid filled Col. White. Stained my fingers squishing them, easier to let the bugs do it. I should have had my camera a saw a new bug I had never seen before, looked like a high crop tractor mowing down the aphids. Cool!

I have to be more careful in my firkling (perambulating) as I always miss some nasty criters. I doubt if I will ever have a perfect garden. As long as it continues to give me pleasure, I suppose that is what is important.

Foghorn

Aliska, I think those white things may be white fly. You did the right thing by blasting them with a hose. You'll probably have to keep that up for a while. They don't like moisture and the problem should eventually disappear.

Ingrid

Wow a tractor bug mowing down the aphids. I have seen a few of those. We often get a plague of those imported Asian ladybugs in the fall, but I've not noticed any earlier, but then I'm not that observant.

I went out with my cheap magnifying glass and tried to "catch" one. Well, I couldn't, they are hard to get in your fingers, and did find a couple on the bottom of a leaf, so I picked it off and brought it in the house and got it against some dark paper. Nope, he's? wrong thinks I, it's moving. Then after a couple of "moves", I noticed that was caused by my exhaling lol. I think. They've got things that look like they could be antenna on the front and the back which could just be part of how it evolved (had to correct that one lol) to latch onto something.

Now there's hardly any on the leaves, the buds are pretty clean from my hosing but still a couple. So why would so many just be on the bud clusters and hardly any anywhere else? Well, they have little hairy protuberances that will trap them more easily whereas they would tend to blow off from the smoother surface of a leaf, little to cling to might be one explanation.

So that's where I am with it now. My gdaughter's got my macro lens, and I've not tried to get anything that small and close, but my inquiring mind has been challenged here.

I sure hope you are right. Don't know of any cottonwood trees, but I can see where they would drift up here from down in the park on the breezes easily enough or from even further.

Still, I'd like to explode them myself they made me that mad thinking they were going to ruin V's first blooms. Like Bayer's going to work on cottonwood (or it could be another tree or plant) scattered whatevers. This might turn out to be kind of funny.

It remains to be seen about those opening buds on the other rose, but maybe they are just like that when they are still tight. Or maybe I've got several different plagues going on at once here!

Oh I don't expect a perfect garden either, just want to find some middle ground between total defoliation and spoiled blooms and what looks like perfection in others' photos. Right now, things are pretty nice overall with the roses. Just wait.

Sorry for such a long one again.

thanks, I'll look that up. Should have thought of blasting them when they first showed up. Will be vigilant.

Sorry I missed your post earlier. Never heard of those before. I saw them on two other roses. All once bloomers but the one back by the garage unaffected. It could have something to do with the leaves and/or east side. Maybe mulching with leaves isn't such a good thing, those are the only ones mulched that way, have to go buy some more cypress mulch. I go through that fast. I did notice I have a spoiled bud on one bush in front, will look at that more closely. The first flush is coming along nicely on the Austins & others, then things will probably get iffy.

One bush is turning yellowish, it's in a spot where water accumulates when it rains despite my best efforts to improve the drainage. I'll feed it and see if that helps.

They aren't thrips. I can assure you of that. I identify thrips several times a week (I identify insects for a living). Those aren't thrips. If they aren't cottonwood thingies (strikes me as a real possibility, but I haven't ever lived near cottonwoods, so I can't say for certain), they might be the "shells" left behind by moulting aphids. However, if they were such "shells", you would be seeing a lot of aphids on the soft, succulent stems of the buds and on the buds themselves. I don't see such, so I don't know if they're aphid "shells", either.

In any case, they certainly, absolutely are not thrips. Thrips are MUCH smaller, and yellow, gold, brown, or black.

york rose, thanks. I looked up white flies and found some photos but none that looked quite like these whatevers. What I did find out about white flies involves more sprays and chemicals and another constant battle, the only thing going for me would be they die over the winter.

If they are cottonwood drifts, why aren't they sticking to a crabapple tree right north of them that just bloomed and have all those spent bloom parts as "catchers"? Again, I'd better look at that more closely before I go running off at the keyboard.

Really dark this morning, looks like a storm is brewing, so won't be able to do much about it today except possibly have to grab my baby seedlings in packs and trays if there is a torrent of rain.

Here are some little white "bugs" they are exoskelotons of aphids {{gwi:248901}}
will look for green worm now
-B

Great photo of the exoskelotons!

I wondered quite a while about what the white things were on our roses and it took me awhile to figure it out. We both may be in big trouble, but I think we are allright. White flies tend to give flight when the bush is tapped. Our white stuff just kind of hangs there with it's face hanging out. They only seemed to stick on the mossy or sticky part of the roses as you said.

Last night looking down our valley into a neighbor's yard it looked like an eerie snowfall had lit on the tips of the grass. It was kind of cool after we realized what it was.

Cottonwood can carry on the breeze for miles. It can also pile up in 2' drifts where it can act like gunpower and explode; badda-boom! Great movie "The 5th Element", but I digress.

Sorry I meant my "other" left when I was talking about the caterpillar in your photo. It is neat you can draw a circle like that on a photo. Very cool indeed. Thanks!

No, I think thrips are different, believe I had some last year, but couldn't see them and haven't looked into those much yet.

Those are marvelous photos of the white flies, thanks for posting them, think I see a green aphid in there. It is hard to tell if those are exactly like my problem or not. Tapping the bush does nothing, whatever they are really cling.

I haven't looked today, had a bad downpour which means no watering which is good but huge puddle here in the back, must address that at some point.

There's a little fluff in the air, and gnats, maybe I said that already, but I've not seen cottonwood in that big of drifts. My sister had a bad problem with it on her deck in MN, saw how it stuck to her screens and things, but I'll have to ask her if it is still like that.

aliska12000, that isn't a photo of whiteflies. You see aphids because all of what you see there are aphids. When the little ones get too big for their skins the skins split open and the little ones walk out of them, then wait for their new, bigger skins to dry out & toughen up. After that they walk away, leaving behind the shell of the old skin (like what a snake leaves behind when it sheds its skin). Those little white things that look like "whiteflies" are just the empty aphid skins.

{{gwi:248893}} The adults have wings and you can see them if you look. If you tap the leaf sharply they'll fly off into the air, giving the impression of dandruff fluttering about. This is why one of their nicknames is "flying dandruff".

Those aphid shells won't even move, let alone fly.

Can anyone identify the caterpillar that Bodica says were eating her roses in May 31 posting? The same big bug is munching through foliage on my roses and blackberry bushes in zone 8. Please help if you know what it is.

Interesting!
I have lots of wild blackberry bushs all around our property, I must go look tomorrow!
Thank you for posting!

In MA there has been a huge population of winter moths, and
the worms are green, and they do sometimes eat a hole right into the bud-usually the base(at least in my garden). They
seem drop from the Maple trees...

I'm pretty sure this is the green worm...
scroll to the bottom of the link below, also check out:
http://books.google.com/books?id=dImCEVVEmcEC&pg=PA14&lpg=PA14&dq=sulphur+caterpillars&source=web&ots=PZ66ZYUxA_&sig=CeO4N0D6KcAtkeNhl--w6soV4hE&hl=en#PPA15,M1

If you'll notice there is a space between the back legs and the front grippers of these caterpillars, same and in Bodica's picture(cool name-are you a desendant?).
Also useful is "butterflies and moths of north america" that site will tell which ones are plentiful in your area. Can't find anywhere that says they eat only roses and blackberries so maybe their not picky eaters??
-B

Here is a link that might be useful: sulphur caterpillar

york rose, ick, those white flies are gross, I haven't seen anything like that in any of my beds. So you are talking about MY photo and that what is in V cluster are aphid shells? Well I didn't see any this morning, didn't step into the bed, but V is putting out buds all over and taking off. We've had drenching rain for the last two days which will probably mean some other problem looming.

It it yet to be seen if V is getting enough sun to perform well with blooms the way they are supposed to look, but it sure has a lot of vigorous new growth, for me and my zone.

I'll watch for aphids which should show up on there now if it is as you say. They are a nuisance but not as scary as some of these other nasties.

Whiteflies are often only a nuisance, too, although that isn't always so. As I said, the easiest way to recognize whiteflies is to watch what happens when you disturb them. If they go flying off into the air and resemble flying dandruff when they do so, you've got whiteflies.

They're always small, just a few millimeters across. Oh, and some species are black instead of white, but the black ones (aka "blackflies") don't get discussed much in the context of roses so I can only conclude the most common blackfly species aren't generally rose pests.

Whatever it was, it didn't fly away. It's good to learn some of these things in advance. Made my rounds today, V looks clean now and color is starting to show at the tips of some of the buds. I hope, so hope, they open undamaged and bloom size is not affected too much from so much shade.

That other rose I posted is blooming, but blooms are deformed. Next year I'll try to use Bayer and find out what else causes deformed buds and blossoms, probably thrips. That stuff is expensive, and I didn't want to have to do any of that, but reality sets in.

I can certainly tolerate some damage, but it reaches a point where I want to prevent the worst of it. Oh goody, Japanese beetles coming soon.

Those white things are back on the one pink rose buds, look just like this time last year, in my 2 photos above, haven't looked at Veilchenblau for a couple days, that one didn't do well over the winter but is coming back nicely, not going to get much out of that this year anyway so don't care at this point.

It's raining or I'd go out and blast them again, but it's too late, the one whole pink bush looks like all of the buds are ruined, leaves fine, east side of house.

The odd thing is that I have one exactly like it that gets more sun and no sign of those, probably about 20' apart in a different area entirely.

Thought I'd resurrect this old thread because (1) it's timely, and (2) One of you may have gotten it right but not sure, aphid skeletal remains, whiteflies or sawfly? I have hosed aphids off other bushes in the general vicinity already.

So far aphids seem to leave some bushes alone, have seen them on CPM and Jeanne LaJoie this spring and blasted them.