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divamum_gw

Unsupported climber?

19 years ago

Sorry, more newbie questions... I searched the archive and didn't find anything addressing this specifically although I'm sure it must have been asked before!

Now that we've dealt with the wasps and are getting this back fence area cleared, I'm wondering if putting one of the big climbers like New Dawn back THERE might be an idea.

It's an odd patch - whoever put the fence in set it about 10-12ft INSIDE the property line, leaving this wild mess behind it (we've not been able to figure out why it was done like this -makes no sense). While we aren't in a position to move the fence and turn that into useable garden at the moment, we ARE trying to clear it enough so that the brush and vine that's out there stops growing over and choking what's inside the fence.

However, now the space is cleared it's VERY bare back there and we're not screened from the alley any more, so I want to plant something tall. What would happen if something like a New Dawn or Mermaid was put out there and just allowed to run wild? I would have to dig an area to put it in) and then would be quite happy for it to mound behind the fence. The fence is only 3ft high, so it wouldn't provide much support.

Just wondering.

Thanks!

Comments (8)

  • 19 years ago

    I'd be a tad cautious about using Mermaid -- unless you're sure that you never want to go back there. But yeah, if the effect you want is just big mounds of plant, you sure can do that.

    If you want to make sure NO ONE ever goes through there, you can probably plant Mermaid, Cherokee Rose, and Alba Odorata, and it will become a prickly deathtrap.

    If you want to be less radical, more modest Large-flowered climbers can look pretty spectacular as big fountains, and they will repeat.

    Jeri

  • 19 years ago

    Thanks Jeri (and congratulations on the beautiful rose named for you! Wow. I am such a complete newbie at all this, but I'm in love with the flowers and I'm sure that's a huge honour in the rose world!)

    {{gwi:317329}}
    Here's the area I'm talking about (this is from the house looking out towards the back) - that mound of brush behind the fence just to the left of the gate was what was covering ALL the cleared dirt you can now see (both inside and outside the fence) - the entire area was that (only taller - it was about 6ft high). It's daunting, to say the least, especially without power tools!

    So, it's great we're making progress. But you can also see how we're more exposed now, which I don't really like. Does Mermaid get that unmanageable huge? And would it put my neighbour's shed at risk of being consumed?! lol I don't mind it being impenetrable *behind* the fence as long as I can keep it to the left of the gate, and thus keep the gate clear... And by all means, if there are any other alternatives - known to deal with blackspot areas - then please suggest. I'm really enjoying learning more!

    I also am hoping to use plants to mask the slanted grade, thus taller things to the left.

    On the inside, I hope to plant a pretty mixed bag border - some knockout shrub roses, maybe a hydrangea or two, maybe some delphiniums, some sedum - the easiest-to-grow cottage favorites I can find for this area. Maybe leave a little room to sprinkle in some easy annuals. Again, I'm trying to spend serious time learning enough to choose wisely for my area so that upkeep is minimum (I'm an opera singer and thus sometimes have an unpredicatble schedule, sometimes taking me away from home - not "no maintenance", but I do need to keep things as low-maintenance as possible so my husband can keep up with it whhen I'm busy and/or gone!).

    Oh, and for the record I'm learning that this area truly IS blackspot hell - even my pink Knockout shrub has succumbed to a little bit of it... Granted, it's still in a pot until I can get it planted so perhaps not as happy as it might be, but whoosh. This is obviously a VERY bad area for it, so I'm going to have to go with plant with proven resistance or I don't stand a chance even WITH spraying them!

  • 19 years ago

    Mermaid needs to be carefully trained on a tall fence or wall 30' long or grown into a tall, strong tree. Otherwise you get a murderous thicket the size of a small house.

    A shrubby, mannerly climber like Clair Matin would be fine leaning over the fence. See Rita's pictures on HelpMeFind for just that.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Clair Matin

  • 19 years ago

    Oh my word, those picture... I'm absolutely intoxicated!

    Is CM bs resistant? And is it a single bloomer or does it go all summer?

    Also, if I were to plant it behind the fence (thus letting it grow over the fence into the main yard, rather than the other way around) would it need any more than its original planting area tended and amended? Iow, would i have to dig an entire bed back there, or just a 3ft square to plant it in?

  • 19 years ago

    My understanding is that if you use the lasagna bed technique, you won't have to do much digging (more over in Soil forum about this).
    HMF did not list Clair Matin as being resistant. That does not necessarily mean that it isn't. You might want to ask about resistant roses for your situation over in the antique roses forum as many of the Teas and Chinas, as well as other varieties, are resistant.
    Another consideration would be keeping the weeds from getting behind the rose. If you get a real prickly one, that could be a problem, and even plastic rots eventually. I have a climbing China that I just bought in the spring and its foliage is lacy and attractive, and it does not have a lot of thorns either. Just another option... Brandy

  • 19 years ago

    Thanks for the lasagna information - I'll be checking that all out!

    I will say that I was out there doing a bit of exploratory digging this morning (still too wet to run the tiller) and to my DELIGHT the large area to the left inside the fence - the corner where the properties join - which had been covered with brush, is GLORIOUS soil. No rocks (unlike the rest of the property). Loads of worms. Old tree stumps, decomposing nicely and breaking up. (I'm on the alert for underground bees now, of course, but so far, nothing. Phew). However, I think this can be a super bed - unlike every other spot on this property this corner appears to have honest DIRT instead of sandy, clay-y, rocky blech. It's full of old roots which I need to chop up further and remove insofar as I can, but it's loose and dark and hopefully will be a lovely place to grow things. Here's hoping!

    Btw, another dumb newbie question: do rocks in soil help drainage, or are they just... rocks?

  • 19 years ago

    Roots can't deal with rocks, they have to go around them. They just reduce space for roots. Imagine a lot of non-melting ice cubes in a glass--less room for water.

    What about a tripod or teepee made of rebar for support of a climber? Easy to make and not expensive.

  • 19 years ago

    Clair Matin is fairly resistant for me but is better here with some spraying. I know some here grow it without spray. It is a wonderful rose and a tremendous near-continuous bloomer, one of my best overall. In your area you could also look at the climbing tea-noisettes such as Crepuscule.

    Big rocks impair drainage and should be removed. I toss small rocks when I find them, but they don't really matter.

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