my guess is that they rotate their stock, and only offer the most popular or bigger sellers every season consistently.

Stay with the top selling roses or go the way of the fringe nurseries. Too bad modern shrubs and a few HT's and Floribunda's is the mainsteam.

Randy, I agree completely. I find it very discouraging to try to shop at Chamblees with their reduction in older roses, and Antique Rose Emporium is also showing a reduction. Besides that, they seem to be sharing roses. I also notice that the rose options seem to be limited to once bloomers or climbers.

I am looking more and more at Ashdown, Euroroses, and the heritage ones in California. This is dicouraging because the last time I asked, nobody had grown the Euroroses to know if they are disease resistant. Ashdown is far from our area, and California does not struggle with black spot like we do.

Sammy

I was at Chamblee's a couple of weeks ago, and I have a different impression from the above...because I do NOT like the older roses, nor Austins. I LOVE hybrid teas, for the simple reason that I want roses for vases in the house, not little roses that shatter in a day. It seemed to me that Chamblee was selling 50% or more of older or landscape roses, whereas years ago they were mostly hybrid teas. But let's keep this in mind: they are the best we've got in Texas. And they are very good indeed. I shudder at the possibility that they would ever close. In fact, I must go there again soon!!

Lens, you are undoubtedly right. I've just never been very interested in the modern rose bigger sellers. Popular today ... insignificant and gone tomorrow.

Paparoseman, I agree.

Sammy, fortunately most of the roses that Chamblees has dropped, I can still get from The Antique Rose Emporium. Except for Pink Gruss an Aachen. I will need to try to root more cuttings of that one. However, it was nice that Chamblees was not too far of a drive away from where I live, so I could occasionally shop there in person. That was nice. I'm not sure it's worth the drive now.

Prairelaura, I disagree that Chamblees is "the best we've got in Texas". I do like Chamblees, and have bought many, many roses from them, but they are far from the best Texas rose source for me. I guess it's all in what you're looking for. I'm glad that they are meeting your needs though. I'm just not mainstream enough when it comes to roses for that to be the case for me.

Randy

I think you also have to look at ease of propagation. Many roses are just difficult to root. If some others that are in demand are much easier to root, then that's what you have to go with. It is unfortunate. I just hope we don't lose so many more roses.

I just hope we don't lose many more NURSERIES!

Jeri

Actually, I don't think you exactly meant that we have to go with them, Diane. If the nursery does not have what I want, I will look for what I want, or I may grow something else. I don't intend to spray again. If I am force to grow modern roses or something else, I will grow something else. The rose isn't the only beautiful flower out there.

I need to learn how to propogate so that I can begin some trades. I also need to invest in some older roses that will be tradeworthy.

Sammy

Do you all remember Ann saying to share so we can preserve roses?
Randy, I've never gotten that Pink Gruss but still want one. Origiinal Gruss is a great rose bush but the color underwhelms me.

Carla

A few years back, there was a long thread on the topic of roses dropping out of circulation and becoming extinct. It was around that time that Rozanna from Texas had gone through the process of importing roses from Europe. She was also very active in propagating roses and generously distributing them to others.
I remember a very wise response she made to the problem of roses becoming extinct and repeat it often to myself so I won't forget it. She said,
"THE BEST WAY TO PREVENT A ROSE FROM BECOMING EXTINCT IS TO DISTRIBUTE IT AS WIDELY AS POSSIBLE."

No, I meant that the nurseries have to produce or "go with" those roses that they can reliably propagate and that they know will sell. If they spend a lot of resourses attempting to propagate a rose that won't sell, that isn't efficient, when they could use those resources for roses that will root easily and will sell quickly.

Individuals can buy what they want from wherever they want.

That is why I questioned it. I thought that is what you meant - you were talking about their perspective.

Jim, that was a very wise statement that Roxanna made.

Carla, my original Gruss an Aachen is beautiful in the late fall, like right now. But the rest of the year, the color is not my favorite either. I think its the late spring, summer, and early fall intense heat here that is hard on original Gruss' color. On the other hand, the color on my four Pink Gruss an Aachen's captures my imagination all year long. Right now, my Pink Grusses are wowing me, they look so perfectly "old rose" to me. I know Gruss is often classed as the first floribunda, but in no way does it make me think of a floribunda, especially the pink form. This is a very early introduction hybrid tea by breeding. And by being such an early introduction (Gruss was introduced in 1909), I think it retains much of its old rose lineage character. I know, I know, I get slobbery over this old rose, which is why I'm so disappointed no Texas supplier seems to carry it any more :-)

Randy

I had 4 Grusses in the back and 3 in the front. Gradually my 4 have died, and I have one left. Even though I transplanted them a month ago, only one was worthy of moving.

I wonder if roses get too old. This is one reason I would like to learn how to take cuttings and propagate. I wonder if some of you take cuttings regularly, and if the experts know how long a rose is expected to live, and replace it.

This also happened to Dainty Bess, Nicole, and Baronne Prevost.

Sammy

Sammy, my oldest Gruss is several years old now. It has gotten better and better over the years, rather than declining. But there's no question that Gruss is more delicate than, say, the old teas and chinas (they are tough as nails in my garden). I pamper my Gruss roses more than those varieties.

Randy

>> I wonder if roses get too old.

*** Budded ones sometimes appear to. At least, they do here, where
the exposed bud union seems to run out of places from which it can push new canes.
Virused plants often seem to.

I don't think they HAVE to -- look at all of the very old plants that
still exist, where no one has removed them.
But I THINK in most cases plants like that are on their own roots.

Regarding sometimes roses getting old...

As a general industry wide answer. It can also depend on what material is taken for propagating. We can root 100 cuttings of the same rose at the same time and some simply grow better than others. Material taken during an active growing period, that is still young (in that it has just flowered or it's still green but the pith has hardened) for us usually yields the best plants. We have started more actively taking cuttings from the new plants this year and they root in 1/2 the time and grow like weeds when potted up.

So yes, some plants of the same rose can be less vigorous than others, and sometimes it has to do with how we as nursery folk propagate, sometimes it has to do with a particular rootstock not liking your area and of course sometimes it's climate and care.

Hope this helps!
Paul Z.

We can root 100 cuttings of the same rose at the same time and some simply grow better than others.

*** We have a Found rose here that we got years ago which, at the time
we got it, was not widely available.
It was so good for us, that DH propagated it over and over, and every
plant was as good as the first one, and identical to it in habit.
Now we have one which he propagated in early spring, which has rapidly
grown to 10 feet. It has also not set one single bud. Nada.
I have cut it way back. We'll see if, when it grows out, it blooms.
If not, I'll consider it a bad clone, and dump it.
If I'd gotten it from a nursery, I might have made the mistake of
being crabby about it, so thank Heaven that is not the case.

Jeri

Randy, Pink Gruss an Aachen is in Rose Unlimited's 2008 catalog. I'll bet they'd be happy to tell you where their stock came from. Roses I've ordered to be shipped here from Texas made the trip fine, so I suppose the reverse would be true!
As to Chamblees changing, I lined up their catalogs and what I found was in past three years, they had 196 large roses (non-kminis) of which 22 were patented in 2006. In 2008/9 they have roughly the same total but 34 are patented. That would seem to confirm your suspicion. If this helps them survive-- they do seem to cultivate a wholesale business, unlike some smaller nurseries-- more power to them!

Thanks, Barbara!
Looks like Roses Unlimited will be my new source for Pink Gruss an Aachen.
I have been thinking about giving that rose as a gift to a couple more family members.

Randy