Hmmmmm....... interesting.

My first thought was that that is concentric banding (like concentrica, johannis and similar species) rather than zonation (like 'Tiger', zonata, ampullacea, etc.), but the more I look at it the less sure I am of that. It seems unusually even for concentric banding, but otherwise the markings do have a bit of that "sunken" look, and there's almost certainly Neo. concentrica in the mix.

No name? History? What's going on on the underside of the leaf-- anything?

Even if that is zonation, I doubt that it came from Neo. carcharodon 'Tiger' since that's such a recent introduction. Neo. zonata, ampullacea and tigrina have all been around a long time but their hybrids are usually smaller than that........ Okay, now I'm back to my original impression: concentric banding! ;-)

Nice couple of plants gonzer.

Check under the leaves, if the banding pattern is not as defined as it is on top, then you most likely have a Neo concentrica hybrid. From my limited knowledge, Neo 'Tiger' and a similar plant Neo pascoliana, has the banding very evident on the underside of the leaves.

The concentrica style Neo's have been extensively used in hybridising, as they are tough plants with good form, and attractive markings. A good concentrica hybrid (see link) will take full sun, have nice dark leaf margins and tips, with 'concentric' banding........some similarities to your plant....?

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:446214}}

Until the center flushes gonzer there is no way to know. I have 6 plants here that look like before bloom but then you see the difference. Plant mature size approx 12 - 14 inches?

Warning: geeked-out description to follow. Tune out if you're not interested. ;-)

Okay, here's an unnamed seedling that shows both zonation AND concentric banding/blotching. The zonation is seen as a lighter brownish-purplish banding, and the concentrica traits are the darker blotches.

{{gwi:446216}}

Note that the two types of markings can co-exist but do NOT combine. The type of markings associated with Neo. concentrica (and similar species) may manifest as unconnected blotches or form into bands, but a distinguishing characteristic is that they have a bumpy or sunken appearance which you can feel with your finger, whereas zonation is smooth. This close-up may show it better:

{{gwi:446217}}

Similarly zonation (banding, as in Neo. zonata, ampullacea, tigrina, carcharodon 'Tiger') is just one end of the spectrum, with maculation (spotting, as in Neo olens, pauciflora etc.) at the other end. Neo. smithii and pascoaliana fall somewhere in the middle, but their markings are all expressions of the same trait, and as such will always fuse in hybrids, although maculation appears to be the "default setting", as it were. Good strong zonation is much harder to achieve.

Concentric banding appears to occur on a different cellular level in the leaf, which is probably why it doesn't combine with any other type of markings. It can coexist with zonation, maculation, marmoration, lineation, variegation, etc., but it remains separate. It also doesn't come through on the underside of the leaf.

Check the underside, and run your finger over the markings, gonzer, and you'll have your answer.

Smooth as Howie Mandel's head.
A concentrica cross is what it is. This plant is a refugee from Birdrock: circa 1980's. This was during a period when BR was flush with many forms of concentrica. One house was dedicated to all the Neo "mothers", who's bloom time had passed, yet were trimmed up to provide nourishment to the pups. This plant was among those. ID tag? :-(

grande fantastic gardens, Jungle gardens grande ,Big Mac. Plutonis, all possible

{{gwi:446218}}

Gonzer,this is for you. A tad off the subject here,but I need to ask.You seem to know the folks at BR,and I've had a few orders placed with them over the past three years,but now find their on-line catalog not much help.That is,most generea/species,no pictures shown,or,so many plants listed being 'out of stock'. I sent an e-mail asking for photos to be sent for the plants I was interested in,(dyckia-hechtia).Many are listed just as 'species'.They replied,'will try',but I never heard back.Can you perhaps shed some light on their situation,as I know they recently relocated. Thanks for any input you have.
PS:I've seen pics of the Neo's you posted somewhere,but can't recall where at this time.Will try to find an ID,and will get back to you if successful.
Bob

Well, regardless of who the parents are, the history would definitely rule out carcharodon 'Tiger' as a suspect, since that wasn't released into the trade until 2000.

Thanks for all the info my friends.
Bob, on the subject of BR. Ever since Pam moved the business onto her property, things have not been the same. Fact is, I don't shop there anymore. Situations like you described seem to be the norm. Andreas Bokker of the German Brom Society even asked me to be an intermediary on his behalf in obtaining plants due to BR's failure to reply to his repeated inquiries. The stock is extremely low and has never gotten to the point where you can feel comfortable grabbing a plant and paying for it. I hate having to ask if this or that plant is for sale. IMO, Pam is not going to try and improve on BR's stock or clientele. The prices have also gone through the roof! Does this sound like Tropiflora? Maybe. After 20 years of buying plants from them I'm now left with a sour taste in my mouth. I also helped out (for free) on two occasions at their sales and after all was done I wasn't even given my promised discounts on plants! This is not "sour grapes" talking here, just the observations of someone who knows what it used to be like. My main source now is jmacz on e-bay. Great stuff and better prices!

I agree gonzer. Everything you have said on both business's I have found to be true. DGAS attitude. If not for a friend in the latter mentioned place my business would stop there too and probally will on my next trip there in March.
Bob what are you looking for someone here is bound to have a source for it

Thank you gonzer and hdd for your candid input. I guess Pam is just getting tired of the brom business,and that can happen I suppose,but if so,just sell out and move on.
I too don't feel right having to 'go the extra mile'just to hand over my $$ for a plant that is unseen,or that the seller won't help to generate the sale. The prices have gone way up too. Not good for business.
( reminds me of a cartoon in the paper,a tropical fish store located all alone in the heart of the desert...a half dead starving and dehydrated man crawling up to it for help...the owner spots him and says..."if you're just hear to look around,...okay,..but if you were thinking of buying a fish...well,..you just better keep moving along".)
This could be me if it was my bromeliad store,(said my wife),and she may have been right. ;^)
As for Tropiflora,I'm hoping that the coming changes there will be for the better. We'll have to wait and see.
HDD...I'm aware of most all sources for broms,but I was hoping to get a better response from BR,as they may have something I'd want in the dyckia / hechtia genera. But with no pics,and very high prices,I'll be 'mov'n on'.
Thanks for the help.
Bob

Im going to tour the spiney's at Tropiflora soon (hehe). Lets see what I find

Yes, I have also heard all those things about BR. I think with her recent life/business changes, that might be an explanation for a change in focus. One can always shop around though.

Hi, Everyone! Mind if I drop a line sometimes? I have been following your discussions for quite some time and have learned a lot.

Gonzer, might your plant not be a Neo Gee Whiz? How big are they. I have got one - not as nicely coloured as yours, though. It is abour 60 cm in diameter and has not flowered yet. And Lisa, the lines on the leaves are smooth. Gee Whiz comes from N cruenta x Morris Henry Hobbs. The undersides of the leaves has that slight silver banding that I suppose, comes from cruenta.