For the first time, I'm actually journalling. My memory is pretty good when it comes to gardening, but with Wintersowing, something tells me I'll be standing confused in a garden full of unknown plants if I don't write something down.

Another thing I'll do differently is I'll invest money into good tools. That $75 dollar shovel hurt my wallet for a little while which was less time than the bad bruise I got when a D-shovel from Walmart broke under me last year. I was lucky I didn't impale myself on the broken handle.

I don't call myself clumsy for no reason!

pyrgal: About labeling... I have found it to be a most important step, especially because I'm just still not all that good at ID-ing seedlings.

I use paint pens only, which have not faded in a year's time. (Sharpies DID fade to the point of not being legible in a few months). I have labeled each jug 3 or 4 times- on duct tape on the bottom, an inground marker inside the jug, and a name on both the top and bottom side of the jug. Then when the top half is cut off, I can still see what it is without acrobatics and standing on my head to see the bottom of the jug.

Since I have found the paint pens so reliable, I will probably omit the duct tape on the bottom label this year.

For in-ground labels, I use cut up yogurt cups with paint pens. They're still holding up after a year.

For records: I use these columns in excel format
common name,
botanical name,
annual, perennial, biennial
date sown
date germinated
exposure- sun, shade, etc
notes to self- like size, needs cold strat, ect.

Things I would do differently: I won't use small shallow containers like deli clambshells, Won't use paper pots, will use only milk jugs with 3" or more soil, will protect tender plants in case of a late hard frost, will continue to dump ungerminated containers into beds around June, (they tend to come up there anyway).

Karen

Could I ask what paint pens are, and where they can be bought? Sorry to sound dense, but haven't heard of them.
Lois

Paint pens look like markers, but they actually contain paint. The brand I've used is Deco. Purchaced at Michael's Craft store, they cost a little under $4 I think. A good investment. Mine have not faded in blazing sun in a year's time. The Sharpie permanent marker only lasted a couple of months, and that was in winter with little sun.

Karen

Karen,I numbered mine with craft paint. I wonder if that will stay on?

proudgm: I don't know what craft paint is. I'm not a very crafty person. I have few talents. I can wintersow, though!

Karen

I won't use small containers this year - only gallon jugs and a few 2-liter bottles. I will prepare the new beds way ahead of time and plant out seedlings as soon as possible. I will try to sow less, but am not promising anything! :) Lots of new seeds in my stash, thanks to Valueseeds and trades. . .

I'm going the other way, Rosebush, more sowing! I vow to:

Sow more than last year.
Take some risks.
Sow some things I don't think I like.
Sow more of things that I know I love.
Have faith and sow the whole pack, no reserves.
Swap for an extra pack if I get nervous later because I really love that stuff so much that I must have it growing.
Use only milkjugs - gallon and quart.
Label stakes go INSIDE the container at sowing time, so they're ready for planting out.
Have a large soaking container ready for when containers want to dry out.
Plant out asap into a holding bed/area.
Move them to planned locations when they're a little bigger.

kilngod: Are you talking about planting everything into a holding bed first? Even annuals? You might want to re-think that; it's a lot of work. Beds will fill up nicely and quickly.

June 7
{{gwi:453559}}

Same bed, July 4
{{gwi:453560}}

August
{{gwi:359274}}

Karen

I have some major planning to do in the gardens this year which will involve a plant sale in the spring, so I will be concentrating on that.

Doing different? Well, last year I potted-up some plants and liked the results. I did it just because I had to get rid of some clutter, but this year will do it on purpose since I liked the fact that most plants bloomed and that told me what colour they were so they were properly placed in the gardens in the fall.

Not that I care about colour coordination in the gardens, but out of 26 Buddleias, 16 were mauve, 3 were white, and 7 were a deep purple. I give a lot of my excess plants away and would have probably given the whites which I wanted so badly. So, for me, potting up is a new practice that I will follow for some plants.

Kiln, I agree with Karen. (nother Karen) Smack those pups into the ground where they are meant to grow!

Now, if you have a special issue we are not aware of that might change things, but into the ground with first true sets of leaves works great. I move nothing, but I end up ripping out some.

This is my first year but already I have some changes planned as far as the sowing goes. I would:

1. As you save them prep containers as far as possible, poke holes, hole punch, cut, etc.

2. Put traded seeds into easy to open and dispense envelopes instead of the ones they came in. Opening tiny oragami packages doesn't work real well with frozen fingers. And the plastic ones create so much static cling it's hard to get the seeds out.

3. Make the plant label and put in the big seed envelope before hand.

4. Have spreadsheet complete before you start and number each envelope accordingly.

I'm sure I will have another "If I could do things differently" list when it comes time to plant them out.

Karen, thanks for the info about paint pens. Not sure that I will get them (I am so busy and Michaels is about a half hour drive) but glad to know what they are. :)

I always say I'm going to sow less, but I know I'll sow more.

This year I'm ONLY using milk jugs. I'll label the jugs with paint pens again (I agree - these are the best)

This year I'm NOT going to make a spreadsheet. If they germinate, they get planted out. If they don't, they get dumped. I no longer feel the need to document.

I'm still sowing indoors as well.....and still don't feel guilty about it!

Deb

Bakemom & Karen, thank you so much for the warning. I shall remove that from my mind, before I dig myself into a hole. The idea was mostly two things to limit myself

1) don't sweat the location much -- since I am very new to planning the garden layout, and don't have a sense even when reading "this tall" "this wide" "this color" in a plant description. I'm am artist, and so want things to look right, but can't really "think" that way until I visually know the plants. this can lead to a whole lot of delay in getting plants into the ground as I try to figure it out too much.

2) if I don't know where to put it, just put it somewhere already! I felt a little safer calling it a holding bed, that I'm not marrying the first location.

There are so few plants here already, and WOW, so much planting space. Two nearly naked 10'x 30' areas, one mostly shade, one mostly sun, and several other smaller areas that are partial suns.

I'm just going to fill them up, not move things, and do visual planning in the fall (for moving in the spring maybe?) to get the plants to look right, or at least better, together.

Does this sound reasonable, yet "tricky" enough to keep me from having visual performance anxiety? lol!
Thanks!
--Tina

You can also try grease pencils, which can be found at any hardware store. I used those this year and they have done great. I did sharpies one year and that was a total bust.

Jen

I am going to try the foil tape that someone recommended because it "dents" as you write on it, "engraving" the name should the ink fade. I ordered two big rolls on amazon. I might even wrap some around my cut up venetian blind markers for inside the jug.

I want to aim for planting out earlier - two real leaves and out you go (if it's warm enough). I think I was too cautious last year and spent way, way too much time moving seedlings to 4" pots to grow on before planting out. I'll do that with very few things this year.

I still haven't decided just how far I will go this year with "documentation". I'd at least like a typed sheet with the name, height and color of everything in a container to refer to as I plant out. But since I plan to do a LARGE number of containers, I don't want to get so bogged down in the "paperwork" that I am spending lots of time at the computer inside instead of outside in the fresh air and sunshine!

I also think I will be clearer with folks in my life who want "plants" that they need to come and "get em" earlier. Set up trays with "HOS" for same day pick up. Lots of my moving seedlings to 4" pots was for other people's convenience (so they could get them whenever) and I just don't think I will have time this year as I plan to grow so much more.

We also invested in a really, really good hand shovel. I was snapping them left and right last year and Hubby got me the one Donn recommended for our anniversary. I am going to change my ways and NOT leave it laying around the yard! I swear! I think I will be able to plant faster and better with a good tool.

Now I just have to recover from holiday exhaustion and get started! I am so impressed with all of you that are already getting containers ready!

Nancy

I am writing the names of seeds on the jug. Last year I did a number system. Number on jug only-number written down in notebook with seed name.

This method worked fine except I was constantly getting the notebook out to figure out what seed had sprouted today.

I am also going to take even more detailed notes than I did last year. I am not a note/record taker but I have found the little bit of info I wrote down last year is proving of great value this year. Example, I have the names and dates of what I sowed. Then I wrote down an approximate date they germinated. Then I have little notes like "snow has covered everything-1/29/07"

All that information just gives me more confidence for this year.

I will definitely scale down this year. Last year was my first attempt at Winter sowing and I planted way too many seeds. I had trouble finding locations for them. I will be more selective this year.

As for markers, I used the permanent ones and I had no problem. I also numbered my jugs in addition to labeling with plant names and then listed them in a notebook. In a glance I could reference the jugs from indoors or out and I recorded their progress in a notebook. I kept them in numerical order until they sprouted and it saved me from stooping and bending to see which seeds were which.

I'll sow fewer containers, fewer varieties and concentrate on annuals since my garden is already filled with perennials. I need to thin out most of these perennials too.

Earlier this year, a neighbor showed me her new hanging baskets. She wanted me to plant for for her next spring. I'll do hanging baskets for sure this winter. It will be fun to present her with a hanging garden this coming spring. :-)

I would like to try WS annual geraniums. Those seeds are expensive, aren't they? Maybe I'll buy some plants too. I'll save them next winter so I'll have a good supply the following spring.

Carry on. :-)

Piti, don't know if they're the varieties you want but I got 2 from Valueseeds.com for 79 and 99 cents! Wanted something for filling in around little beds I have and container work. Can't beat that price and they're delivery was very fast.

I gave up going all "native" because I needed hybridized characteristics to choose varities that fit needs of particular uses for something like geraniums, e.g., smaller size, longer bloom time, color...have very limited planting space and using containers for overflow "need" for some plants!

As mentioned on another thread while back Valueseeds.com thinks they might add more seed varieties in January so there could be more to choose from.

Never thought I'd grow geraniums but they solve some "fill in" needs and can survive some shade which I have in overabundance.

In case it makes a difference to you I found out from Trudi that Valueseeds.com is outlet for Thompson & Morgan.

Thanks, newbie in nj. I got a packet from Valueseeds too. I actually would like specific colors from Park's but found them too expensive. My neighbor across the street had two huge containers full of them. I didn't catch her to ask for the plants before they froze over. :-( What a waste.

--- I love seeing garden pictures in the winter time...
ahhhhh :-)

L

I'm not sure how many conainers I'll end up with this year, but like Pitimpinai, I am focusing more on annuals, and vegetables since my perennial beds are rather full. I hope to expand one bed, and create a new one, but I don't want to plant things for an area that isn't ready yet. Why increase my stress level unnecessarily?!

I do think I will try to sow fewer seeds per container. Some things are fine to HOS, but if it's something I only want one or two plants of, I may put 6 or 8 seeds in the container, instead of 20 or more. Last year, I put at least half a packet in each container and some of the containers got pretty crowded before I could plant them out. Separating the ones that I didn't want to HOS was a major pain.

The other thing I will do differently, is moving the containers to a more shady spot in the spring. It was too hard to keep up with the watering in this high desert climate, and I admit I fried a few things before I could plant them out.

And as many folks have said in previous "mistake" threads, I will be sure to have the soil deep enough.

Bonnie

wish I could like the paint pens,but They do not seem the best way for me.I shake and try to get them started,I press down to get them started and always,the paint pours out and I have a mess.I have not found anything any better than using a smaill craft brush and craft paint.I also use the foil plumbers tape.I love this tape.After 2 yrs and I can still read the labels.I also write the color if known on a small smooth river rock and I put it when the seedlings are planted.The permanent markers fade,the tape on the bpttom comes off.I have to use no fail proff ways and I will use it for years.I would relax more,take my time and stop rushing.The seeds are not going away.The world will not end if I don't sow exactly on the soltice and sow the ones she is planting.I have plenty of time and so do you.I am going to start sowing on Monday,the first..I am going to sow only perennials.by plans.If they are going in the red bed,then all of those will get sowed together.If they go in my new medicine wheel,then they will get planted and stored together.I think this will be so much easier for me to stay organized..
moonphase

#1) i will use a minimum of 3" in each container...

#2) to keep the pot ghetto looking the best that i can, i will use only ONE kind of container ...(& will desperately TRY to keep them out of sight; off the deck!

#3) i will start putting sluggo under all containers in april!!! ..... nasty, icky, icky, icky

#4) i will only be w.s.ing annuals later on, cuz i w.s.ed all my perennials in nov. when it was still nice out (grin)

you gardeners in zones warmer than mine probably couldn't get away with that .... all my 64oz. juice bottles have pretty much been buried under snow for a month now!

have fun everybody! ... phyl

Phyl, had to google "sluggo" to find out what it was. Really charming web site to view while having morning coffee...LOL.

Do people have a problem with slugs traveling toward containers only if the problem already exists in lawn OR do slugs actually develop in container medium? If sterile medium is used is it still a problem as slugs go for roots?

Are your containers placed on soil instead of on patio or deck and that lends itself to slug problem?

As if I weren't already overwhelmed with all possible problems and pests to look out for in my first year of WS you just hit a new one...LOL.

Since I saw raised mole tracks at very front of property earlier this year assume they were going after slugs at one part of front yard. My father applies milky spore every year to deal with them but I'm more than amenable to overkill, literally and figuratively, if this is problem I might need to deal with.

Read on Sluggo web site that they can collect in trenches. I left a definition trench around new butterfly garden just because I was rushing to get it in before it got too late in season and had dug the entire garden up to 1 1/2 feet deep to amend and aerate soil (also probably allowing weed seeds in without knowing it at the time) as well as chopping out vine roots. Was going to refine trench come spring when it was pointed out to me that any trench would fill with water. Thought I might dig little further down and fill it with gravel for drainage and place graduated chicken wire fence under gravel to try and keep out groundhogs and bunnies so there's something left for butterflies. Now I'm torn because I think any fencing will be barrier to butterflies and may just take my chances with bunnies and groundhogs. Most plants are supposedly deer resistant but that's almost an oxymoron in this area.

Sorry for the rant'n'ramble but got set off by thought of having to deal with slugs!

I'm trying to avoid the mental image of those icky pests slinking off to die after consuming Sluggo. Googled "slugs grubs" and even came across "beer bait" method. For some reason little buggers are attracted to beer aroma. Little set-up comes from some inventor in England. Guess they wanted to put leftover Guinness to good use...or guy came up with idea after imbibing a little too much of it.

newbie: Slugs are bugs. They can't develop in containers out of nowhere- a slug has to crawl in. Just one can lay eggs in there though.

If slugs are present in an area they become active in spring when soil is moist and warms to about 40 degrees. Sluggo or Escar-go both contain iron phosphate which will kill slugs but is friendly to beneficials. It is a bait- it draws slugs which eat it, then stop feeding and die. Because it is a bait do not use it inside containers, only around them. If you put it inside you will draw them there and they'll eat your seedlings. Another method is to trap them and squish. You can do this with a piece of wood. In the morning they will be on the bottom of the board, just squish them.

I use both methods in spring as soon as the soil is 40 degrees. The Sluggo is much more efficient, though.

Karen

Most of the changes I plan to implement have been noted already.

1. Milk jugs ONLY. Those peat pots seemed like a good idea at the time, but ended up being a royal pain! Might use them for sweet corn, but that's about it.

2. No more numbers!! I swear, trying to scramble & find the latest/greatest spreadsheet whenever something sprouted drove me NUTS last year.

3. I will repeat using cut up mini-blinds for markers - worked GREAT last year (if only I'd had the plant name vs. a number!).

4. Bottom watering ... gotta come up w/ a plan to efficiently water all of the milk jugs from the bottom as the temps start to rise. I'm thinkin' one of those long, flat RubberMaid containers, but not sure yet ...

Can't wait to get started! Got dirt & scissors (Black & Decker battery operated) for Christmas, the house is clean, the decorations have all been put away, and I've got four days before I have to go back to work. Sounds like shed time!

Ilsa

I had to go back a couple pages to find out about Donn

I am sort of out of the loop lately -- What about Donn? I looked back a few pages and only found that he was busy planting bulbs. Did something happen? Is he okay?

He was MIA from the forum and everyone was wondering where he was. We found out that the bulbs took over, but he is fine and dandy.

What I'm doing differently this year is winter sowing. :) I've already sown at least a dozen different seeds and just sent away to J.L. Hudson for a few more kinds.

I just got into butterfly gardening last year and just found this winter sowing forum a few weeks ago and am thrilled to have found out that there's a method besides overcrowding my already jammed windowsills.

Thanks to all who contribute suggestions on the forum.

The one thing I'm doing different this year is getting my tomato seeds out sooner. I had so much to sow last year that the tomatoes and perennial herbs didn't get out until late. Not this year. I hope to have them out by the end of January.

Linda

This year, I am going to sow a lot more annuals. I planned to sow a lot last year, but I planted so many perennials and I ran out of time for annuals. I needed those zinnias last year!

I will remember to sow more zinnias.