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remi_fr

Air Toxicity?

17 years ago

Hello there,

I would like to grow an imposing Brugmansia shrub in a tall and very luminous flat. However, because of a limited space compared to verandas, greenhouses, or open-aired places, I'm wondering about the renowned contact or oral toxicity of Brugmansias: are the toxic alkaloids also volatile? Namely: is there any danger growing a large Brugmansia shrub in a small space? Are the alkaloids able to leave the leaf and gently float in the air? Yet, it smells as if, in my greenhouse, the little B. 'Charles Grimaldi' actually had a little bit perfumed the air of the 7m²-greenhouse with its tomato-odour... Just worrying...

For the more biologists: do you know where the toxic alkaloids (atropin, scopolamin...) are stocked in the cell? => vacuole?

Many thanks for your lights,

RT.

Comments (17)

  • 17 years ago

    hi there RT. Heavy question. I think a lot of us would be in bad shape. Cause lots of us take in the brugs in the wintertime to have them continue to bloom or finish seedpods.

    Hope someone can give you more info.

    Lucy

  • 17 years ago

    I believe the alkaloids remain held by the cells and do not transpire into the air with the expiration of gas exchanges, just as calcium, magnesium and chlorides are held in the cells.
    There may be some that have a hypersensitivity and would get local skin irritations from repeated contact with the leaves in close situations but on the whole, this is unusual.
    I sit here thinking that in fact, your plant may be more of a benefit to cleaning your room air than a drawback from any toxins. It may however, overwhelm your home with a powerful perfume if you get it to bloom.

  • 17 years ago

    I believe the alkaloids are synthesized in the chloroplasts.

  • 17 years ago

    RT see I knew the smart ones would show up and give you good answers :-)

    Lucy

  • 17 years ago

    Many thanks to you for your answers. The fact is that some Solanaceae like Nicotiana bears trichomes on which are secreted alkaloids. If Brugmansia bears them too, and if tropane alkaloids are volatile, it may be indeed hazardous, and would explain why the lightest touch can be irritant.

    I would have thought alkaloids were synthetized in the cytoplasm, are you sure they're synthetized in chloroplasts, Karyn?

    Regards, and sorry for the English,
    Rémi

  • 17 years ago

    I've read some articles that list Brugmansia as carcinogenical and warn people not to raise it indoors. I would not do it myself.

  • 17 years ago

    added: The toxigen can be inhaled with pollens or dirts

  • 17 years ago

    I would be more worried that the overpowering fragrance of the blossoms would run you out of your flat. I have grown over 50 in my attached garage with no ill affects other than the scent is too strong to leave blooms on while inside. The sap irritates my skin when I pluck too many leaves in one day but I have very sensitive skin. Touching or brushing against them has no affects.

  • 17 years ago

    I remember reading that the alkaloids were synthesized in the chloroplasts. I don't know if that meant all alkaloids or just specific ones. I guess it's possible that they might also be synthesized, like proteins, in the endoplasmic reticulum and/or in other organelles. They're all floating around in the cytoplasm.

  • 17 years ago

    I remember reading that the alkaloids were synthesized in the chloroplasts. I don't know if that meant all alkaloids or just specific ones. I guess it's possible that they might also be synthesized, like proteins, in the endoplasmic reticulum and/or in other organelles. They're all floating around in the cytoplasm.

  • 17 years ago

    Karyn before I post my POTD, I test it here if it shows up 3 times for me too roflmao'

    Lucy

  • 17 years ago

    Karyn before I post my POTD, I test it here if it shows up 3 times for me too roflmao'

    Lucy

  • 17 years ago

    It was something like 2 am and that's when I realized I really needed some sleep. lol. It kept telling me the message had been rejected so I kept changing the subject line and trying to post but kept getting the error. I finally said ***** and then saw that it had come up, in triplicate. lol

  • 17 years ago

    I was popping the yellow leaves off mine the other day and as I bent over to snap the last one, with my mouth open I could have swore I felt a drop hit the back of my mouth. I panicked, ran inside, read up on the dangers and spent the rest of the night checking for signs that I was going to die.

  • 17 years ago

    I don't think that would cause a problem unless you are very sensitive but watch out if the sap gets in your eyes. Yikes! It dilates them for a day or so, very scary. Some people will get a contact dermatitis just from touching a brug and others can get the sap all over them with no ill effects. I pinch my brugs by hand all the time and have never had a rash but it's probably better to be safe then sorry, especially if you have allergies.

  • 17 years ago

    remi_fr, if you are the least bit worried about it, then don't grow it indoors, simple as that. No amount of our telling you how long we have worked with them in outdoor and indoor settings with no problems will convince you otherwise and it is not as if the Brugmansia is a plant you MUST have.
    Your parents may not want it indoors either :).
    Select another plant to grow in that space that has other qualities. However, *if* you have been growing the Brug ( with no problems)in a GH as you mentioned in your above post, I do not understand why you would have these concerns about growing it in the larger setting of a home.

  • 17 years ago

    LMAO Brandon!! I have had that happen many times..I just spit spit spit. Rinse & spit some more.
    O wait till you get it in your eye! Some folks on here have, and their eyes get dilated for days, etc..I have, it just burned for a few minutes.

    I too have had no problems with the brug sap irritating my skin..but each person is different, and it can and will affect each individual differently. Maybe its an immunity thing..like Poison Ivy..some people get it, some people don't. I can rub it all over me and not get it, but I do get Poison Sumac and Oak.
    I get brug sap on me every day..half the time I forget to even wash my hands afterwards, unless of of my girls is with me..then I get the lecture, well..really I get screamed at too, to go wash my hands. As far as they are concerned..that sap is deadly. I had to tell the lil one that so she wouldnt touch.

    I had all my brugs in the basement last winter a few kept their leaves all winter, and grew new ones..that is DH's hide away, believe me he's down there ALOT, esp over the winter, working on his bikes..he's still alive. Plenty of people keep them as houseplants, have them growing all winter, and are fine.

    I only 'smell' a brug if there is an open wound, then that brug smell is released in the air..otherwise, I have never noticed an odor floating around the room from a healthy unwounded plant.
    I have a small basement, and even when all those brugs were down there, windows shut..if you didnt see them, you didnt even know they were here.

    Maybe your sense of smell is keener than mine tho. If you are uncomfortable or have any reservations about having a brug indoors in a small area, then don't do it. You may me more sensitive than others, maybe not, who knows..but better to err on the side of caution.

    lol, if you dont know if you are allergic to wasp stings, are you gonna go and make a wasp sting you to find out?