tufaenough,
I just finish installing a long walkway, made from hypertufa blocks and now I would love to have some lights along the path and would love to have a japanese lanterns, instead of the pathway lights we buy from HD. please share your knowledge on how to make the lantern. I can figure out how to put the lights.

I want to make several all different lanterns.
I made a tufacrete version of a stone lantern I fell in love with on the net as my first attempt.

I would like to design the rest myself.
I know there are hundreds of rules about Japanese design and I don't want to get that involved but I am wondering if there are a few things I should avoid.
Colors, shapes, that sort of thing.:)

Has anyone got a link to a picture of lantern with round picture frame windows, or is that a no no?

Sorry for the second post but I forgot this question.
Has anyone seen a stone hanging lantern or would the weight have made these out of the question.

I think round windows can be O.K. - they're just made less often. Is this the sort of thing you're looking for? -

Click here

Hi Herb
The hole is the right size but imagine a round picture frame with round windows in those holes. The question is would it still be in the Japanese style or would it just be a lantern.
It's not a big deal but I would like my own work to be representitive of Japanese style so I can refer to it as a Japanese style lantern.
Here is a square example of the window I'm going to do round for my next lantern.

Concrete Lantern Window
{{gwi:1008254}}

Tufaenough,

I really like your 'windowframe' in concrete, or is it hypertufa. I'm going to try to make the same sort of thing. It'll be a lot easier than fiddling with wood.

And no, I can't bring to mind any pictures of lanterns with a large round window frame containing smaller, round 'portholes'.

I'm not sure, but I think that when I've seen a large round frame that contained what might be called smaller window panes, the cross-pieces have been horizontal and vertical.

Incidentally, here's a picture of a building with round windows that shows the effect of round windows on a large scale. People in Hong Kong have a rather rude name for it - in both Cantonese and English.

{{gwi:1008251}}

It's concrete Herb.
My own strong recipe, but it's a pain because you need tiny bits of this and that admix.
I'm considering using a premix grout or topmix for the next few.
Premixes have super plastisizers and admixes that make them perfect for this sort of thing.
You want the piece to be as strong as possible, especially if you plan to be removing it often. I plan to use real candles in this lantern on my deck...when I build the deck.:)
The rest of my lanterns are going to be done with low voltage lights.

I have plans for one hanging lantern as well.

Tufaenough -

I've made lanterns like this before, but they've always been concrete. This this week I made my first one of this kind from hypertufa. I'd used the original pillar mold for firewood, but it's a simple enough design & there was enough scrap wood around to make a new one the same size, so it didn't take long.

I'll post the mix recipe in the Hypertufa forum.

Click to see where I'm thinking of placing the lantern

Here is my first lantern, 4 lumops of mud and a window, I'm just getting it finished now.:)
I'm not thrilled with it.
I was copying a stone version off the net but decided to put the wind higher for more candle room and now I think it's a bit too high.
I have this urge to remake the center part even though I should just move on.
{{gwi:1008255}}

It will eventually go in here somewhere if it ever stops raining. As you can see I'm just in the planning stage of my garden. I have years to go

{{gwi:1008257}}

I'm tackling a 3 level pagoda right now. Well at least I'm making the pieces

It may be your first lantern, but if you were copying it from this site, you certainly succeeded -

Click here & scroll down for 'WABI'

That's it, it's listed on tons of retail sites.
I like it, much better than my copy.
My proportions seem off to me and I tink a darker tone to the window might be better. Time to break out the brown shoe polish.
I don't like my light cage at all. It seems too tall.
It all interlocks together so if I get tired of looking at it I'll remake the light cage.

Oh MY - tufaenough... that's QUITE a lantern!

I think the problem for me, is that the original lantern looks .. um..well.. a little on the phallic side .. though cleverly disguised

Your 'elongated' alterations however have left the viewer in no doubt (!)

The base even looks more testicular - is that what you were shooting for?

A TIP: - Don't plant any mondo grass near the base :))

Jack

LOL and DAMN!
I must be getting old.
It's does look a bit 'mannish.
Not the look I was going for at all. I wanted mushroomy.
Do you think it will frighten the neighbors or worse have all the widows coming over with cookies.:)
I don't want to send any misleading signals.
Perhaps the topknot should be left off to prevent enflaming the senses.

LOL - I think it will give your male neighbors 'Lantern Envy' alright...

actually I think you've done a remarkable job - you're obviously very talented... ( just lay- off the booze hehe )

If you want to salvage it - perhaps make a new base without the indentation, and a new roof with a smaller, flatter 'topknot'?

Jack

At least now I know why I didn't like it.:)
I removed the picture. I want tasteful in my yard.:)
It's a pretty nice mushroom lantern without the topknot.
I never liked the topknot anyway
I'm going to do as you suggest.
I'm going to 'shelf' the front with an angular look and make a flatter topknot.

A thought just occurred to me.
As a mushroom sans knot it's quite nice.
What if I extend the front of the base a few inches and 'plant' a garden of smaller mushrooms on that.
I could even tilt the cap to one side and putting that 'cowl'? under the cap you see on some mushrooms.

It won't be a Japanese lantern without the topknot but a cool garden ornament.

My next lantern will hopefully be more appealing. It's like nothing I've seen and certainly not phallic...although balls are involved.:)

Yes, I think the smaller mushrooms around the base will definitely create a more whimsical touch - and steer away from the [cough] 'Shunga Niwa' direction in which you were heading ;)

Jack

The link that I posted above seems to have stopped working properly.

Click here for its replacement

Hi Jack

It just occured to me that I had to take 'shrinkage' into account when casting the window to fit.:)
that should have told me something right there.

After careful consideration I've decided the only course of action is to LIE.
Yes I planned to make a 'manly object' all along.
That's my story from now on and I'm sticking to it!:)
I'll proudly display it...in my shop...as a conversation piece. The only way it's going in my yard is if there is a couple feet of dirt on top of it.
Maybe in a year or two I'll find a corner for it. Maybe beside a water basin that looks like a clam.

lol That could work.. ok I'm not saying another word! :)

In light of the direction this post has taken, I'm surprised we haven't ended up at the Taga Shrine.....

Damn Herb!
That's quite the log.
But is it doable in Tufa?:)

After admiring Tufaenough's concrete lantern window I decided to try to make something similar to fit a small upright lantern.

I used one of the wood window frames to make a mold in polyurethane rubber. ( I should have smeared the frame with Vaseline because the first try at making the mold was a failure and as well, it stripped some of the paint on the wood frame). Anyway, the second try worked & made a usable mold.

I've just cast a copy of the window frame in Plaster of Paris. When it's dry I'm going to paint it black & then glue or cement it in place in a lantern. Seeing that the frame will be sheltered from rain by the lantern roof, as well as sealed by the paint, I'm hoping that the plaster won't deteriorate out of doors.

I've been enquiring what other materials might work instead of Plaster of Paris, and a store that sells these things claim that they have some sort of material that sets really hard, strong - and black, if you buy their black dye to add to the the mix.

It all sounded expensive, so I put off buying any, but I've just measured how much mix it takes to fill the mold, and it takes only 40cc. so I'm going to go back & check the size of the bottles and calculate how many frames I can get out of one bottle. With the black dye in it, it would save the trouble of painting....

Click to see the frames & mold

Herb I suspect damp will be your biggest problem.

Have you considered 00 White Dolomite Sand (very very fine sand) and Portlands.

Tufaenough - I'd never even heard of White Dolomite sand, but I'm willing to give it a try. But I'll still have to paint the result black. Maybe I should use Admix (which I've not yet tried) too?

I think, though I'm not sure, that the material the store mentioned, to which they say I can add black dye, was some variety of epoxy casting resin. I must ask then how it stands up to the weather.

Herb

Herb just ask for very fine sand. Almost powder.
00 is the size. It's pretty common.
It costs about the same as regular white silica sand.

I think that readymix glass block mortar mix would make fine windows as well. It's white with very fine sand.
I've been meaning to try it myself.

Or use your copper slag 1/1 with portlands. It's not as fine as 00 but it makes strong concrete.

You could also try Portlands,Elmers glue as admix, and some perlite run through your blender if you want a fine easy to mold mix that really sticks together.

I've just had a second go at casting a lantern window frame in concrete. The first one was a failure because even though I'd used Portland and Copper Slag, it broke when I was demolding it. Maybe the mix was too wet or maybe I demolded it too soon. In any case, the cross-section of the 'bars' of the window are only 3/8 inch x 3/8 inch (i.e. about as thin as my little finger) , and I don't think any concrete, even with copper slag, is much good at resisting bending force.

To usual way to get concrete to resist bending forces is to reinforce it with rebar, but the only rebar I could find was thicker than the window bars. So I tried something else. This has worked fine. See the Gallery in the Hypertufa Forum for more details and a picture.

I've made a couple of Japanese Lanterns.My windows are wood with sandblasted plexiglass panes.One I installed a solar light inside with a solar panel on a remote granite rock.Presently working on a new smaller molds for lanterns.

Hi,
I have made several lanterns just visit the link below and go to the lantern page.
George.

Here is a link that might be useful: George's Japanese Garden

I looked at George's lanterns, which he carved from thermalite blocks. I Googled "thermalite" to see what sort of product that is, and all I see is UK sites. Does anyone know what the North American equivalent would be? I like the idea of carving rather than making molds and pouring.

I suspect thermalite is just a trade name for 'Air-entrained concrete' These blocks are much lighter in weight than regular cement/concrete mixes. There would probably be a few US distributors listed on google..
If you prefer to carve (as I do) hypertufa may also be of interest to you, as you can make blocks in temporary molds and begin carving after initial set (among many other options)
The small round chozubachi with the square hole on 'My Page' was made that way - and stained with iron sulphate

Jack

Gardener,

I made many different style lanterns from tufa, special attention to proportions. I don't like to make molds, I just look around and collect things I can use for certain shapes. Sometimes I combine it with sand-casting. I like the old, weathered look.

Andrea

I don't like making molds either - am too lazy! -- any plastic container such as an ice cream tub or even a plastic garbage bag placed in a crate or bin, can be a temp mold - it just enables you to have a solid piece of material from which to carve free hand.. for a range of sizes..

Another method, is to build directly onto an armature, if you're working large to very large. The sand casting sounds intersting Andrea, and that's also a way to make rustic 'stone' bridges for the JG - just dig your shape directly into the soil, and pour in the concrete mix

Jack

If you can find cryogenic perlite it makes great soft concrete for carving.
It's fine like sugar or sand but virtually weightless.
It's generally cheaper than regular perlite as well.
It's used in industry to insulate big tanks.

tufaenough -- now that sounds very interesting.For carving, I take it that you'd use it to replace the sand content in the cement mix? - or would you still add sand + this cryogenic perlite stuff? .. (you're not pulling our legs, are you? :)

Jack

This is the only picture I have of carved cryogenic perlite but I carve and shape it a lot. It also sand blasts very well. I've just started working with a small sand blaster and haven't got it under control yet. I believe you could do some great shaping on a lantern with a sandblaster
No lanterns to show but I'm working on one now that will be shaped and carved.

This recipe is 1 white portland, 1 white SILICA sand, 1.5 cryogenic perlite with a 10% Elmers glue admix and a pinch of red pigment.
This carving done with a rasp was done only 16 hours after casting. It sets up quick and strong. Just a quick wire brushing gives this cool rough but smooth finish.
{{gwi:66066}}
{{gwi:66067}}

I've since move to 2 parts cryogenic perlite, one part sand.
But elliminating the sand completely should be possible if strength is not an issue.

Very nice indeed! I can imagine your lantern will be quite nifty too, and I'll keep an eye out for the pics. I remember you mentioning silica sand to Herb eslewhere on this thread - must look for it... but I can already imagine the looks I'll get when I ask for 'cryogenic perlite' - like they don't think I'm weird enough already! :)
Jack

Hi Jack
Find a company that sells ZONOLITE products.
They make cryogenic perlite and a very similar perlite used in light weight concrete. It comes from Grace Industries.
So a supplier to companies who built concrete buildings should be able to get the stuff.
They also make POOLPAD a fine vermiculite that carves very well also. POOLPAD is used under the liners of in ground swimming pools. So if you can find a company that builds those they can tell you where to find ZONOLITE products.

My lantern will be made using these globes for molds. I cast the balls in halves. The base will be tricky, I will probably have to weld an armature if I want legs.
I expect it to look much like this stack of molds.:)
Pretty easy to do but time consuming to make all the round fire boxes and their windows.

I'm expecting this 5 foot high lantern to stack without the use or mortar so it will be easy to move around.

{{gwi:73844}}

Thanks for all the info, TE. I guess I'm pretty old-fashioned when it comes to concrete :). I will try to locate these materials and see how they work out for me.

Wow - Your lantern is going to be quite a challenge! I know you're not aiming for a traditional Japanese look, but if I could make a small suggestion, it would be to use an uneven number of elements - either 3 or 5 globes - better karma :)

Jack

Hi Jack
The challenge is just finding the time and the room. Making the balls is pretty easy. Thanks for the suggestion, I will add a ball! 14" 12" 10" 8" 6"
I would like to add traditional roofs between balls but Haven't figured out how to do that and make it look good. The beauty of this is I can add them later because these balls stack very well without mortar. I may need to strengthen the bottom two with rebar inside them.

I actually has the globes from 4" to 18" so I could go 8 high. Now that would be quite a stack of balls.:)
About 10-11 feet high.

Jack,

good idea about the bridge, I made 3 from tufa, used 4ftx2ft piece of 1/4 plywood, I raised the 2ft edges (put a 2"x4" under it) from the weight of the tufa the plywood had a nice curved shape. With R-bar inside. I use it over dry rock river.

By the way, I just realized that you are in Qeensland. My son took a job there 4 month ago for a year, in Bowen.The work is only excuse, fishing is the main reason. Maybe we don't have enough of it in BC. Got the pictures yesterday about a BIG BARRACUDA he caught, 6ft, 50lb.

Andrea

TE,
I've had an idea - stand back!!! :)

As you mentioned 'traditional' roofs, I thought the wider 'brim' of a yukimi would blend more comfortably with your globular design, and to make the windows long and wide would also create a counterpoint (round on round would tend towards visual monotony I think)

Anyway, I'll sketch what I'm visualising in a minute, and post it to this thread

Andrea,
Your son has come to the right place for fishing - in these warm waters, everything grows huge! - Bowen is further north, close to Townsville. I'm in Brisbane, which isn't quite as tropical - I could never give up my maples! :)
The tufa bridges sound good .. the plywood would give a nice even curve - you'll have to post some pics :)

Jack

TE,
I took my design cues from the garden pagoda. I've only drawn 3 tiers, but you get the idea -- also alternative round 'windows', and a 'jewel' on the roof of the uppermost tier

Probably not what you had in mind at all ??? lol

Jack

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:1008253}}

Hi Jack
Actually it is very close to what I had designed myself.
I used a coolie hat as my design for the roofs with a bamboo like finish running out like spokes in a wheel.
Very like your drawings in shape. The problem is to look right they have to be very BIG. The bottom one would be 30 inches across in the scale of your drawing. The weight alone would be substantial, if it could be done at all.
Smaller ones just look goofy. There is the potential to use REAL bamboo for the roofs. That might be interesting.
My base is almost identical although the legs are a little more vertical and more substantial to support the weight.
Windows I can make in any shape and I like your wide square-ish oval. The windows will have frames in them.
Give my love of color I suspect traditionalists will not be impressed. I'm leaning towards a stack of 5 different pastel colored carved balls. I consider alternating black and white or simple sandstone. I make a nifty coal black concrete that everyone around here loves.
So this is as much modern art/craft as it is lantern but it will be wired for lights. I plan to put it out as a lamppost.:)

TE,
I agree. If you're going for roofs on each unit, then they have to be quite wide to look elegant - or it would just appear cartoonish. It may just be easier to stay away from them altogether, and just make a stack of globes -- but then the long, narrow window wouldn't work as well, as it needs the wide horizontal element of the roof to enhance it

Jack

Hi Jack
You are right.
I will either go with round windows or a fat wide oval.
The balls, for stack stability will set into each other much deeper than the molds do, so once assembled they will no longer appear as full round circles. The bottom 1/5 or so will be inside the ball below.

Here's a link for lantern design ideas on Bali http://www.roteadhi.com/lava.html

Here is a link that might be useful: Stone Lanterns