Hello ilene in neok,

I am having some of the same problems with my tomatoes down here in Ardmore. I had dug them and the peppers up and potted them through our two weekends of frost and cold temps and got them back into the ground about a week ago.
I also have some yellowing of the leaves..quite a lot actually. But I did not add Epsom salt to the soil. I am thinking it is just lack of enough heat and sunshine but have posted on another thread for Dawn's help and ideas about them.

Guess we will just have to wait for our "tomato girl" to log in and reply to our concerns.

I actually lost one tomato plant a few days ago...it appeared to have gotten bent along the stem and was having some kind of problem which appeared to be some kind of rot. So I pulled it out. So far the others don't show any of that problem but they are just sitting there and not growing much either. I am ready for them to take off and GROW !

I know Dawn will tell us what to do. Anyone who is about to eat ripe tomatoes in a few days sure has my respect!

G.M.

"I know Dawn will tell us what to do. Anyone who is about to eat ripe tomatoes in a few days sure has my respect!"
--Yeah, me too! How in the world did she do that??

GM, has it been pretty windy in Ardmore the last few days? It sure has here. I wonder if that has anything to do with it? My little pepper plants were looking absolutely droopy yesterday from all that wind. I know they're big water drinkers, so I poured a little water on each pepper plant, expecting we'd get rain last night. Well, we didn't, and so far only a few sprinkles. But I don't think they're really that dry since I dug down a bit around the tomatoes this morning and found the soil there still moist.

This has been such a disappointing spring so far for me. I believe in signs and I came really close to deciding not to garden this year at all -- the SI injury, then the early warm spell that caused everything to bloom followed by the freeze that killed every peach, plum apple and pecan on my trees, and now all this rain. Not good, not good.

DH got a good deal on a John Deere riding lawn mower and he ordered the grass-clipping catchers since it didn't come with the mower. So I've started having him save those clippings for mulch and have put down my first layer of it on some of the tomatoes (but not on the one that has white edges). Last year the weeds, especially the Lamb's quarter, which I know some people don't look upon as weeds, but anyway that and the grass got in the raised beds and I just couldn't stay ahead of it. We didn't get much out of the garden, anyway, because it was so hot and dry all summer. I guess if we started eating the lamb's quarter we would've at least been able to say we had SOMETHING out of the garden. ;)

We live on the back of a City park, and lots of people do their daily walks on the sidewalks, so they pass our back yard every time they go around. This is the park where they always set off the 4th of July fireworks, too, so that draws a lot of people. The garden always is an ice-breaker, we meet lots of people that way. Last year, though, someone so admired my mammoth sunflowers (growing just outside the fence, but still on our property) that they broke off two of the biggest heads and carried them off! I was astounded. I hope they're enjoying their own Mammoth's this year from their stolen seed. ;)

Hi ladies!

Y'all know that it is very distressing for me to hear that your tomto plants are misbehaving. How dare they give you trouble so early in the season.

Ilene, are the whitish areas on the leaves only along the edges or scattered all over the leaves? And, with the yellowing on the leaves, is it ONLY yellowing or do you see any concentric circles in black or brown shades? G.M., I think I already responded to your questions on the other thread.

Yellowing leaves are one of the most common tomato problems you will see mentioned on gardening websites. There is a reason for this. Yellow leaves are just the way that tomato plants tell you they are feeling stressed. You know how we wake up with a headache or stiff muscles or whatever? Well, tomato plants wake up and have yellow leaves. Our aches and pains are a reflection of what we have been doing to/with our bodies and their yellow leaves are a reflection of what they are going through too.

The tomato plants' stress could be from one of many possible causes. Here's just a few:

--too much water, esp. when plants' growth seems stalled
--soil is too cool, esp. when plants' growth seems stalled
--air temps are too cool, esp. when plants' growth seems stalled
--any combination of the first three items listed
--too much fertilizer, too often
--too hot or too dry, when accompanied by leaves wilting
--too much shade and not enough direct sunlight OR
--too much sun "all of a sudden" after a string of cloudy days
--plants have been moved from a shadier or more sheltered position, like from inside the house or on the porch, to a more exposed, sunnier position without being hardened off again

Then, getting into more serious possibilities:

--spider mite damage, if weather is 90 degrees or hotter and you see tiny webbing on the leaves accompanied by little red 'dots' on backs of leaves (the dots are the spider mites)
--foliage disease, esp. when accompanied by brown or black concentric circles or spotting on the leaves. Could be early blight, for example, or bacterial speck. (I think it is too early for early blight and I don't usually see bacterial speck until late May either.)
--systemic diseases, but there will usually be other symptoms as well, such as leaf curling and distortion or sudden wilting of plant
--transplant shock if yellowing develops first week or two after plants are put into the ground
--nematode damage to roots if you are gardening in EXTREMELY sandy soil

Honestly, though, as I was running through the list of most likely possibilities and typing them, I was thinking to myself that most tomato plants will show some yellowing on the leaves early in the season, and it is usually just because the weather is a little cool, it is a little windy, and the soil tends to be a little wetter than they like it. I think tomatoes are happiest with the kind of weather we have from May through about the end of June, weather a little warmer than we're having now, a little less wind and a lot more heat/warmth.

If the leaf yellowing is on lower leaves and does not progress up the plant, that is just early season 'less than ideal condition' type stress. If the leaf yellowing begin to move upward leaf by leaf and stem by stem, my 'early blight' alarm bells start ringing. If the yellow leaves are a symptom of too much fertilizer, your should be having bright green vigorous topgrowth while the bottom leaves are yellowing.

The white leaf margins are probably just the tiniest bit of sunburn or windburn on the leaves. If new leaves have those edgesalmost as soon as they open up, though, then I would be a little more concerned.

If the leaf edges have the tiniest of little brown margins and it is present all along as you are raising the seedlings (and generally is present before they are ever exposed to outdoor conditions), that is a common problem nicknamed CRUD by people on the tomato forum. It tends to go away as the plants grow and it does not seem to indicate a systemic problem, although some experts believe it may be a very mild and aberrrant type of early blight.

And, girls, just for fun I am giving you the tomato problem solver link to my favorite website. (NOT because I want you to go there instead of asking me questions, but just thought you might like to see it!) I find answers here at this website when all else fails. I like to be able to look at the pictures and compare the problem I am seeing to what they show. It is an amazing website. Having grown up in Texas, so very, very much of what I learned about gardening was through Texas A&M University and the agriculture extension service they administer, so I am in my own 'comfort zone' when I use their website.

Having early tomatoes is important to me (I am so impatient!), so I try to have ripe fruit by late April/early May. Some years it works and some years it doesn't. The two plants with almost-ripe tomatoes are Better Bush. I buy two plants every year as soon as Home Depot or Lowe's get them in, which tends to be around Valentine's Day in the D-FW metro area, which is where I buy them. They are usually in 5" or 6" round pots and cost $2.95 or $3.95 each. When I get them, the plant's main stems are usually about the size of your little finger and the plants are about 8" to 10" tall.

I put them in 3-gallon pots as soon as I buy them, feed them some liquid seaweed and set them on the floor right beside my seed-starting shelf. On warm days I carry them outside into the sun for a few hours. On cold nights I bring them inside. They usually bloom sometime in early-to-mid-March. I usually get the first tomatoes off these plants in mid-April. They are actually a little late this year and I think it is because of all the cold weather.

Judging from the size of the plants when I purchase them, they must have been started from seeds in late November or cuttings in mid- to late-December. I buy the earliest plants available for early tomatoes because I am too busy with the holiday season to start seed that early myself, and I know I will really, really be craving a home-grown tomato in February or March.

Dawn

Here is a link that might be useful: TAMU Tomato Problem Solver

Dawn, you are a smart cookie! Reading through your answer brought some additional comments to mind. The first is, is Better Bush an OP? I'm getting a little into container gardening this year, and seems like this process of yours would work really well in a container. I'm assuming it's also determinate, hence the name "Bush"?

Last year I bought some blueberry bushes at Henry Fields. I was really disappointed about how small they were, but I planted them anyway. Well, the dog stressed me out (and them) because I saw him lifting his leg at them more than a few times, I'd run out there and hose them off, but I'm sure he did his thing at times when I was at work. And I really fought the grass. Only one of them came back up this year. So at my job they got in a lot of those kitty litter containers that just looked like they'd be purrfect for planters -- probably hold 4 or 5 gallons, yellow, have a nice handle, and rectangular shaped. I grabbed those before they went into the baler, bought 4 more plants, scrawny ones again, before I noticed my local Atwood's had much nicer plants for about the same $$. I transplanted my survivor into one of the tubs and started the new ones out that way, also. Except for the fact that the dog broke one of the plants brushing it with his tail, they've been doing well. dh made a drainage hole in each tub. The survivor plant now has flowers. So I might get a handfull of berries if I get my sheers out there on them in time, to keep the birds from robbing them!

I'm not much of a dog person -- got the dog for the grandsons when we adopted them. He's a neurotic guy, but a good dog, will do anything for people food or doggie treats. He's a terrible beggar. Thinks we're his "pack". Chases every cat that comes in the yard except the one that's "his". I think he's part greyhound because his chest and haunches are shaped like that and he has really slim but muscular legs, long pointed nose. Size and color like a beagle, though. Big brown apprehensive eyes that dart right and left when he thinks he's in trouble. It's hard for me to be mad at him, but I probably won't get another dog when his days are over.

My tomato plants just have the white edges along some of the lower leaves -- kind of looks like an "edging", you know? I have had a lot of the situations you list -- too much cold, too much rain, too much wind. This has probably happened to my tomatoes before but I just didn't worry about it, I'm just kind of protective over these since they're special ones that I paid $2.50 apiece for. Plus I'm so looking forward to seeing and tasting the fruit that I'm gonna be upset if the plants croak before I get a chance to do that.

Anyway, thanks for all the advice -- and where's the thread where you answered GM's question?? I'm still finding my way around on this site. GM I hope your plants are not having anything serious.

Hi Ilene!

Better Bush is not an OP but I grow it anyway simply for the purpose of getting early, early tomatoes. It is a determinate and it gets up to 48" tall in the ground, although it only gets 2' to 3' tall in a smallish container. I've never tried it in a really large container because I want to be able to carry it and out of the house easily in February and March. It has a huge sturdy stalk that can support the plant without staking or caging, although I cage mine anyway.

The earliest Better Bush I remember came out in the mid to late 1980s. It has been improved since then and I think the latest version of it is sold as Better Bush Improved VFN, although a lot of retailers only list it as Better Bush. It sort of reminds me of the Patio tomato but I think the fruit tastes better. Having said that, the fruit is nothing special in comparison to the many yummy OPs I grow. It just happens to be the determinate tomatoes that shows up first in the stores in February, so it is the one that I get.

The fruit are red, fairly round, up to 4" during the best part of the season. The earliest ones tend to be fairly small, but then I have it in a small pot, so they would be smaller

And I do think the white edging on your leaves is just a sign of stress as long as it doesn't progress and turn into blotches or spots on the leaves.

I answered GM's tomato question on the frogs and horned toads thread.

I start 95 to 98% of my tomatoes from seed (this year I only bought the Better Bush, Jet Star and Better Boy) and the foliage does all kinds of weird stuff some years. Other years it is just fine. No matter what the foliage does this early in the season, it tends to be fine later on.

You will love the taste of your OPs. One reason I grow so many different varieties is because the flavors of most of them are so special and so unique. With the OPs and heirlooms, no two really taste alike.

Dawn

Ilene...it has been very windy here in Ardmore. Annoyingly windy. Today it is not as bad as it was yesterday...but today is totally cloudy.

I was out trying to take some close up photos of my roses but the wind was blowing them around too much so I couldn't get focused on them.

Your place sounds wonderful with the park behind it. Sorry someone was ugly enough to steal your sunflowers though!

I really did like Grove when we were in that area last summer. It is really growing fast there isn't it?

I don't really think my tomatoes or peppers either one really have serious problems...they just both need some HEAT and SUN in order to GROW. And that goes for me too! LOL.

Have a great day!
G.M.

GM, I guess that's why it mentions the wind in "Oklahoma!" I have a lot of different iris, they are so beautiful and smell so good when you walk past. But the wind always whips them around until the first blooms are just ragged. Then the rain comes along and beats them down to the ground. I cut some and took them to work yesterday so I could enjoy them. I notice I have a lemon yellow that opened up in the night.

Dawn, I'm going to try your Better Bush method next spring!

We have rain, possibly some hail, in the forecast. I don't live in Grove, though I've been there many times, it is beautiful there. I live in Dewey, a small town just north of Bartlesville. We are 20 miles from the KS/OK state line.

Ilene
Sorry, I am not sure where I got the idea that you live around Grove. I feel embarrassed that I could come up with something like that...I am easily confused. haha
So Bartlesville, and Dewey, are probably around 100 miles west of Grove and a little north, generally speaking huh?
It has been years since I was up there. We travel I-44 on the way to Michigan to see the kids and grandkids but we don't spend much time off the interstates on that long boring trip...lol.
Yes we do have all those bad weather forecasts for today. I pray we don't get any of it except maybe some gentle rain. I don't even want to see any hard rain here as it will just ruin my gorgeous roses! They have had to endure wind for days but storms would do them in I am afraid.
It is interesting that you plant blueberries. I was always of the opinion it was too hot for them down in this area so I have never planted any kind of berry bush or vine. I know I sure don't have a knack for strawberries either. I hope all your plants do well and produce good for you this year. At least it is not as dry as last spring was. The weather this year is just plain weird. I don't recall ever seeing anything like this in my life time.
I know at almost 8 a.m. it is dark and gloomy outside again. I am just ready for SUNSHINE aren't you?
Have a good day.
G.M.