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melissia_gw

Organic fertilizer question

14 years ago

I am back .., Ive had to be out of town for the last month... My great grandma passed away.

My husband was taking care of the garden for me while I was gone... He did an awsome job... Except for weeding and fertilizing. : ) So that bring up my question.. My neighbor uses chemical fertilizers like 10-20-10 before he plants and after theyre growing. His plants are 2-4 times the size of mine and producing like crazy. I usually do compost tea regularly (when I'm the one watering) but this year my garden hasn't really had anything. I have green tomatoes - no red ones. We've gotten green beans even though our plants are 1' tall. The squash have bugs I'll take care of those today ---

Okay, so NOW for the question whats your Suggestion for an organic equivalent to the 10-20-10!?

And what should I fertilize with now? Blood/bone meal?

Thanks and hope your gardens are growing great.

Comments (9)

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I'm not the most experienced gardener but I'm using blood meal and it's working out really well.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Melissia,
    I am sorry to hear about your great grandmother. I was wondering where you'd disappeared to.

    There isn't really an organic equivalent of 10-20-10 because organic fertilizers tend to have lower numbers and a slower release of nutrients.

    I use Espoma Tomato Tone for Tomatoes and Peppers. Its' NPK is 3-4-6 and I use Espoma Garden Tone for everything else edible. Its' NPK is 3-4-4. However, I don't consider those fertilizers to be the main source of nutrition for my plants. The main source is all the compost and organic amendments I work into the soil sometime between the end of the garden season in late autumn and the start of the new garden season in late winter. I add not only compost but composted cow manure and composted chicken manure, often some bone meal and blood meal, sometimes some greensand and lava sand, etc. What I add will vary in each area of the garden, depending on what grew in that bed the previous year and what is going to grow in it during the current year. It also varies from year to year depending on what I have that I want to add. So, what I am doing is feeding the soil and letting the soil feed the plants. That is more in keeping with the organic philosophy of improving your soil long-term.

    I use the Espoma fertilizers for a boost when I think the plants need it. We have a long growing season and sometimes the plants need more nutrition than they get from the soil alone. One advantage of many (though not all) organic fertilizers is that focus on more than just NPK. They also include the micronutrients, which is why I started using the Espoma fertilizers to begin with. Nowadays, Espoma also contains beneficial microbes. Sometimes I use a liquid fertilizer like fish emulsion or liquid seaweed, but that's usually for container plants because they have a more constant need for additional nutrients since the almost daily irrigation required to keep them happy also can leach the nutrients out of the soil-less mix in the containers.

    For something like onions or corn that need a big boost of nitrogen, you can use blood meal, which is usually shown as 13-0-0 or 12-1-1. If you need a huge nitrogen boost because your soil is really, really deficient in nitrogen, you can use a urea which comes in many forms, mostly with NPKs like 30-0-0 through 42-0-0 although some forms of pure farming nitrogen fertilizer can be higher.

    If you've never had a soil test and don't know what your soil contains in the way of n-p-k, that would be the best place to start. Otherwise, you're just guessing at what your soil has versus what the plants need.

    There are many, many types of soil amendments you can add to your soil to improve it for the long term, including kelp meal, fish meal, soybean meal, etc. You also can improve your soil a lot by growing off-season cover crops and rototilling them into the soil a couple of weeks before planting.

    For tomato and pepper plants, I try hard to avoid giving them too much nitrogen because that can give you all foliage and few fruit.

    I'd look at the nearest Home Depot, Lowe's, Wal-Mart or TSC and see what they have in terms of organic fertilizers. It is a lot harder to find the organic fertilizers in stores, but it isn't as hard as it used to be. The TSC in Gainesville has been carrying some of the Espoma organic fertilizers for a couple of years now, which is nice. I usually order mine from Sears, several hundred pounds at a time, when they have a free shipping promotion running. Last year I bought enough for last year and part of this year. Otherwise, I usually drive to Mike's Garden Center in the DFW Metroplex to buy the Espoma fertilizers in 20 or 40 lb. bags.

    Dawn

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I've used a wide range of products over the last few years and continue to try a few new products and mix in the old. And to be honest for most crops I probably don't need to add anything. I didn't add anything to the ground around the tomatoes in the main garden this year. I did mix in shredded tree leaves and the straw mulch last fall. I also added a sulfur and iron product that is in small granular form. My ground tends to be alkaline and also low on the iron side. After I transplanted those in the garden I gave them a drench and foliar feed with a Fox Farm liquid product I use some with 1 tablespoon of molasses per gallon added. This last weekend I mixed up a mix with products from AgGrand. The products I used were a 4-3-3 natural fertilizer, Liquid Bone Meal 0-12-0, Natural Kelp & Sulphate of Potash along with 1 tablespoon of unsulphured molasses per gallon. One reason I apply it as a foliar feed and a drench. By mixing my own I can adjust the levels somewhat for the crop I will be applying it too. I mix it differently for the various crops and also depending on the age of the plant and the appearance and growth of the plant. I'm mixing in more 0-12-0 now to increase flowering and root growth. I'm trying the AgGrand products because I've read and heard good things about them, they are more affordable if you use large amounts and even some farmers in this area are trying them instead of the commercial made fertilizers. I used to use some of the Epsoma Tomato tone but haven't been as satisfied since they changed the formulation a few years ago. I like the Fox Farm products but they can be a little pricey. On my sweet corn I used up the cottonseed meal and blood meal I had left. Then I started using up the corn gluten I have left and also applied a liquid drench/foliar feed to the early sweet corn before I mulched it heavy this last weekend. Corn gluten runs in the 9-10 N range, Cottonseed meal in the 6-8 N range and alfalfa pellets/meal depending on source and type in the 3-4 N range. I apply alfalfa as pellets, as a loose mulch and as a compost. The main reason I prefer liquid organic products to the sacked dry products is I don't have to have 4-5 50# sacks around and mix them. With a few quart and gallon jugs of the liquid products I can mix about any combination I desire.And I can get quicker results if I see a problem I need to address. Otherwise I rely on the slow release of the product like the loose alfalfa I till in while preparing the soil. I'm fortunate as I can find several of the organic products around here. Another product I've used and like in the liquid soy bean based fertilizer from Bonnie's you can find at many of the box stores. The AgGrand site has some good info on amounts of their product to add at certain stages. I will attach a link. It is a guide only. I won't use the lime here as it says not to use it on alkaline soil. Without a soil test it is hard to know for sure what you might need. I don't plan to add much to the soil but will continue to foliar feed/drench to increase blooming and also as I see any conditions I feel need addressed. Overall everything in my garden looks great. Good color and growth. I really watch the amount of N I apply to anything but the sweet corn. I also apply a little more N to the garlic. Jay

    Here is a link that might be useful: Growing Guide

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Anybody use Milorganite? I just started using it in my tropical beds, due to the cost. Along with ironite and sulphur, since I have really alkaline soil.
    Although the thought of using composted human waste is disgusting, I figure they must have done something to make it safe enough to get the OMRI certification.
    I do have some herbs and chard in my tropicals garden.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Just went out and looked at the flowers. I wasn't able to do much in the garden yesterday. I fertilized with Milorganite on Friday and I swear, my passion vines, especially Lady Marguerite, have grown 8" apiece! They had been sort of sitting there, not growing much so this is amazing!
    The chard, which I harvested Thursday, was ready to eat again. I should have planted about 30 more chard plants. It's so tasty with poached eggs, healthy and really pretty in my tropical garden. Plus, it's both really heat tolerant and will grow through the winter here. A true year-round veggie for me! The only thing is that if I put it in the sun, where it grows much faster, it does burn up in the heat. But, in the shade, it seems to be more tender and milder tasting in the heat, so I just have to plant extra. My tropical garden only gets 2-3 hours of sun a day.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Thanks Dawn and Jay... I fertilized with Epsoma products (that's what brand was close to me) and everything seems to be doing wonderful. I just canned 39 quarts of green beans. : )

    Dawn I do miss my great grandma -- she would have been 100 on July 1. However she left us a great legacy - she's the one that canned and sewed... My grandparents are slowly dwindling -- I only have my moms mom left - whom I'm very closed too. It was her mom that just passed. I've been very blessed though, I've had awsome grandparents - they were fun and kind.

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Melissa it is a learning process and as you garden you will get better at reading your plants and determining what they need and don't. I'm real happy with my plants now. Not sure they have ever had better color and looked any better. There are a number of reasons. First the moisture we had for a while cleaned the soil. And I feel the Aggrand foliar feed I've applied although not as often as I should has really helped.

    Likewise I extend my thoughts and prayers to you and your family concerning your great grand mother. The memories are so precious. My "Mother" taught me to garden and a lot of my gardening methods. She had a "green thumb" and could grow anything. We cherish the newspaper articles with pictures about her veggie gardens and flower gardens. She learned her methods in the 30's. She was the oldest of six children. The garden was her responsibility along with the canning/preserving of what they raised. Some methods she never changed. Till the day she passed away 2 years ago she started every seed in a sandy garden soil mix in an egg carton on top of the fridge and then moved them to a window sill. Her plants were always nice. I recently read a post by another elderly gentleman that starts all of his seeds in a sandy garden soil mix. It just reminds me that many times it isn't the method we use but how we use it that determines the results. I will always remember helping mother can. Glad your plants are looking good. Keep us informed. Jay

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Tracy, I am glad you're happy with the Milorganite but I just cannot bring myself to buy it or use it. There are some organic products, like rotenone, that I just won't use, even if they are OMRI-certified, because of the danger. With Milorganite, I guess it is more of an ick factor than anything else for me.

    Melissia, That's a lot of beans. I've been freezing our beans and corn, but canning and dehydrating fruit and tomatoes. It's a very productive year (knock on wood, and hope I didn't just jinx us all) so far.

    You know, y'all will have to celebrate the 100th anniversary of her birth on July 1st--a celebration of a life well-lived and a legacy of doing many things like loving her family, and all her sewing and canning and passing along those skills to others. You were lucky to have her for so long. I lost my last grandparent 20 years ago. That seems impossibly long ago when I say it has been 20 years because it seems like just yesterday. My mom is the only parent that Tim and I have left between us, and she's in her mid-80s. Where do the years go?

    Jay, My garden has never looked better than its looked this year, although with all the rain, some of the tomatoes are not looking nearly as good now as they did a month ago. It also is producing at least as well as it ever has, and likely better than it ever has. Yay! After so many drought years that made getting a great harvest such a struggle, this is a nice change. Now I probably did jinx us and we won't have any more rain at our house for the next 2 months.

    Dawn

  • 14 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Dawn for some reason I have never used Milorganite fertilizer. I have a coworker who does and has tried to get me to try it. I never realized what it was till your post. I did a search and went and watched a video on how it is made. Guess I'll continue using the dead fish and composted alfalfa and horse poop. Anytime I use anything anymore it is more for quick results except in the containers. I added some of my compost to them this year. The Wally World in Guymon has some mushroom compost from Carol's area. Think I will buy a few bags of that once I get my PU back from the doctor. And try it also. I'm going to make my first raised bed. I bought some cheap cement blocks I will use. Haven't decided for sure what mix I will use. The area where it will be is the south side of my garage where the black Walnut roots will be. I may end up with horseradish there. But want to try raising it and seeing if it helps. Have looked at some of the Soil mender products sold in this area. Also thinking about the mushroom compost I saw as it is a lot cheaper. And many say it is a good product. Any suggestions on a soil mix from those with raised beds would be appreciated. I also have lots of alfalfa hay compost and some horse poop compost I plan on mixing it. It is free so hope to use all of it that I can. Jay