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Chlorosis

22 years ago

I have a silver maple that is severely chlorotic.

If it were up to me, I would cut it down and plant a tree more appropriate to the soil. My wife objects to killing the only tree that provides any shade.

The tree has been getting more and more yellow as time goes on, and, of course, when it gets hot, leaves start to curl and die.

I bought a core aeration tool, and I've been making holes about 4-6" deep, then filling them with a mixture of soil sulfur, iron sulfate, and iron sucrate.

I've also been spreading coffee grounds from Starbucks (unfortunately, there isn't one nearby, so this happens infrequently).

The tree seems to be recovering to an extent. There are some green leaves, and some yellow leaves seem to be getting green veins.

Am I fighting a losing battle?

Comments (10)

  • 22 years ago

    I'm not sure about the chlorosis, but I do know that coffee grounds won't acidify your soil. Coffee grounds are great for adding organic matter into your soil. But the "acid" is pretty much taken away by the brewing process. The coffee grounds will improve the soil but not change the pH. I'd keep adding the chemicals and give it time. Sounds like your doing the right thing.

  • 22 years ago

    Oops... I was off-track. What I meant to say is that coffee grounds will improve the soil structure but not alter the chemistry. I'd keep adding the grounds but not to cure the chlorosis.

    The cause of chlorosis, obviously, is iron deficiency. There is usually iron in alkaline soil, but because of the high pH, plants have difficulty uptaking iron, especially in areas with very high pH. The other cause is that the iron is in a form that plants cant absorb. I'm sorry for the vague initial answer. In any case, you're doing the correct treatment. Just make sure the iron is in a form that the roots can uptake, mostly called iron chelates or chelated iron.

    Now here's the part that stinks. Chlorosis can also be caused by overwatering and poor drainage. Ugh! Yellow and shriveling leaves is also a sign of UNDERwatering! What the heck are we supposed to do!?!

    Good luck with that tree. Maybe you could plant a couple smaller trees nearby and let 'em grow for several years. When they're bigger, you could shovel prune (or saw prune) that pesky sliver maple. Good luck!

  • 22 years ago

    We had the same problem with a silver leaf maple that the previous owners of our home had planted. Hubby did the same thing that you are doing, but it just didn't help enough. It took me two years of commenting on how awful that sick tree looked in front of the house to get my hubby to finally cut it down. The year we cut it down more than half the leaves were black and dead and it was infested with boxelder bugs. Why not explain to your wife the sooner you get rid of this tree the sooner you can have another one on its way to being a much healthier and more attractive shade tree.

  • 22 years ago

    Thanks to both of you for the encouragement and advice.

    My wife doesn't even like me to trim the branches that hang low enough to poke me in the eye when I mow, so cutting it down will surely not fly. Since there seems to be an improvement, maybe I'll be able to save the tree, anyway.

    I did plant a smaller tree. Unfortunately, it was before I did much research. I thought that since quaking aspens are native to Utah, that would be a good choice. It's doing better than the maple, but I've read that aspens are more suited to the mountains than the valleys.

    I also don't have a lot of options for planting more trees, because I don't want to spoil the view of the mountains out of the picture window.

    animas, are you sure coffee grounds aren't acidic? I know that coffee is acidic, and Starbucks touts acidity as a benefit of the grounds if they're applied directly (uncomposted).

    As you pointed out, even if they aren't acidic, they're still beneficial, so, whenever I get to Ogden, I'll stop at the Starbucks (the Barnes and Nobles and airport Starbucks don't participate in grounds for gardens).

    I think the coffee grounds would also help simply because the act of decomposition is supposed to be acidic, and, if nothing else, increasing the organic content of the soils is likely to draw worms, which should help reduce compaction, etc.

    From what I've read, adding chelated iron is a very temporary fix, and for Utah soil, only EDDHA chelates (which are significantly more expensive and less readily available) really work. I have recently read that iron sucrate (some kind of iron and molasses combination) can also work.

  • 22 years ago

    Just out of curiosity, is the tree located in soil that was disturbed by construction? I have similar problems with roses around the house where they excavated to put in various water /gas /electric lines, and some will do fine and with others its a constant battle to fight the chlorosis.
    One remedy that did help significantly was to make a raised bed over the poor soil and stuff it compost, peat moss, and other acidic stuff about a ft deep and plant something appropriate there. The good things leach on down and your tree might shoot out some roots into the better soil.

  • 22 years ago

    If the soil was disturbed by construction, it happened nearly 20 years ago. Actually, for a variety of reasons, I suspect that the builders may have dumped construction junk near where the tree is growing.

    The tree is already a little elevated, and I think the previous owners brought in topsoil (at least what passes for topsoil in Utah--as a midwest transplant, I have different expectations from topsoil).

    I guess my best bet is either to convince my wife that we should start over and plant a tree more appropriate to the soil or to continue to work on the acidity of the soil.

  • 22 years ago

    Getting back to the coffee grounds thing... I found the FAQ post here on Garden Web about grounds. The link is below. Seems like the grounds are "green" compost - beneficial but not acidic. I'm sure this will be a subject of further debate. In fact, when I did a search of Garden Web for "coffee grounds," the search engine came back with 38 PAGES of material. Yikes! I'd keep adding the grounds. They will help build the soil.

    I've found that Western clay is not so bad once you get some organics into it. Six years ago, when I bought the house, my "garden" was subgrade, compacted construction backfill. No even thistle was growing! Horrid. I amended with Back to Earth cottonboll compost (twigs and stems from the ginning process... great stuff!). I still have clay, but the texture is so much better and now the worms do my "double digging" for me!

    I forgot where I read it, but there was an observation about soils: It's easier to change the plants to suit the soil than to change the soil to suit the plants. I'll see what I can find about trees that like alkaline clay. In my crappy soil, I grow crabapple 'red jade,' dwarf blue spruce 'Bakerii,' some fast growing Austrees (willow hybrid - kind of weedy but I needed an instant screen), Western catalpa, weeping Norwegian pine, Tanyosho pine and a 'Twisty Baby' locust. Trees I've killed include a weeping sequoia, scots pine, dwarf alberta spruce (till I planted them in full shade). Chokecherry (native) is languishing on my clay hillside. Yet the pinyon trees I transplated there are happy. A $10 Austrian pine is happy with 2 gallons of water weekly. Yet I lost about half of the Rocky Mountain Juniper seedlings I planted as an experiment. Sometimes, it doesn't make sense.

    Your aspen trees will need a bunch of water. I shovel pruned mine after only two years. I couldn't/wouldn't provide the water it needed to thrive. Plus the autumn leaves didn't turn the rich golden color you seen in the high country. Couple that with the fact that aspen trees sucker like crazy. Now I admire them from afar.

    Maybe a good thing to do is to tour the neighborhood / surrounding area to see what other kinds of trees are thriving.

    Here is a link that might be useful: What's the deal with coffee grounds

  • 22 years ago

    Thanks for the info, and for the link with the extensive explanation about coffee.

    I guess I simply figured that if coffee is acidic, coffee grounds must be, as well. From what was in that post, it sounds like they're pretty much neutral. Since my soil is pretty lacking in organic matter, adding coffee grounds will still be a help, but I won't look to them for help in getting the soil more acid.

    I was gone most of the week, and when I got back, it looks as if everything I've been doing this year is starting to pay off. Most of the leaves that were completely yellow a month ago are curling and turning brown, but some are actually getting some green in them, and new leaves are coming in greener, as well. There's one section of the tree that looks like a normal healthy maple color.

    As far as looking around the neighborhood to see what kind of trees are thriving, it seems to vary pretty dramatically. About a block away, there's a silver maple that is extremely healthy, and I don't think the owners do anything special to it. I've found several types of trees that are chlorotic in some yards and thriving in others, and even some cases where there is a healthy tree just a few feet from a chloritic tree of the same kind (this seems especially true of aspens, which are often in clumps, or planted near each other).

    Driving around today, my wife and I were looking for chlorotic trees (didn't have to look too hard). We even found one spot where there were bright yellow trees close to the street, then some yellow-green trees a little bit in, and some nice healthy ones a little farther in. My guess on that is that there was probably some damage from when the road was built.

    I found the website for back to earth (www.backtoearth.com, of course), but it sounds like it should only be used if you work it into the soil, which is not much of an option for me. Have you used it as a top dressing?

  • 22 years ago

    The back to earth stuff can be used very successfully as a mulch. Look out for their rose blend, it has other stuff in it and I think its even bettter, in particular for roses, but it won't hurt the tree at all. Dump a few sacks around the base and let the worms do the dirty work, as it were.

  • 21 years ago

    Thought I'd give an update on my struggles with this tree and the chlorosis.

    Based on this thread, as well as one in the soils forum, I bought a "bulb augur". The bulb augur is supposed to be used to create shallow holes for bulbs, but it can go down a foot or more. I drilled holes as deep as I could and filled them nearly to the top with sulfur, then covered them with the soil I had drilled out. Between the aerator holes last summer and fall and the augur holes this spring, I applied a total of about 50 lbs of sulfur.

    I also continued to apply coffee grounds (my own, and Starbucks when I got near one). I finally realized that when I'm on the road, I often walk by a Starbucks, so I started bringing grounds back with me in my luggage. Between that and finding that there are a bunch of Starbucks in a small area in Salt Lake City, I ended up with enough grounds to spread on my whole lawn.

    The leaves on the maple were looking ok, but they weren't fully developed until this weekend. Now, when I get close, I can see that there are still some leaves that are yellow-green or yellow with green veins, but at least I don't tell the shuttle drivers to look for the tree with the yellow leaves (used to be visible from two blocks away).

    I had planned to spray the leaves with iron, but held off since they were looking ok. It was hot the past few days, so I was reluctant to spray (iron spray can cause burning). I may spray tomorrow.

    Even without the spraying, the tree is doing much better. From what I understand, the sulfur I applied in the spring won't be helping until fall, so I'm really hopeful this will turn out ok.

    Thanks for all the help.