I understand you can buy lead test kits at Walmart, hardware stores, etc. They're supposed to be accurate and inexpensive and can be used on dishes, among other things. I don't think they tell *how much* lead is present, though. I've tried to find info on this before, and it's difficult -- mostly just advice to not use vintage dishes in the microwave or serve acidic foods on them.

No of course not....they were made in the US...we didn't condone lead in glazes of ware used for food long before Franciscan was made.
I know of no commonly available US made ware that has lead glaze.
I grew up eating off the stuff.....no lead in original Franciscan. Where did you ever hear that it did??
Linda C

Franciscan Apple would be 1940 or a little later..I seem to think it was post war.
The Fiesta is notorious...one of the colors at one time was radioactive, slightly. But they changed the formula.
From what I know ( and I have not done any reading recently on the subject) lead glazes were made because the body of the ware was colored and needed to be covered and was cheaper than tin glazes.
Fiesta was very cheap when it first came out...chipped very easily, the body of the stuff was soft and cheap. The franciscan ware was china ( sort of) higher fired and much more resistant to chipping. I would sincerely if there is any danger in using it.
Linda C

lmark,
I saw your post about Franciscan Apple while searching for information about lead content in vintage china. I would like to get an answer about my china as well (Fine Arts China - Lilac pattern), but it looks like the only reliable way to find out if a particular brand of china contains lead is to send a piece off to a lab for testing. While doing my search, I also looked for info on the history of china manufacturers in the US which led to this link...

http://www.chinafinders.com.au/Histories.asp

They don't have info on the manufacturer of my china, or on lead content, but the history of Franciscan is mentioned. Thought you might be interested. :)

I'm trying to find out if Torquay pottery contains lead. I want to purchase 2 teapots but want to use them for everyday. I haven't been able to contact anyone so far who can tell me if this pottery is safe to use in the way it was intended. Does anyone out there know?

https://tamararubin.com/2018/06/leaded-franciscan-desert-rose-earthenware-china-made-in-usa-c-1941/ Read this her site will help give information on this brand its full of lead

sorry but Tamara is one of the kookie scare mongers. There is more lead in most garden soils than in the glaze of that china.

http://www.gmcb.com/franciscan/html/Safety.htm

I’ve been using Apple pattern US made Franciscan china for my family for 40 years. I have no qualms about using it... I love it and enjoy it. I wash it in dishwasher , but never bake in it. I’m fearful of cracking or crazing and mine are in perfect condition. ENJOY WHAT YOU HAVE. Frankly, I had never heard the lead issue until reading on here! I also have big collection of Desert Rose.... Love them both!

I have heard of lead problems with brightly painted pottery from other countries.

I might be mistaken, but I was always told it is the clay the pottery is made from that contains lead... so I always look for complete coverage of the glaze on ANY EARTHENWARE.

You were told wrongly, Ellen. The lead is in the glaze. Read this:

Lead in pottery glazes

Oh for Pete's sake. I've been eating off my grandmothers Desert rose China since the 1950s, inherited it, and use it every day. Grandma put it in the dishwasher and so do I.

Yep.....and those of us who grew up in the era of leaded gasoline....and lead tinsel on the Christmas tree....and tin soldiers...that were lead...etc etc.
don't eat paint chips....but in general the lead in your dishes won't hurt you....
Oh and I don't store booze in a lead crystal decanter.

Thanks for your verdure response, Colin, but this rom be an article fr potters. As Iv, I’ve uedUSFranciscan for years daily.

Computer went wacko..start over.......As I have said, I have used USA FRANCISAN Apple and Rose pattens daily for years and we’re all healthy....it’s my understanding we have had lead regulations in the US for many years . This much sought after dishware has been used by many for a long time. I gave place settings as a gift to an Aunt almost 60 years ago. Use it and enjoy it, If it was dangerous,the FDA would have recalled it years ago.
I would, however, be wary of old dark glazed dishes and those from other countries without health regulations.
Interesting article for potters....that’s all..

Well actually it's storing things in pottery or glass with a lead content. I feel no worry about drinking from a crystal glass....but don't store sherry in a lead crystal decanter. and serve foods on old dishes....but don't put an antique dish full of applesauce in the refrig for days.

Been eating off Franciscan Madeira pattern since 1976. Feed family of SONS on it. They grew to all be over 6’6” tall , one 6’10

and all college grads ( all had full rides) and all crazy good successful- SO answer is Don’t think lead or anything else hinky with using these old Franciscan Patterns

I posted for those who research and keep informed about items that are toxic. I have had my insurance company send in an expert and in doing so looking at the walls in my home for lead after a broken pipe they checked some of my dishes with a $50,000 detector and found high levels of lead in the dishes I had. I find it so funny people who probably dont check there blood work for lead tell us how healthy they are when they have never researched this matter. I mentioned a certain pattern trying to help inform those who use it to check there own dishes .Why so angry about the post . Science gives us answers check your own dishes or don't.

There would be no reason for an insurance company to look for lead from a broken pipe if you requested them to do so. It is up to the insurance company as to what they wanted to do.

I can totally believe you have lead in your system, Laurie.

Linda C comments above that no lead was used in the United States manufacture of dish ware for decades. This is untrue because I worked in a ceramics shop in the mid to late 80s. Lead frit was a COMMON component of glazes as was cobalt. It was not until the late 80s that society got serious about the use of lead with regards to ceramic glazes. (Lead was used to bring out red tones. Cobalt obviously for the deep blue colors.) Not only dish ware and ceramics, but textiles and clothing have been manufactured with toxic chemicals such as arsenic (green fabric dyes) and Cadmium and other toxic chemicals clear up into the 1970s in the USA. Currently China still used Cadmium in many of their products (an entire town in China was killed via a cadmium leak form a manufacturing plant). While we do not need to be running about, willy-nilly freaking out over every little thing (chemicals are used in EVERYTHING including paper bag production) we do need to be careful about what we put in an on our bodies. I am sure that even the American Flags we fly at 4th of July contain toxic chemicals because most of them are manufactured in China. ;o)

I said Manufacture....not glazes in a hobby ceramics shop. There is lots of toxic chemicals in artists paints and supplies.

When you have flood damage to dry wall etc the walls are checked for lead other companies may not do it mine did. This is to make sure if a company should be brought in to remove lead they don't want the workers exposed to it. A company was brought in to do the removal . If you want to eat off of dishes with lead I could care less but for those who don't and stay informed on these issues that is why I posted it. I care about other people's health and there is science behind lead exposure and what it does to your health.

Funny you don't mention what dishes you have that tested high lead content. This post is ostensibly about Franciscan ware.

My "vintage" Franciscan apple dishes, which were in pristine condition, reacted to a lead swab test from Ace hardware (swab turned very pink to indicate lead). They all went into my garbage can. My 1980's to 1990's Franciscan apple dishes did not react, but I threw away any that were chipped just to be safe.

Do you test the soil where your vegetables are grown for lead? How about the fruit juice you drink? Cocoa? Have you had the soil around your house checked for lead content?
There are many many sources of lead greater than what you might ingest from Franciscan ware dishes.

Yes, very true. Possible lead in many things around the home. Thank you for reminding us.

My comment was to address the question of possible lead in Franciscan dishes, especially the older ones. People can chose to use them or not. I chose not to because of the reaction to the lead testing. I especially do not want children using them. So into the trash they went. My choice.

My mother had the dessert rose pattern. We ate every meal off of them. My brother was tested for lead as a job requirement in his mid twenties and was fine. These were the only dishes my mother ever had and my dad ate on them for close to 70 years. The glaze was worn off and he was sharp as a tack doing his own complex taxes and never sick until he died.

If the dishes were that laden with lead, there must be more to it as to how it is absorbed. Is there anyone who has actually had lead poisoning from these dishes?

Thank you for sharing your story about good health after using Desert Rose dishes for a lifetime. I have read many similar stories. I also have read some stories about children getting sick from their favorite bowl at Grandma's house. (True or not? Was it Franciscan dishes?) I have been wondering the same thing about lead absorption. However after seeing how lead-reactive my Franciscan Apple dishes were, I chose to err on the side of caution and not have them in my kitchen

Does anyone have any lead information on Fransiscan earthenware Hacienda Green dishes? Thanks

I have two sets of Franciscan--Olive (dark) green Tiempo (the square ones) and a set of Desert Rose, both vintage from the 1940s-1950s. I got an 8 pack of lead swabs and tested 3 pieces in each (2 sticks were duds). None of the dark green Tiempo pieces tested positive for lead. However, all 3 of the Desert Rose pieces I tested were positive for lead. The Swabs don't tell you how much, just that lead is there free to react with the swab and therefore free to be absorbed into food. As many have pointed out, this amount may be very small compared to other sources of exposure such as soil dust leftover from leaded gasoline days, but there is no way to know how much of a risk it poses. Each must decide for themselves.

From the book Franciscan Hand-Decorated Embossed Dinnerware by James F. Elliot-Bishop, page 6:

"All USA made Franciscan earthenware contains lead in the glaze; however, since it is made using a one fire process at a high temperature, the lead is sealed into the glaze. Stringent testing has proven that lead cannot be leached from the glaze and Franciscan earthenware is safe to store foods on."

My Mom collected Franciscan Desert Rose from late 1940s up into the 1960s. Our family used it regularly, including me as a child. None of us got lead poisoning. Dad lived to be 90, and Mom lived to be 98. I'm still kicking in my 60s.

BTW, the EPA tested 3M LeadCheck swabs, and found they gave 98% false positive results.

I am alarmed about a lot of "stuff"...like the fact that I have not seen an earthworm in my yard in easily 10 years, and the fact that I rarely see a honey bee cruising the dandelions, but if there is lead leached out of such widely used dishes we would all have gone the way of the honey bee and the earth worm years ago.

As a kid I had a mickey mouse watch with a radium painted numbers and hands. I wore it to bed every night so I could see the time if I woke. Later I got a "nurse's watch" that also had radium dial and hands. Had to go be fixed one time and came back without the radium on the hands. I was bummed.

Also ate off of Fiesta daily in the 40's until my mother got Desert rose....

I don't worry about the lead sealed under the glaze but I do worry about the Glyphosphate and the "round up ready" crops.

Educate yourself with science and talk to people who's children are disabled from lead. Here is just one of many that talk about lead. https://tamararubin.com/ ,https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/lead-poisoning-and-health

Do you live in a third world country? I know of no one in the US who has a child disabled because of lead....do you?

The causes of lead poisioning I know best are those where a child eats paint chips or actually consume clay soil.

Wondering how our population grew and we had so many smart people to invent cel phones and the internet and artificial intelligence when gasoline contained lead and white paint was lead oxide and the very water pipes we got water from were soldered with lead, not to mention all the pottery and china we ate from.

Does anyone have information regarding the lead toxicity of 1973-1974 Franciscan dinnerware Jamoca? In my research lead was used prior to this period. I would appreciate any information regarding my pattern.

Thank you,

Linda

FWIW - lead toxicity is still a hazard for people living in old buildings, and children are still being exposed - esp. lower income folks. Just because one doesn't know someone harmed by lead doesn't mean it's a non-issue. Lead is in a lot of places because it was so ubiquitous for so long, and burning leaded gasoline put it into the atmosphere.

I am skeptical of that 'lead-safe mama' person tho. She seems to find dangerous levels of lead in everything...

@linda campbell-

This is a rather naive response from someone who is obviously not in the healthcare or public health field and has little knowledge about lead poisoning, how it is contracted and its effect on children and adults.

From what I know, the sources of an elevated BLL in children is due to things like deteriorating lead paint, lead paint in the soil and pica which is usually seen in undernourished children. And the measured BLL in statistics that I have seen is not necessarily corelated to symptoms. Children eating paint chips because they are deficient in iron and zinc are not the same ones who are eating their peanut butter sandwich from a Franciscan ware Desert Rose plate.

Lindaca92 raises a valid point. A lot of the “crunchy” people fearmongering about toxins in everything deny human impacted environmental degradation or “climate change,” and elect people who make environmental regulations less stringent. I’m not saying they’re wrong or right about lead leeching into food from a 1950’s glazed plate, I just think what they want for their families (it’s what I want too - a safe? clean, toxic free healthy environment to live indoors and out) is in direct conflict with the policies their gurus are currently supporting. I discovered this whole debacle myself when my partner brought home the coolest vintage Francescanware for everyday use, and I stumbled on the safety issues while trying to complete the set. I’m thereby not discrediting or crediting any views here - I’m just making an observation. I’m personally not advocating for or against the environmental deregulation stuff here (in today’s world you can’t leave it to governments to look after you - you’ve got to do it yourself), I’m simply making an observation so please don’t ban me. ;)

What does this have to do with homeware and this discussion? Do your own research, believe or don’t believe in environmental regulations, but please don’t eat your plates, and importantly, don’t let your decisions be influenced by scammy influencer gurus who advocate for all the things we all want, but deny some very real scientifically proven dangerous environmental impacts our human behaviors are causing in the world. Kind of illogical if you ask me… but like them I’m just another opinion in the noisy mess that is the internet.

Always amazing how quickly people are to deny scientific evidence because they don't think they were sickened by something. The desert rose pattern produced before the 1990's has lead in the glaze, fact. Some of the dishes produced in the 1940s have measured 120,000ppm on the food surface, fact. 90ppm of lead is considered unsafe for children, fact. There is no safe level of lead exposure and it accumulates in the organs, fact. It is unsafe, fact, and just because you're exposed to lead in soil, or chocolate, or ...? doesn't mean you should throw all caution to the wind and consume even more. The folks on here attacking those more cautious are ridiculous. This isn't fearmongering about toxins, it's real, proven exposure to very high levels of lead which is, yes, toxic. No one should be listening to someone who knows nothing making safety claims about dishes proven to contain extremely high levels of lead. Don't let a ding dong bully you into making dangerous decisions for yourself and your family.