I'm sure you spent a lot of time ... but I would have added at least an extra powder room upstairs. Where are your kids going to do home work? We have a playroom that I can see from the kitchen and the kids computers are there. I can see what they are looking at from the kitchen. This is so important in the crazy world we all live in now. No computers in the kids rooms - too much temptation that even the best behaved kid can't resist its allure.

6 boys sharing one bathroom will beyond toxic waste. They'll be running down the stairs and interrupting your privacy to use yours. And sometimes they won't make it down the stairs. That's also a lot of showering to have to happen in a single bath. A lot.

A two story family room with 6 boys will also be LOUD LOUD LOUD. I wouldn't do it.

You NEED a second bath upstairs, and you'd have to room to do that as well as a "study hall play room" if you eliminated the two story great room.

Please double check the plans...there is NOT a two story great room! The dining room is vaulted, perhaps that is what you are viewing as a two-story great room.

We all have persoanl prefences and we choose to not have more bathrooms. I'm not sure who cleans all these bathrooms in some homes. Five boys have thus far NEVER posed a problem, sharing one bathroom. Since the sixth won't be using the toilet for a few years, I'm sure we won't run into problems with him. I'll have one in college before the baby even starts kindergarten. Anyways, I completely understand the trend that many believe each child needs his/her own bathroom. Growing up...my family of 7 shared one shower and 2 toilets...it can be done. I do not ever recall any accidents while running down the stairs. We have thought this out greatly and I guess live a little differently, perhaps a little more "old-fashioned" than some.

Also, our kids will not have computers in their room, NO TV's, etc. DO not believe in that either! The mudroom has a desk for some homework. I sepnd a lot of time in that area doing laundry, etc. Also, we are pretty much a family that does EVERYTHING together on the island and kitchen table. I take my laptop all around the house and help with homework anywhere needed. We have printers, etc. all wirless and it works wonderful for our family.

The bonus room will be a play room for the younger boys (without computer). And the lower-level will have a theatre room for DH and others, LOL. The lowere level will be more for the teens as years to come.

Thanks for all opinions!

GreenDesigns, I don't think OP has a two-story family room/great room. She has a two-story foyer and (if I recall correctly) "piano room". I think she WANTED the sound from the piano room to be able to permeate the house. Hopefully since the family room itself is not two story, there won't be too much other noise bleeding upstairs.

I do agree with you tho that with 6 boys, I'd want two bathrooms for them to share. I can't tell just how much space that upstairs bathroom takes up but given that there are two walk-in closets at the back, I suspect that the total bath room area could easily be divided instead into TWO full back-to-back bathrooms with doors opening to the hallway.

If the total bathroom space (wall to wall) is greater than 10'6" wide by 8'0 deep, ONE could put in two bathrooms back to back in that space - both with doors opening to the hallway. It would only cost about $1000 extra to buy one additional toilet, one additional alcove tub, and a tiny bit of extra plumbing and the space would be so much more functional for six boys to share.

As it is, anytime any one of them is taking a bath, the rest are locked out from using the toilet. And, having grown up with three brothers, I can attest that teenage boys can spend as much or MORE time in the shower than teen-age girls! I recall Mom having to limit one of my brothers to no more than TWO showers per day and no more than 20 minutes per shower. LOL!

I agree the showers are the issue, and the fact that you cannot access the toilet while someone is in the shower. I agree you don't need a bath for every child, but I would much prefer two baths and smaller closets (they are boys after all!).

I have 3 boys and waiting for showers is an issue here - I can't imagine what would happen if you were 5th in line!

As far as who cleans them, THEY DO. It takes some training and some supervision at first, but they can certainly learn to use a toilet brush, scrub the bathtub, etc. on a weekly basis. You may want to go in periodically and give it a through clean but that should keep the basics clean (plus it is a very good life lesson!)

Yeah - 6 bathrooms upstairs would be one thing but just 1 is another. I grew up with 1 sibling in a single bathroom household. I still remember the frustration.

We also used to live in a lot less square footage in much smaller cars. Just because we all used to share one bathroom doesn't make it better....

The reality is that bathrooms are pretty inexpensive now (or can be) that living with so few is an unnecessary hardship. I get what you are saying about cleaning but I agree with Athens.

Two comments...first, I agree, add another bathroom. Make the one off the hall, a basic sink, toilet, tub and a Jack and Jack bathroom, where the walk in closets are, now. I think you could add regular closets to the rooms and have an easier time. One shower...five or six boys, trying to get ready for school? Are you sure?

Second...why aren't the boys cleaning their own bathroom(s)? Their future girl friends and wives will THANK YOU for this! Trust me :)

Congratulations on being ready to get started! I look forward to the day that I can say the same. I think your plan looks great.

Based on your comments, I think you have already considered the bath situation, so I will not comment on that. Considering at some point you will have 6 boys upstairs, please don't forget to specify noise reducing insulation between the two floors. This is often times not standard, but you will appreciate it. My parents have a beach house with the master on the floor below the main living area. Needless to say, when the grandkids wake up, so does everyone else. If they had only insulated better, they would get more sleep. :)

I would also consider having the stairs be one long flight without the landing near the bottom. You could do some semi-circular steps for the last step or two to open it up towards the front door as wll as the living room. This would make it easier to get to the stairs from the main living areas, and make moving furniture upstairs much easier.

Just my 2 cents! Congrats, as well, on the impending birth! You certainly have a lot going on at once. On second thought, building and moving in while this one is still immobile is probably a very good idea!

For the love of bathrooms...my boys do have chores and they do clean bathrooms...and they load our 1 dishwasher...though we've been told we need 2...and they help with laundry...and yes we've been told we should have two washers and dryers too...and they cook on our one cooktop!

I'm amazed how people who have none or 2 children seem to know how a "larger" family lives. I believe our generation today as a whole are too SPOILED. Perhaps that means teaching my children to compromise, share, work together ....share bedrooms and bathrooms. This is a very modern trend to have so many bathrooms & yeah just because we all used to share a bathroom doesn't mean we have to be excessive today. I know the argument is that a home this size dictates more bathrooms. I'm not worried in the least about resale. We have NO plans to move again and if we do, I'm still not concerned. Our last home, over 6500 sq. ft., YES, you guessed it had 1 large bathroom and 3 bedrooms upstairs. The house sold this fall (we built it 3 1/2 years prior) in less than 3 weeks...for a 150K profit. Not too shabby in this market. I wonder how some of your children will survive in college housing, while sharing bathrooms.

I appreciate your feedback, but I feel as if we have addressed the bathroom issue enough!!! If you show me your plan with 3 bedrooms upstairs for your 3 children...I will think it has too many bathrooms. The point is we have addressed this issue and I have explained myself. We will have only 1 bathroom upstairs and I promise that none of your kids will need to wait in line behind my boys. I respect that you live differently than we do...please understand that this is our choice and works for us. Hence, the reason we all have chosen CUSTOM builds!

I'm still having trouble understanding how a few siblings have trouble waiting for a shower. I guess our boys are spread out in age, but they seem to shower at different times...as they have different schedules...and different bedtimes. The upstairs toilet has always been used less than any bathroom in the house. Our kids spend most of their time on the mainfloor of the house. Thank goodenss, even the older ones aren't locked up in their bedrooms/bathrooms. We spend so much time together as a family. As they get older, I know they will continue to spend even more time alone. At our house that still doesn't mean in their bedrooms. They want to be in the lower-level rec room, etc. I guess a lot of your kids isolate them selves upstairs, thus mainly use their bathroom in their bedroom. Our bedrooms are pretty much for sleeping. A benefit of a larger family...always someone to play sports with, games with and entertain each other:)

I'm glad that some of you feel we have plenty large enough closets for the boys. On the other hand, I was so concerned about them being too small. We had much bigger walk-ins in all the rooms in our prior home. I'm an organized, very neat person and we keep so much in their closets. They are used to keeping all their clothes in closets, versus furniture in the their rooms.

Momto3...thanks for the baby congrats!

Very well said, Mommyto4. I look forward to getting your feedback when I have an updated plan to post. The architect is currently busy with it. I am chomping at the bit to move forward. It seems like you and I have a lot of lifestyle choices in common - you just have a few more kiddos. :) I have gotten the same feedback about my jack and jill bath planned for my 2 girls to share. Right now they share a room. In the new house, they will only have to share a bath - I just don't think that's too much to ask or expect from them. I actually think they will end up sleeping in one room, too, since they are so used to it. What part of the country are you building in? Will you do any farming/gardening on your land?

uh oh! I was writing my last message and posted it minutes after you had posted your reasons for only having one bathroom and without seeing that post.

When I saw that you had given quite a bit of thought to sticking with a single bathroom upstairs, I got to wondering if there might not be a way to stick with that single bathroom but make it use able by more kids at the same time. I was sketching the idea below out for you and went off-line to cook dinner. Came back to finish it and logged on to post... only to fine your last msg saying "enough already about the bathroom"...

I totally respect your decision to just have a single bath upstairs...but I'd already spent the time to sketch this out so I thought I'd take a chance and post it anyway. Same room, same fixtures... just walls and moved around a bit and one bifold door added and now one boy can have privacy on the toilet WHILE another showers and two others brush teeth, shave, comb hair, etc.

Momto3-looing forward to your floor plan and best to you on your future build. Funny you should ask about animals...I keep teasing DH about the goats, chickens and cow! I tell the boys they can gather eggs and milk the cow every morning. I know we will have a large garden, a few dogs, toads, and I'm not sure what else:)

Bevangel-Thanks for the time you took on the bathroom design, you have helped a lot on the entire plan. I had that idea in the past too and told DH about it and then we never implemented the idea. We will study it some more. I too had thought the "three" seperate space could certainly have benefits.

I would love to have that many children! Lucky you! However understand that men take longer in a bath for their business, my son takes at least 15 min to "use" the facilities, if you know what I mean. IF you can find space for another bath, I would. Those closets are huge for boys. There could be space for another jack jill bath there close to back wall of bedrooms 2 and 3.

Just reread the posts and see you only wanted one bath upstairs, so disregard my post. I did not want to erase.

mommyto4--different bathroom discussion...in the master bath, have you considered a 'linen tower' at one or both of the vanities? Like you, I'm a very organized person but I never felt very organized in the bath until we did the linen towers. Now everything has it's own spot & it's not just jumbled up in a vanity drawer. I keep our towels & washcloths in there as well as extra toilet paper, shampoo, soap, hair dryer, curling iron, makeup, etc. It might be something worth looking into.

Just a thought in your kitchen--love the big island & that long bank of windows over the sink!!! I can't tell how close the range is to the refrigerator (print is too small to read) but it looks close and I would worry about feeling cramped as I cooked. I've only got 2 boys, but they love to help cook in the kitchen and I would want as much space at the range as possible. Have you considered placing the range in the corner to give more space on either side of it?

Yes, I love the linen tower and we will have that in the master bath too. I'm hoping to make a make-up vanity counter on the wall between the master shower and sink/vanity. I'm thinking if about 18 inches deep and having it sort of run into the shower wall & move the shower door over a little. I would just like a little space to sit down for hair and makeup. I'm describing this all wrong/confusing, I need to get out the graph paper and play around.

The kitchen floor plan is not as it stands. It seems very hard to get men to undertstand how a female wants her kitchen. The fridge will actually go on the other wall, opposite from the sink. We'll have an aisle way there, but we have worked like that & it hasn't posed a problem. I want the appliances spread out for lots of helpers. The range can then move down some and make room for more cooks. My oldest loves to cook and the 2nd oldest is our baker:) I actually want to move the windows down towards the stove a little and not have uppers to the right of the sink on that wall. I'm planning more of a dish hutch to the left of the sink. I wanted that close to the dining room. I have never had a dishwasher to the left, the wondeful kitchen thread here--has informed me I will adjust!

Thank you!

I grew up in a family of five kids and we had a similar layout to what bevangel sketched - one long counter with two sinks, a separate doors to the toilet and the shower(and one good-sized linen closet). It worked great and we learned how to wait, share, and also to use and plan our bathroom time accordingly.

mommyto4boys, even with pregnancy hormones there is no reason to be rude. We only suggested changes to a plan you posted on a public forum - we did not insult your family. You took our suggestions and proceeded to insult us and our families.

OP said:
"I wonder how some of your children will survive in college housing, while sharing bathrooms."

Even the college dorms I was in and visited 20 years ago had large hall baths with several showers, toilet and sinks. And the suite-dorms had an even smaller ratio of kids to bathroom fixtures. Our kids will survive just fine.

OP said:
"I guess a lot of your kids isolate them selves upstairs,"

You insult our families and kids because we suggested you add one more toilet or shower. Nice. Yes, good luck to you and your perfect family.

Agreed chispa. Obviously she did not post the plan for advice, but for approval. When she didn't get that, she lashed out against people with legitimate concerns about her plan. Not a great example for all those kids.

CRAP..I just loss a very long response & don't feel like taking the time (again) to revisit...

the shortened version...

I mostly certainly felt attacked and insulted by some of you!

Too bad some of you can dish it, but can't respect my opinions!

It is obvious from this post and many of my others that I have taken the advice of many on this forum...Renovator8, Bevangel, others here & on the kitchen forums (sorry I can't remember your names). You have helped my floor plan become what my family needs and wants.

Athens...perhaps you can reread things to see that for yourself. It is insulting for you to assume I don't teach my boys to clean, etc. We all live differnt...I wouldn't want your floor plan and you don't want mine. I appreciate your and others advice. HOWEVER, respect someone enough to understand if they don't or do want something. I'm glad you have managed to have bathrooms for your kids off your bedrooms and toyroom. I don't want that! Give someone advice...if they tell you they have thought about it for years, lived in other houses, and know what works for them. PLEASE...respect everyone doesn't want the same things as you do. Advice is fine and well taken, but YOU and others wern't able to respect me when I didn't want to change my plans to be the way you thougth I should. Seems you were all so fixated on a bathroom issue, to lend any other comments.

On the same taken I find it so RUDE about the two-story family room debate here. I don't have one and don't want one either. I tend to side with the reasons popular on here...hard to heat, noise volume, & decorating. However, I have neighbors, friends & posters here that I'm fond of that have these rooms and love them. If they ask my opinion, before they build, I will share my thoughts. I would never be so rude as the things I have read on here. I'm happy for them that they love their room and their impressive windows/views. We all need to respect each others differences, wants and needs. WE BUILD CUSTOM HOMES TO FIT OUR UNIQUE NEEDS!!!!

Chispa- I did not intend to insult your family, possibly I hit a sensitive nerve with you. I hold my opinion that I do feel many young teens/adults will most certainly have a hard time adjusting at college and in the future. I also know of many families who do have children who isolate themselves in their rooms and upstairs. Some families build their homes with that intent. Perhaps yours do and perhaps yours don't. Opinions here again...I try to make it less likely for mine not to. I know parents who have computers, tvs, etc. for their teens in their roooms and like the peace of having their kids out of their space while they do their own things. I never said YOU do this & I never insulted you.

Last, but not least...my family is far from perfect & I never implied that we were even aiming for that. We are merely trying to raise our family, making mistakes & trying to do better as we learn and grow!

I didn't assume anything about you. I would hope you would not assume anything about anyone else that comments on this forum. I could care less what your plan is. It is your house. How am I not respecting you by making one comment about how I think you would have a better plan with an additional bathroom. Your rooms seem big and the bathrooms seem lacking. Not an unusual opinion.

I think if you read the thread objectively you will see that YOU are the only one who is attacking here. I am done. Life is too short to read that sort of toxic spew . . .

Does not the upper floor plan indicate "Open Below" on the lower left side? If not, then what is that space and how is it being used?

I only have two words to comment for you to think about the bathroom situation and those words are "stomach virus".

OP said:
"Chispa- I did not intend to insult your family, possibly I hit a sensitive nerve with you."

Nice passive aggressive come back on OPs part. The attacks continue. No one assumed anything about you or attacked you, but you were quick to judge/attack and make negative assumptions about the responder's families because they suggested you add a toilet.

There were no attacks against you or your family - reread the threads - only opinions and suggestions.

First of all congratulations on the sons!! I've got four myself and didn't miss a girl in the slightest! :)

I know that this has been beaten to death, and you are firm in your stand that your boys can and will share and take turns. But please consider two other aspects.

First since you're custom building this for you then why the bathtub? After the toddler years, the boys will take nothing but showers. You could let the little ones use your tub in the master and then have a nice large shower upstairs for the older boys.

In the same vein why two sinks but only one shower or toilet? I never heard a single one of my guys complain about waiting for the sink! Or the wait for the sink slowing them down for getting ready for school. Have you considered a tub/shower combo PLUS a separate shower in the bathroom (much like a master?)? That would at least enable two to get showered at the same time.

Finally since this is your forever home and since I've been there/done that and my guys are all grown, I'd like you to consider that one day those fellows of yours will be bringing home spouses and children of their own. I don't think you'll have such love of a single bathroom with several daughters in law all waiting along with your sons to use that single bathroom.

If you've got the money and the space, I'd do it...
If nothing else, do it for your grandkids and daughters in laws!

Is there a guest suite in the basement?

People...it's a bathroom! LOL

BTW, I'm from a family of four, but my husband is from a family of 11. Nine kids (at least 8 at one time) sharing one bathroom. They couldn't afford a bigger home, so you adapted...but not one has fond memories of that experience.

Moving on, have you ever thought about flipping your master bedroom and bathroom? It would give you the better view out the back and if you use the office for a nursery, you could access the bathroom, without going through the bedroom. Just an idea :)

Kudos to you, Mommy, for teaching the boys to share! They'll do just fine with one bathroom, especially since they don't know any differently. ;) I've always said that when we build, a shared bath is an essential part of the plan. Growing up 5 people and one dog to a very tiny bath, I firmly believe that many life lessons were learned. Now that my husband and I have to share a 3x6 bathroom, it doesn't phase me one bit! ;)

I really like the first floor layout with the piano space up front. That will be just lovely. I'm looking forward to pictures of the finished dining room, too. Divine!

I just have to say, first, that this is clearly a hill mommyto4boys is willing to die on (one bathroom shared by 5-6 boys). That said, there's lots of ways to teach kids to share. And the long-sighted reasons why you have two bathrooms upstairs are two-fold: one, your own convenience/time/hassles of waiting for everyone to get ready to get out of the house with one bathroom and keeping them out of yours. Two, future friends/family/in-laws who come to visit, hopefully often. Three, re-sale. That one bathroom upstairs will, I promise you, be the reason you don't sell that house.

But that's just me ;)

Weigh in, don't weigh in? Weigh in.

In reading your posts, we share many of the same values and certainly a like or similar parenting style. I am rewarded almost daily when my adult children call or text just to say "hello" or ask "how are you and dad today?" When your sons tell you they are raising their children with the same values and morals instilled in them - it will light you up within. Kudos to you for raising great sons.

You mention in an earlier post within the thread this is the forever house. As we transport through different stages of our lives, how we live in a house/home changes. My three sons have a six year age spread and they were all involved in school activities; some at the same time others varied. They also slept in the same room for almost 17 years. So, I do know about sharing. :-)

Imagine two sweaty boys coming home from football practice. They walk in, drop the football gear in the laundry room and head to the shower. This happened no less than two times a day and it is not fun in August to have smelly teenage boys and their overused football gear within "nose" shot. Or it could be marching band and they have to be at the field by 6 a.m. for an early morning practice.

Those "little" boys will also turn into big boys. The bigger they get, the smaller the footprint of the entire house becomes. Imagine having 6 the size of your husband, father, brother, uncle!

You can make it work with one bathroom, but plan for the future. Some great recommendations were made by other posters. I am always amazed at the Duggar family on TLC and how they make it work with so many children. I realized that each "dorm" bedroom has a minimum of a two bowl vanity with plenty of storage and a large mirror. This helps with the traffic flow for brushing teeth, combing hair, primping (and yes, boys primp), and more importantly, a place to store the hair gel, razors, aftershave, cologne, deodorant, toothbrushes and on and on. Six boys equals lots of storage!

We went through toothpaste and deodorant almost as fast as milk. While my boys shared so much, they also were individuals and wanted more privacy as they grew older.

Just some food for thought from a former "Mommy" turned "Mimi" to three wonderful little grandsons. Congratulations on the new baby. I love little boys and all the precious "finds" they bring to their mommy or leave for us to find in their pockets. :-) BTW, our first baby granddaughter will arrive soon. We are excited to meet her!

Thank you for all the words of advice, encourageemnt and well wishes. We certainly are taking your insight and ideas to heart. We are going about our new home in a hopefully, slow, well thought out process.

I also know that every realtor would shrug at the idea of 1 bathroom upstairs...the ones we interviewed to list our previuos home all did & were shocked that it didn't become an issue when selling. We are well-informed, but ceratinly don't know everything, and keep learning daily. We have lived in 6 different homes...built 3 and rented 3. We plan this as a "forever" home, but realize life happens and things change. Out last "forever" home was for 3 1/2 years. I truly hope we will be here for the long haul, we are much older than most of you would imagine (think ADVANCED maternal age...a few times over)!

I'm trying to remember some questions that some have asked...

The family room is one story, the "extended" foyer and staircase is two-story. The extended foyer will be a piano area. I still like open staircases and wanted a little bit of a "formal" area to the entrance of the home. We had a more formal home prior with a front formal foyer, dining room & study. We really wanted those ares to be casual this time; however, we still wanted to keep something formal. We have a digital piano and LOVE that we can hear it if we want AND when it calls for quiet...the boys can turn the volume down &/or use the headphones!

Yes, the lower level (not shown) will have a guest room and full bath. However, it will be about 2 years down the road when we settle a bit. Definitely in time for more of the boys to hit their teens. And most definitely ready for older boys who may need to move back home or DILS's. Hopefully, someday...someone will use the guest area. All of our family/friends live so close, that we never get over night guests.

Mimi- Sounds like you have a lovely family and congrats on the Granddaughter. I believe from six boys, I will get a Granddaughter someday. I fear how I would spoil her:)

I find it kind of ironic that you speak of a spoiled generation yet you lived in a 6500 sq ft home. You want to teach your boys life long lessons based on plumbing needs then why even have indoor plumbing at all? Look at the life lessons it would teach them to have to go out into the cold night to do their business or take baths in metal tubs outside. Most of us who had to grow up in single bathroom homes did it out of necessity, not out of some ill thought out planned life lessons our parents were trying to teach us. I did learn to share and get along well with others, but it sure damn wasn't from my childhood and having to share a single bathroom with 4 siblings and two parents. It is your house and your family, but I thought your comments were very rude to strangers who were only giving you insightful viewpoints that you asked for on a public forum. Good luck with your build.

My only suggestion would be to design the lower level now and rough-in the plumbing during construction. Another suggestion is to have the builder leave the anticipated amount of drywall down there.

I really don't feel the need to keep defendong myself. It is very hard in this setting to get the correct message & communication across. I also felt insulted & attacked & I realize others felt that way too. This is not a battle, please stop trying to make this into some sort of huge fight. My true intentions, for what it is worth...is and was to try to give examples of the way we live and raise our family, etc. to try to explain our reasoning for a certain house plan.

The 6500 sq ft home included a basement. We gc'd the house, my husband worked 50 hours a week at his "office" job and every evening until 1am and about 30 hours per weekend. We/he did the electrical, finish plumbing, painting, trim work, entire exterior, installed the hardwood floor, ETC. We had moved back from 12 years out of state and anticipated his parents to move in with us and they did not. We dreamed every space to be large enough for our extended family, who we were so excited to see more of. We learned your house should still be yours, as your extended family is only there visiting a small percent in the overall picture. We were so excited for having room for us all to be together. It was in a rather upscale neighborhood & we frankly did not feel it was "us". We really didn't feel at home & made the decision to sell the home, down size if you will. Have 1 casual dining room...do without the formal dining area, formal study. We made the conscience decision that the house was NOT us or who we were as a family. We decided we didn't need a fancy powder room for guest and a half bath for us in the mudroom. You see, we did live and learn. Thank goodness because of life lessons and our family not being spoiled...my dh and a then 12 and 10 year old finished over 2000 sq ft in the lower level in less than 6 weeks in order to make a substantial profit on our home. Oh, the memories...we basically did an all nighter one night because the one thing we did sub out (yeah) was the dry-wall and they were due at 8am in the morning. We were not about to cancel them, so dh frantically finished the electrical and myself and 2 boys insulated all night.

Lighten up-already! I don't have some ill, pre-planned, master plan to teach my boys everything by sharing a bathroom. The mistake only being choosing my words to try to teach some of you why we chose 1 bathroom. Good grief!!! This is not a pre-meditated decision, you are all placing too much of an issue on my boys' bathroom. You might as well know that 3 months out of the year they will most likley use a tree out in the woods. They are after all toad catching, river hopping, dirty little boys...so, I guess in a way they will be using the "outhouse" to continue life lessons!

pps7- Definitely we will preplumb and be ready for phase 2 of our home. We are also planning to have the drywall in the bonus room above the garge, as we will wait to finish that too.

As for bathrooms...would you put in just a shower in the lower/level or a bathtub/shower? I was thinking if little grandkids ever needed a bath they could use ours, etc and then put a nicer/larger shower in the basement? Any ideas on that bathroom?

I think if I were going to have "just a shower" somewhere, it would be in the Master, not at the guest suite. This would be especially true if the guest suite is only accessed via stairs (is your basement a daylight basement?). Accessory baths/hall baths I prefer to be tub-shower combos, and the Master as the walk-in. If a Guest suite is main level living, then, I might consider walk-in (assuming there was a tub somewhere else) so that it could be there for injury/disability.

Hope that helps! And, good luck with your build.

FWIW, we are building a home and have chosen to have 3 bedrooms and 1 bathroom on the top floor. Our basement will also have a guest room and 1 full bathroom. We're going with a shower only in that bathroom because we figure that's what most people will want to use it for.

You offended well meaning members who's intentions were only to offer you the help that you requested. It was really uncalled for and against the spirit of these forums which is to help each other. If you only want 1 bathroom upstairs then build only 1 bath, but don't berate people who were only offering their advice. You asked for their advice so you either accept it or politely decline it. No need for long lengthy response that has nothing to do with the issue. I am glad you and your family have built some great memories as that is what spending time with your family is all about. One must look at our own faults before casting out the faults of others. Good luck with your build and try not to stress too much over posts on a forum as we all know building has it's own stress as well as raising a family.

Thank you Todd33 for understanding that people were offended...as I have said before & guess I will say again...I FELT INSULTED, BERATED, AND OFFENDED TOO. I have moved forward...and...again...have asked the same of you and everyone else. Let's all take your advice...no need for response that has nothing to do with the issue! That would be great!!!

I didn't get the feeling that the OP wanted advice from her original post. I thought she was just sharing her "FINAL" draft with us. So, mommyto4boys, congrats on getting to this part of the process, and I hope the build is smooth.

RE: the guest shower.... If you think you will be comfortable with sharing your master bathroom with future guests who have babies, there probably is little need to put a shower/tub combo in the basement. Certainly, most guests will be taking a shower.

With that said, I would include a tub in the guest suite. For me.... I rarely have guests w/ babies, but my brother has a baby currently. When his family visits, it would be inconvenient for them to have to go to another part of the house for their baby's bath (in your case, up a flight of stairs...) I like that they have convenient access to a bath for this stage, don't have to walk thru our master suite to bathe the baby, don't have to worry about someone being asleep in our room and/or the timing, etc.

With six kids, you have the potential for a lot of grand-babies in your future.......

In my experience with clients, it is far more acceptable to be frank and critical when discussing design solutions than when discussing the aspects of a client's design program that are derived from an already established family lifestyle. Nothing is more personal than your family and personal hygiene would be a close second. Therefore, when discussing how a bathroom will be used it is always wise to proceed with tact as you slowly understand the thinking of the client; in this relm you should pull rather than push.

When someone posts a design here they should expect others to accept their program but not necessarily the resulting design even though they are often closely related. Critics who do not understand the distinction and offer wide ranging frank suggestions about how to live may find that they have unintentionally disrupted the discussion (or lost a client). To many there might not appear to be much difference between design advice and lifestyle advice but I can tell you that it is can be a serious stumbling block when trying to resolve design problems.

The important factors here are that all of the children are boys and they are of different ages but since it is difficult for most people to imagine the dynamics of such a situation it is best to follow the lead of the OP who is already an expert on the subject.

However, what troubles me is that the upstairs bathroom is directly over the living room and the fixtures are on different walls so there are many horizontal plumbing pipe runs in the floor, the sound of which will be difficult, if not impossible, to isolate.

I would try to reorganize the second floor so that the plumbing fixtures backed up to a common plumbing wall and the waste stack dropped directly through the first floor avoiding the living room walls and with as few bends and horizontal runs as possible. Two back-to-back full bathrooms each with a private toilet - tub room would add convenience without adding much to the floor area or cost of the project.

"Cheaper by the Dozen" is a book written by time-motion study and efficiency experts Frank Bunker Gilbreth and Lillian Moller Gilbreth about raising twelve children. It was made into a movie in 1950 and again in 2003. All I remember of the original movie was the father demonstrating how to speed shower by washing up one side and down the other.

Here is a link that might be useful: Cheaper by the Dozen

Good points Renovator.

So much emotion in a home build and the design a very important part of that.

For the OP, I know I was just pointing out that bathrooms are actually very cheap in the grand scheme of things and so if money is the reason, it probably shouldn't be.

I think the future proofing for grandkids is a very compelling reason to at least consider the bathroom issue. I know a couple a few doors down that has 6 grown kids and they sure are happy that they have 4 bathrooms when the holidays come around. The house can have as many as 20 staying for a few days with spouses and grandkids. They love having everyone come back home and are happy that they have a comfortable environment for them.

Yes, please talk to you builder and plumber about the upstairs bathroom. We only had a single stack coming down and it's in our family room wall. you can't hear anything when our son is taking a shower or using the sink, but whenever he flushes the toilet, there's a big whoosh. luckily, he's almost never upstairs. It's much worse at my Sil's house. there you hear everything. if you cant move the bathroom, then using cast iron helps. you can also increase the wall width to 6" or 8" so that you can add insulation to isolate the sound.

mommyto4boys, unfortunately there is no way to reduce the noise of a toilet centered over the living room to an acceptable level. Switching the tub for the toilet would help but still be unacceptable. You must redesign the second floor even if it means altering the footprint of the house or splitting the shared bathroom into two smaller bathrooms.

Insulation absorbs sound that might be bouncing around in the floor cavity but the plumbing fixtures that sit on the floor transfer sound directly through the structure to the ceiling below. Cast iron helps and resilient channels on the living room ceiling help even more. But the best approach is to not put fixtures above living spaces.

Thank you most certainly for bringing this "issue" to our minds. Our last home had the upstairs bath lined over non-living space, I think another bathroom actually. We will have this addressed immediately, better to fix now than to regret for years. Thanks!

If it were me, I'd put the play room, over the living room...it seems to have the best view and potential for the most windows.

Then, I'd put one big bedroom over the kitchen and another one over the garage. The bathroom(s) depending on what you decide, I'd put over the downstairs bathroom/mudroom areas. Instead of two boys to a bedroom and six to a bath...what about three each to a bedroom, with its own bath...with at least one of the two, accessing the hallway?

Just a suggestion...and I would definitely put a bath downstairs, if you're going to have a media/theatre room down there. Who wants to stop the movie, while everyone troops upstairs? Maybe a fridge and a little snack area, too :)

Over a certain period of time you have sought the unpaid advice of a group of well meaning, intelligent people.

These well meaning, intelligent people are now telling you that you need to work on your bathroom configuration. Instead of considering their advice, you turn the thread into a parenting competition.

You have admitted that your last "forever" home was a mistake in many ways . How can you be so sure you aren't making mistakes in this "forever" home?

Some other issues:

- Why are there 2 stairs to the basement? The one in the garage will probably need a curb.

- If the main stair were straight (no 90 degree landing) it would be shorter, cheaper, more elegant and allow a shorter traffic path. The lowest tread end returns should have a radius greater than the 1/2 tread depth shown. 8" to 12" is more traditional.

- the entry path from the garage to the kitchen seems unnecessarily circuitous.

- The space behind the kitchen island stools seems big.

- Since the 2 story stair hall is a such major feature of the house, the piano should be a baby grand if not a concert grand.

Renovator- Good points about the basement stairs and route to kitchen. If the garage stairs were taken out, then the door could be moved over to that area and the mud room and laundry could be switched. This would allow a window in the laundry room, which would be a very nice feature, IMHO :)

Renovator8- Thanks for your input, it is greatly appreciated.

Garage Stairs to the basement: We've talked about this in the past & the DH has these very high on his "must have" list. We had this before and he utilized them frequently. They lead into a "shoppe" area and he frequently went from outside, to garage, to basement with dirty workboots, etc.

I actually like your idea for the stairs. I believe at first our idea was the turn provided a seperation from the "piano area" and the foyer. However, I see that it really does not and see the benefits. I also believe traffic from the family room will better enter the stairs if straight. I must admit I have also pictured boys acrobatically swinging over towards the family room rather than make the turn of the stairs and come back around.

I know you are not a fan of wider isalnds, but I was hoping to widen that one some (used to a 48"+ width island). I was worried about it feeling too tight between that walk way when we had a lot going on in there.

Saving for a new piano:)

Lavender Lass- We will be looking at the layout upstairs. We were going to put 3 boys in one room, if this one happened to be a girl. 3 boys to a room is not a bad idea, but with the age/spacing of our boys it seems best to do two in each room.

Thanks for all the input and ideas...We have a lot more to think about!

LavLass- Missed your last post before I posted again. We previously had the garage beside the house and had more windows...including the laundry. Yes, I'm not thrilled to have a laundry room without windows, but decided to setle on that. We really want to push the house back into a narrowere mature tree area of the lot, that required us to move the garage & take width off the footprint. The back laundry, half bath, pantry & mud room area has been reworked so many times. This (as of now) has been our favorite revision. DH, really wants the stairs. They are important to him & he has so few "wants" that I want to make sure he has the few that matter to him (YKWIM?).

I would save some money and make the garage space more efficient by putting the garage/basement stair along the house wall (where there is already a full height foundation wall) and put the door to the house in the corner of the garage where it would provide more direct access to the house. I see no reason that the mud room can't be off of that "back hall" and the laundry could off of the mudroom.

It might be possible to put a stair to the garage attic on top of the garage/basement stair.

Perhaps there could be a small door from the piano space to the "back hall". The dead-end nature of the piano space has troubled me from the beginning. Traffic patterns in a house with kids should be circular with a minimum of dead-ends whenever possible.

There is nothing wrong with a 48" wide island although 42" is probably ideal and less expensive. My concern was the large floor space on the stool side where stuff will inevitably collect. Will that wall be storage or partially open to the living room?

It is difficult to make specific recommendations when the dimensions on the drawings are too small to be understood.

Renovator 8, Lavender Lass, & others still with me on this plan...

I started a new thread, titled..Second Guessing! Please check for a new idea.

Renovator8: I will try to get something posted with correct and readable dimensions. I understand what you are saying about the circle...we had that before. It made for a lot of fun at bedtime for little ones to run, hide & play with parents. Actually was kind of glad to see that traffic circle be gone. You have opened my mind enough to keep evaluating and reevaluating the plans.

THANK YOU!