Fisher & Paykel is a nice one.

I don't entirely understand your question.

If you buy an integrated DW of any make with a stainless or other front, it'll come with the company's handle, and it can be hard to change out.

If you buy any "panel ready" integrated dishwasher, you can put any kind of front and handle on it that you want. Some people buy the maker's handle to match it to their ovens, as seems to be the style in your example. Other people use a cabinetry door and handle like you said you'd like to do. Still others put a fancier custom front with artwork, mirror, stainless, copper, or whatever, with the handle of their choice.

In other words, the KitchenAid, or any other integrated model that takes a custom panel, will do what you want.

Beware, however, that not all cabinetry handles are good for use with appliances. There is a certain amount of extra tugging, etc. If your handles have good threaded screws/screw holes that are secured from the inside of the door, they should be fine.

As to which dishwasher, the new ones are designed more with environmental resource savings in mind than absolute function. That is, they're made to function just well enough, but save as much as possible. This is a good thing for global citizens, but has consequences. European models, like the Miele, use convection from the heat of the wash cycle being stored in the stainless steel interior, the metals of your pots and flatware, and the mass of your crockery, to do the drying, with the additional help of rinse aid (such as Jet Dry), which is a surfactant (breaks surface tension of water). This means if you have a large proportion of plastics or glass, there will be a certain amount of dampness to deal with. Most better American models, like the KA, have an optional heating element to aid drying in these situations. Even with that, you might also have to choose the cycle carefully to get the optimum result.

Additionally, all of the machines are designed to work with the most popular detergents (Cascade and Finish, or Miele's own tabs), and the rinse aid I mentioned above, and are meant to be run at least once a day. If you want to use one of the "greener" detergents, if you don't like rinse aid (the better models allow you to decide how much is dispensed per load), or if you don't do dishes daily, you might have to do some pre-rinsing or wiping to get your dishes 100% clean. Additionally, there are more forceful, "pot scrub" cycles, which are better at cleaning, but aren't good for delicates, but the cycles that are good for delicates aren't necessarily as good at cleaning.

Miele and KitchenAid are by far the most popular brands. You should do fine with either. Before you make your final choice, however, it's worth reading the owner's manual (available as a PDF on each manufacturer's website), to be sure you understand and like what you're getting.

Perhaps you already know this, but the only thing I would add to plllog's thorough response is that KA (& other American) dishwashers tend to be deeper (from wall to front) than Miele (& other European) dishwashers.

For "panel-ready" models, such as the one you mentioned, this means the KA may stick out a bit in relation to the rest of your cabinetry, once the panel is added on. Miele, being less deep, might fit flush. Of course, this depends on the specific depth of your cabinets / counter-top and panel -- and since its a new house, you may have more control over this than some others.

"In other words, the KitchenAid, or any other integrated model that takes a custom panel, will do what you want. "

ugh.................maybe not plllog!'

If Oscar want his Dw to totally disappear ala the slick Euro kitchens a KA will probably not fit the bill. In order for them to accept a cabinet front AND be flush with the adjacent cabinetry requires a lot more depth than an standard DW install. Even then, it doesn't look all that hot either.

Fisher/Paykel is an option but only if you want a two drawer look. You will also have to buy 2 panels for your DW instead of 1.

The best bets for that totally flush, concealed, disappearing act that you see (don't) in the magazines is a Miele. Asko or Bosch.

Thanks antss! That was the answer I was looking for.

What you want to do Oscar, is check the depth of your cabinet, where the DW will go.
As Mentioned, by Antss, many of the US DW's, especially the KA are deeper, (front to back) and if installed in a "Standard 24" depth cabinet", It will stick out after the panel is installed.

Our cabinets were considerable deeper than that so we could have gone with the KA DW, but in 2006, (when we were looking for DW's), only the Miele had the top cutlery shelf, which was a "Must Have" for us.

We are happy with the Miele (Optima), but were I buying one today, The KA would certainly be in the running, as our cabinets, (as I mentioned) are deep enough to accomodate it,----and it would have come down to "Where can I get the best deal" and KA would probably have won as Miele is "Price Fixed", (EXTREMELY SO)!!!

So, while I do like our Miele DW, I think their "Marketing Techniques" Suck!!!

Also it would be nice to have a "Heated dry option", which you don't get with the Miele, other than that, I consider the Miele and the KA to be "Equal Competitors"---Quality wise---and yes , I say this from "Personal Experiece" having owned KA DW's for many years and the Miele for 5 years now.

Good luck with your upcoming purchase!!!

Gary

Antss, that wasn't the question!! Obviously, you have to make sure the cabinets and appliances fit together. Also, the tradition by which American machines are made is to expect a veneer, rather than a full thickness door at the same time that many cabinets are made to a metric measure which isn't even a full 24" deep.

Anyone who wants flush installation of appliances should read the installation instructions, many of which say that 25" from wall is required for flush integrated installation.

Miele's DW's may be easier to seat flush in a 24" cabinet, but their warming drawer doesn't. Their staff suggest a veneer panel instead of solid for that circumstance. Their coolers are meant to be integrated in a 25" depth run.

For the custom handle, any custom panel appliance will work. For flush installation, read the installation instructions to know the depth requirements!

"Anyone who wants flush installation of appliances should read the installation instructions, many of which say that 25" from wall is required for flush integrated installation."

Correct ! but you simply stated that any brand would be fine and went out of your way to promote the KA as an acceptable solution - when in fact it is not for the look the majority of people are after when they want a disappearing DW.

This is not simply a case of foreign vs. domestic cabinetry or the depth of the Euro's being less. The N.A. standard carcass depth is 24" Period! Add to that the typical door of 3/4" and the KA simply WILL NOT WORK in that depth if one want to maintain a constant plane across the run of cabinets! I won't even go into trying to integrate a KA into framed inset cabinetry. It ain't pretty.

"Miele's DW's may be easier to seat flush in a 24" cabinet, but their warming drawer doesn't. "

Correct again! They did a piss poor job of implementing this product, and there are several better choice out there.
but........................this discussion isn't about warming drawers or Miele! I could list you a dozen products in a minute or two that fail miserably in the marketplace, so what ???

"For the custom handle, any custom panel appliance will work. For flush installation, read the installation instructions to know the depth requirements!"

Wow, what a revelation, thanks for playing.

hey dodge - I TOTALLY disagree with you re: KA and Miele having the same quality - especially in DWs. KA has been steadily going downhill in quality the last decade and especially in the last 5 years. KA DWs of the 60's and 70's were very very good. Some of the early 80's gear was still top drawer too. Since Hobart's divestiture of the division things have not been as solid. This is also from personal experience, and I guarantee you I have, see in the field , and go through a lot more DW's than 99.9% of the public.

Leaving your marketing bias out of it, you actually think KA's pumps, seals, racks, latches, stainless steel , fit and finish , and warranty are equal to Miele's ???

Well, my former KA was probably a 90's model, it never had a problem, until our extreme hard water (21 grams/gal) totalled it. I'm amazed it lasted as long as it did (9 years or so).

Of course I can't speak from experience about Today's KA DW, but we see many positive posts about them. Seems like I even recall a post where a Miele was swapped for a KA, due to cleaning problems--course only one post--but reading GW profusely as you do, I wouldn't be afraid to buy either one today.

I must admit, "Sometimes I get "Uppity" That's why I bought the Semi Integreated Miele DW----Ocasionally, I just likes to look at that Control Panel with the Miele name and all the pretty lights that light up when the thing is running. It's like a card game,
You Gottem, Showem!!

All Kidding aside, I do consider the Miele DW a Quality Product and in fact I did get a whole house water softener before I installed it to keep it nice.

See, none of us are purrrrrfect, even Me!!

Gary

Antss, what is your problem??? The question is whether they had to have the maker's handle! I didn't say you were wrong about the depth. Just don't know why you're yelling at me for answering the question which was asked!

I am with antss, KA is a quality unit but is not quite the same league as a Miele in terms of quality (IMO). I have installed or overseen many dishwashers installs during my tenure in the General Contracting and Interior Design field.

You don't even have to dig as deep as the pumps, seals etc. A simple way to "see" the quality difference is to take a KA and Miele, neither one of them installed, a quick visual will be a strong indicator of the superior quality of a Miele. A Miele is "packaged" so much nicer. Now touch it, feel it, dig around. I sincerely doubt that anyone could come to the conclusion that a KA is on par with the Miele.

Quality debates aside, my Bosch SHV65 is installed with a custom 3/4" thick panel completely flush with my standard depth framed inset cabinetry. I think most Euro units will meet the needs of OscarTX(the OP) without having to go with custom depth cabinetry.

plllog - I'm not yelling. Oscar's MAIN question was a rec for an integrated DW (title of post) + he stated that integrated was the most important component:

"We want the dishwasher to be integrated and use the same handle as the rest of the cabinets. " .............It's pretty much a given that a paneled DW can use a handle of any type, so jsut being a yes man on that issue is of little help. But, when you said the KA would be fine for INTEGRATING - you stand a better than even chance of leading someone down the wrong path. That is my real issue with your post, for the reasons already stated. Quit digging yourself a larger hole, KAs will integrate if enough time , money and effort are spent on the process. I can make a Volkswagen smoke a Ferrari at the track too, given enough $$$, time and engineers. Point is there are better options out of the box than the Volkswagen and KA for those purposes.

If you didn't fully understand Oscar's question or couldn't make an accurate educated guess, perhaps you should have limited your advice to the handle (which was correct) and not commented on whether the KA would integrate like the picture he saw (which it will not- without a lot of effort and may not even be possible in a retrofit).

OscarTX, I'm not sure that you'll be checking back but if so I'd like to say I also looked at Bosch, Asko, Miele for the fully integrated DW and agree that they are the ones to choose from. I read a lot on here and went to many appliance stores to check them out. It all pointed to those 3 brands - I too would have preffered a less pricey DW and wanted the KA to work but it would not have been flush with the face of the cabs. I have framed inset cabinets and didn't want the panel to stick out - I don't mind that you can tell if it's a DW, I just wanted it to be flush. I chose a Miele and love it. You can use a panel and hardware of your choice.

You'll find lots of discussions and varied opinions on this forum about these 3 DWs using the search feature at the bottom of the page but here's what I found and ended up doing - First consideration went to Bosch (I looked at them and liked them a lot) but I read some less favorable reviews of _recent_ year's models and have a couple friends that bought them recently that don't like them as much as they expected. I almost went with Asko but in the end chose a Miele - it really is great and I'm very happy with it(should be for the money, right!?) - we saved on some other items so this was a splurge.

Hope this helps, good luck and be sure to ask if you have more questions. GW is a very helpful bunch of people.

This is silly.

Look at the manufacturer's pictures, if it looks good, read the instructions. There are varying degrees of "integration" when it comes to dishwashers. And depending on the cabinetry type, it may or may not work.

It's not that hard.