A heatpump condensor costs about $500 more than the same A/c version. It shouldn't cost much more to upgrade to heatpump over straight A/C. Heatpumps provide cheap heat and offer flexibility. I have nearly identical home as yours. The heatpump is great above 30 F. When it goes into defrost the gas kicks on. When below 30 I use gas but I could go lower with heatpump if I want.

In your climate I would go highest eff. single stage. 2 stage isn't worth it unless your in really humid A/C driven climate.

dalgety

first off,I like HPs as well-for the right application. HPs are not for everyone or every application. There are many factors to consider for HPs and those include location/winter climate, comfort, home's envelope/insulation properties, and electric rate vs other alternative heating fuels.

I will assume your man J is correctly performed with your outdoor and indoor design temps. I would review this carefully for accuracy.

then why is Trane dealer oversizing you on the furnace? the 60K XV95 would be more than adequate.

I personally think a HP or hybrid system might be overkill for your situation.

For your situation/location, I have nothing against the XL16i since humidity is not an issue. Other mdls to consider would be correctly sized XR15 or XL15i.

How did your old three ton perform?

what thermostat did Trane dealer recommend?

I would prefer Trane's matching Perfect Fit box filter because of fit to furnace.

IMO

$1500 is not an appropriate price upgrade from the AC condenser to the HP version...

when a dealer does this, he is either trying to take advantage of his customer or steering you to stay with the AC version...

Thanks for your feedback. Since my Trane guy is a vocal fan of HPs, I have to assume he's not trying to steer me towards the AC. He has the 16i HP on his house, and has really liked it. He doesn't seem like the "take advantage of his customer" type of guy. Sounds like I need to make sure we're apples to apples on the HP vs AC estimates and ask him to explain the price bump.

The old 3-ton was paired with a 4-ton evaporator, and it performed reasonably well. During the hottest days it ran pretty continuously, but we didn't feel we were sacrificing much by way of comfort. If we go away from home for a few days, and set the TStat up during our absence, it takes quite a while to bring the temp back down when we return. Otherwise it does an adequate job. I think it is important to mention that the install of that unit is a real abomination. They hacked together a sheet metal coil box that didn't allow any access to the coil. Pretty hard to believe that thing was achieving much by way of efficiency, so I hope a properly constructed system of the same size will provide a better result.

Even though our gas rates are among the lowest in the country, so are our power rates. Current rates notwithstanding, I love the idea of having the option to choose between electric or gas for heating purposes. If the differential is $500 or so, I'll go with a HP. If it's $1500, probably not.

We haven't talked about a specific TStat model yet, though I work for a home automation company and we manufacture our own TStat that integrates with the rest of the home control system, so I'll probably use that. It supports heat pumps and auxiliary heat. Thoughts?

Thanks.

dalgety

generally speaking, a HP version of an AC condenser should not cost more than $750, that would include dealer's cost difference plus a reasonable markup. $1500 is absurd!

for the XV95 furnace you want a good two stg thermostat that has dual fuel capability( if paired with HP). I recommend Trane's 803 or equivalent HW 8321.

IMO

I was told that the price of the hybrid upgrade includes the extra cost of the condenser, an IAQ TStat, the outdoor sensor, the "hybrid accessories", and extra required wiring to the condenser.

I have no idea what those accessories might be. Currently, we have just two wires to the condenser, but as part of this replacement we are going to relocate the unit, so will be running a new line set anyway (priced separately).

$1500 still feels high to me. Will get another bid on this upgrade on Thursday.

Thanks.

I paid $229 for the focus pro wireless thermostat kit. That includes outdoor wireless temp sensor, the fancy thermostat can control everything for dual fuel and the base which conects to the furnace and the wires from the condensor.

Typically HVAC guys have a wire which has multi-wires inside it. They simply run this one wire and they have all the wires they need to the unit to connect to the airhandler from the condensor.

It takes a little extra time to figure out whichwires need to connect from the outside connector to the inside furnace/thermostat-base.

Not that big of a deal.

Sounds like a very good dealer. Salesmen as thorough as he was are hard to come by. If the dealer guarantees his load calc and the ability of the XL16i to cool the home to your preferences, then I have no issues with the 16i. Trane improved the numbers on it, but unfortunately not tremendously for the 3 ton in terms of capacities. Most models never have exact nominal capacities, but they generally don't deviate as much as 4-5% as in the XL16i.

The salesman sounds impressive. Question is, are the installers just as competent?

dalgety

a couple of things.

what does dealer say about the size of furnace? 60K or 80K?

how will you control the humidifier? I personally prefer a thermostat that can handle auxilliary equipment. Since humidity is not a big deal for your area/climate, then you really can't take advantage of the HW VP IAQ "DOD" feature-dehumidify on demand. But this stat is excellent for dual fuel applications and handling the humidifier. You need to weigh this out against the home automation thermostat you referred to earlier.

not trying to confuse the issues-just want you to be aware.

IMO