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carriebor

Contiguous Countertops - continued w/ existing floorplan

12 years ago

Hi all,

I realized several things, after my last post - the most important being what a valuable resource you all are! I've linked the last post here, and there are links throughout to photos of my first floor. I've attached here a to-scale (well, pretty much) plan of my current open floor-plan kitchen/dining area/living room.

At this point, I've hired a KD & met with her once so she could measure my space & talk to me about what I want/don't want. I'm awaiting floor plan design ideas.

I've answered the questions from this forum's FAQ below:

How many people will work food in the kitchen at the same time? Or, IOW, is this a one-butt kitchen?

-Yup. a one-butt kitchen. I do rent out my guest room via airbnb, and I do give kitchen access to my guests, but generally, it will be just me.

Are there any special cooking needs - and related appliances and storage - to consider? (Do you bake, microwave popcorn, keep Kosher, make espresso, grill indoors, etc.)

- I don't cook much - but do use the microwave (frozen dinners, mostly) I also have 3 cats, so cat food storage & a place to have water bowl that I'm not tripping over. I often feed them on various countertops & window sills...

Who else will use the kitchen and for what? Coffee with the neighbor, feeding the dog, little kids doing homework, big kids surfing the net, etc. Consider all the possible non-food activities as well as any users� special needs: toddlers, elderly, physically challenged, etc.

-other than feeding cats & airbnb guests, mostly me and not even regular cooking at that.

What is the traffic situation? Does part of the kitchen function as a passageway from one part of the home to another? Where do the groceries come in and where does the garbage go out?

-Especially in the warmer months, I am in and out the garden door CONSTANTLY. I also generally wash hands coming back from the garden, so sink has to have easy access to door. Groceries come in the front door, trash out the front, unless I have too much to wait for weekly pick up, in which case it might go in back yard or basement, depending.

What are your storage needs? Do you shop frequently or prefer to keep a lot on hand? Do you have lots of gadgets, china, special pans, etc.

- I don't have that much of anything. It would be nice to get rid of the little bookshelf near the dining kitchen to put cooking & gardening books somewhere else to make room for more kitchen/dining space.

Where are you on �form over function� vs. �function over form�? Would you prioritize perfect point of use storage or perfect visual symmetry in the look of the cabinets?

- I'm big into windows. Any door has to have windows & I'm probably unwilling to block off any windows. I'm happy to lose cabinets space for a nice view.

Is there something you want so bad (a pantry, an island, a 48? range) that you will accept a compromise such as narrow passage, less counter, etc.

-I'd really like to be able to look out a window while washing dishes AND while eating breakfast.

What is your budget? Is there money for structural changes like moving a window?

- I'm thinking $30,000. That's up from my initial $20,000 thought. I could go up if I thought it could make a big difference in my happiness... I don't need anything high-end, but I want it to look & feel good. Also, I've never found counter seating to be comfortable. I know that will probably limit my options.

Here is a link that might be useful: Older post, with photos

Comments (15)

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    here is a place to start, it looks like the only place a fridge would fit would be between your two back wall windows.

    there are a number of options for sink and cook-top, on the peninsula return you can drop part of the counter to table height to accommodate two chairs.

    I have really enjoyed your photos - what a beautiful garden you have, I'll bet with the city location you enjoy a warmer micro-climate there. I always enjoy looking at green photos during our dark winters.

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Thank you, detroit_burb!

    I wonder if I'd still be able to get easily in & out of the basement door with the peninsula/chairs there? Would the chairs be outside the kitchen, facing in, I assume?

    I'd really, really like to be looking out a window while washing dishes, and maybe while eating, too! I really like the u-shape you've put in here.

    Thank you so much!

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I would look at doing a u in the other direction and keep fridge and pantry where it and the current stove is. Replace the 33" window with a full glass door. Put stove where sink is, add window where existing door is. Put sink in middle of u (sorry didn't check dimensions, assume it is fine). Add a window over the sink. Then wrap counter over, although you could leave it open too.

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Lyfia - another good suggestions. One thing I'm running in to, with ideas of adding and removing & switching doors & windows is that I really have no idea what that will do to my (supposed?) budget...

    What does wrapping a counter over mean?

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Carrie- I love to garden and have cats, too! :)

    Here's a quick idea and I thought I'd post one of your beautiful garden photos. Such a lovely space! {{gwi:1604321}}From Kitchen plans
    {{gwi:1604322}}From Kitchen plans

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Thanks, Lavender_lass!

    So, your proposal is kind of what lyfia's is, right? Move door to where the window is, ad a window & the sink to look over the garden. Do you have the existing door being closed off completely?

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    reframing a door into a window is not a huge expense because the header is already in there, you will need a mason to fill in below.

    opening the brick for a new door will require some investigation to make sure nothing is in the wall, and will need a header to be put in prior to framing. Whatever brick is removed needs to be salvaged, and can be used to fill in the area from the door that becomes a window. You will need to interview and ask lots of questions to find a builder who is willing to gently remove the existing door and trim and reuse it, and gently remove brick to make whatever changes you do appear to be vintage - which I think is important in a home like yours. You can get estimates for this work on your own before bidding out the kitchen. 30K for a very small space should be plenty, unless you want subzero/wolf appliances.

    based on my experience having this kind of work done on my various homes, reworking an existing opening to make it a window, and making a new opening for a door using existing door and trim should be 3K-5K.

    here's another rough try at the drawing for you...

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    this one has the cooktop in the correct place

    edited to fix the picture

    This post was edited by detroit_burb on Mon, Jan 20, 14 at 22:58

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Thank you, detroit_burb!

    So, the existing door cost me $200 at Lowe's - so, while I do like that it is glass in the middle it isn't a door that necessarily needs salvaging. If I end up going with the layout similar to the one you proposed, above, I may put in French doors (opening out) on the wall w/ the peninsula, OR, if I do re-purpose (or use another normal sized door, maybe I'd add a window over there as well. I'm a bit window-happy. Philly rowhouses tend to be pretty dark...

    Oh, and I'm thinking I will go with IKEA cabinets, wood floors, and I really want the recycled paper countertops (Richlite, probably) and definitely not high end appliances - I don't cook much, and I'd rather my appliances just blended in - they will not be my kitchen's centerpieces.

    I'm debating a few things: since I don't cook (much) KD suggested getting a convection microwave (above range) and a gas cooktop for cooking - I'm thinking about it. I don't currently have a DW, and really haven't wanted one, but getting one might get me to limit the dish-clutter that is always on my drainboard.

    I think I'm going to go with a colorful tile backsplash - maybe Mexican tile.

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Ah, thanks for the updated plan. I could also switch your cooktop & sink & install a window over the sink. I think I'm crazy.

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Oh, and ps: maybe it's obvious, but each square on the graph paper is 10" (except in the places that I fudged, but those are more or less close-ish.)

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    if you are not going high end, my experience with buying appliances is that a decent range is not much more than a cooktop, and may actually be less.. you may even be able to find something that someone is discarding to do a higher end remodel.

    the second kitchen reno I did (my first IKEA kitchen), I found a used jenn air range for $270 that a guy got rid of when he gutted his kitchen. I loved it so much that I bought another jenn air new for my third kitchen. my fourth kitchen -current - has a cooktop, but the cost of just the cooktop was as much as a full range, and this is not even in the high end, though it is a good one. I saved no money doing this.

    The third kitchen had this kind of G shape and was in a tiny house, fit in a 9x12 space. it was very efficient, and two people could fit in it. It had lots of storage. you can have the corner base cabinets on the "open" side face towards the living room and can use it for non-kitchen things.

    and about the door - just because you "only" spent 200 on it, doesn't mean it looks shabby! That said, French doors will really add light to this space, and bring your garden indoors.

    you started out asking about contiguous counter space....

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    I think the KD was thinking in terms of space saving. I could get a 30" new gas range, and a new (regular) microwave, but I rarely use my stove, so it's taking up a decent amount of space in a small kitchen and it's not really being used much at all. So, more of a space-saving measure than anything else.

    If I do end up re-purposing the door (plastic - and the "glass" might actually be plexi) you know that means I'll probably want a window...!

    You have been so helpful, detroit_burb. I hope you'll be around for a while!

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    and I figured out the 10" thing based on the window measurements you put in.

    FYI,

    when I was doing this exercise on kitchen #3, I found that with Pella triple glazed windows with blinds between the glass (the priciest window on the market - yeah, I had to have em), each new opening (cottage size) cost me about 3-4K finished. Had I gone with the mid-priced Anderson wood with aluminum cladding (home depot carries this line), it would have been more like 2-2.5K.

  • 12 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    Here are current views out the kitchen window, back door & bay window (bay window view is looking toward the back/kitchen area.) It looks a lot different in May.

    Kitchen window:

    Kitchen door:

    Bay window: