I love being able to sweep water, crumbs, and other waste into the sink directly instead of my hand and then the sink. I do not at all miss the days of fighting the gravitational pull of the crumbs toward the counter as I'm trying to get get stuff/debris to hop from the countertop over the rim to the sink/disposal. I also do not at all miss the bead of caulking sealing the sink to the counter -- google for threads that talk about the blech-y condition of the caulking when the above counter sink was pulled out during the reno process and you'll see what I mean (ewww), not a great thing for the kitchen rag to be mingling with on a regular basis, IMO.

The sinks aren't all expensive and it depends on where you buy it. Search here for threads about sinks. Check overstock.com. The blanco I plan to buy is on overstock for $200 while locally it is $270+.

Galaxytoolsupply.com is another source popular with the folks here.

I agree with the other posters on the benefits of an undermount sink. It should not be expensive. Please tell us what sink you are looking at (name, and/or size, material, if you have a model number), and I am sure we can tell you alternatives just as good if not better for less money.

I agree with everyone.....undermount is the way to go. We bought a Ticor at overstock.com for half the price of buying it at a box store.

Thank you all so much for your responses!

We got a Ticor sink too from abovethedrain.com I hope this helps.

Here is a link that might be useful: http://www.abovethedrain.com/product_p/s113.htm

When you buy a Mercedes Benz, do you order it with roll up windows or no A/C?

In MY Opinion =

If you want to go cheap = order the self rimming sink.......

If you watt to go "first class" = get an undermount.

Either way - you are only going to buy what you can afford.... Either sink will work, but the UMS is pretty much recognized today as the way to go if you are doing Granite countertops.

Go big or go home

hth

kevin

Azstoneconsulting - the only problem with your analogy is that it reinforces the OP's mistaken opinion that an undermount sink is expensive, the way a Mercedes is. As noted in this thread, there is no reason to pay high prices for an undermount sink, because there are excellent 16-gauge stainless sinks for sale at very reasonable prices on overstock or galaxytoolsupply. You can also get a great Silgranit undermount sink in the $250-350 range. The OP is concerned that an undermount sink will add to the cost of her kitchen significantly more than an overmount would, which is not true.

A sink can be a low cost sink and still be great, fantastic, wonderful, high quality and a dream.

Cutting the sink cutout hole might cost the same amount. Then, if you want a full bullnose edge around the sink cutout, that might cost the same amount again. An undermount sink beautifully installed might cost 2 or 3 times the cost of the sink itself.

I guess my main question was, if we were to go top mount with the intention of doing undermount when we can afford it, would the granite have to be re-cut. Wonderful links, thanks to all who sent them. Our fabricator gave us a quote and said that it was all-inclusive, but now I am wondering if he would be charging extra for the undermount as it was never discussed.

There really isn't much difference between a sink meant for undermounting and one meant for drop-in. (Many can be installed either way!). Thus, there is not a lot of difference in price of the sink itself.

Your fabricator will have to do a nicer job on the hole for an undermount than he or she would have to do for a drop-in, so that could affect the price of the quote. (I cannot tell from the thread what your fabricator had in mind.) But I would be surprised if it is a big difference.

If you ever are going to do undermount, it would be false economy to do a drop-in now, and get another sink later. First, it would not save much upfront, not much at all! Second, you will then have a wasted sink and have labor charges to do another install later.

To directly answer your question, it seems very likely to me that if you do a drop-in now, that more granite work will be needed if you ever decide to do undermount later.

Thank you. I think subconsciously I knew this, but didn't want to face the realization that I may have to wait another 2 months to get my granite

ynnej -

In MY Opinion - to do a self rim to get the job in, and then switch to a UMS after the fact is insanity, as the process of taking out the stone and doing the undermount opening AFTER it's already been installed is crazy expensive and very inconvenient.

Here's the dealeo - The FIRST thing I wrote was "In MY Opinion" on both this and my previous responses..

Secondly - There's lots of guys that can get you a sink in SS that's not going to be an arm and a leg, AND - if - in this economy and with the existance of Craigslist and other sources - you cant find a good deal on an undermount sink.... well, (again - IMO) you're just not looking hard enough....

Since the majority of the folks that come here to GW are DIY'ers and people "on a budget" - I can understand that y'all want to save a buck whenever possible.

But I call a spade a spade, and when I see a self rimming sink on a beautiful granite countertop - the first thing that I think to myself is "cheap"....

Sorry if you get heartburn from that, but again Money talks and BS walks -

Oh yeah, and Angie DIY - There REALLY IS a difference between self rim sinks and UMS's (nomenclature and price)- Unless you ARE a real Fabricator - I'd respectfully suggest that you quit speculating on stuff that you're not really dialed in to......Like Granite Fabrication.

hth

kevin

No heartburn. I wanted honest answers and I got them. But we had bought a top-mount sink with faucet and sprayer for $100. You really can't beat that, and to us an extra $100 is a lot. But I see now that it's worth doing right in the first place, and that was the whole point of this thread.

wow...$100 to $300 is alot for an undermont in granite unless you figure in the cost of the sink !! I bought my sink...Blanco Silgranite Super Single...and beyond the cost of the sink which I thought for the quality/size wasn't bad...my granite installers only charged $75 for the undermount...with wood supports underneath...not just epoxy holding it up...I love it!!!

When we received quotes for cutouts in granite, there was no price difference b/w a cutout for an undermount sink and the cutout for a cooktop...even though the undermount sink cutout had to be finished/polished and the cooktop cutout did not. I mention this b/c I think a cooktop cutout is similar to an overmount sink cutout...i.e., just a rough cut. (IIRC, we got quotes in the $250 range for each cutout back in late 2007 in the DC-metro area.)

One of the reasons you need to install an undermount now is that the cutout must be cut to fit the specific sink you are installing and the edges have to be finished/polished. If you go w/an overmount, the sink cut out will probably be cut so it's "good enough" and not finished/polished b/c it will not be exposed. Having to re-cut and polish the cutout will be very expensive later and it will either have to be done onsite with all the mess (granite dust, water) that entails or they will have to very carefully remove the slab and do it at their shop...at the potential risk of breaking the slab and/or damaging cabinets.

Personally, I think it is well worth the wait to save up enough to be able to purchase an undermount sink and install it...even if you have to use plywood counters until then. The other option is to postpone something else that can easily be done later (like a backsplash or new appliance) and go ahead and put that money toward the sink & install.

HTH & Good luck!

ynnej, you are welcome. I am glad GW could help.

Kevin, I am glad you agreed with me on the vast majority of the OP's question. Beyond that, your respectful and unnecessary suggestion has been duly note, but will not heeded.

I love the look of my undermount, but I cannot stand the function!! I hate the way water splashes on the counter and onto the base of the faucets. I have always used a squirt bottle with white vinegar to be my sinks and faucets shiny and scale-free. My faucets never seem clean to me and that bugs me.

I cannot explain why the UMS is any different from my old drop-in, but it just is for me. Maybe I have heard too many stories about not using vinegar on natural stone, so I tend to not use the it everyday.

ynnej -- it's possible that you could still use the faucet and sprayer (that you got with the sink for $100) even if you decide to go with an undermount sink as holes for faucets are drilled into the granite by your fabricator, so the sink you choose should not prohibit you from using the faucet and sprayer. A faucet, by contrast, is pretty easily changed out down the road if you decide you want a differently functioning type or higher quality one (though I don't know the quality of the one you purchased, just assuming based on its price).

Kevin (re: your comment to AngieDIY): people generally know when they are coming to GW that they're getting amateur opinions and not expecting the same level of pin-point accuracy that they would expect if they were to visit a trade-only site. This board would cease to be useful if it had to rely on the the occasional professional to drop in and offer pro bono advice. I find Angie's and other's personal experiences and opinions very helpful and would not want to see her, or anyone else, discouraged from offering opinions just because they are not a professional. She didn't offer it up as "Angie, Grand Poobah of all things Granite", but as "Angie, DIY". When you or anyone else encounters what you believe to be misinformation then I think the generally accepted protocol of offering a simple correction of the misinformation is far more appropriate than telling someone to "refrain from speculating" on certain matters. I would hate to see what would be left of this board if every non-professional refrained from speculating on every subject that they weren't expert in. There'd be nothing left -- maybe one thread a day with one comment that would look and feel so much like self promotion that nobody would have the stomach to hang out here for long, IMO.

And to AngieDIY (re: your response to Kevin) -- you're a class act in my book.

Houseful - your splashing is most likely not having to do with your sink being undermounted. It is likely the faucet - its distance from the back of the sink, or its water pressure and where that is hitting. One of the complaints of a pull-down hi-arch faucet is that it is close to the back of the sink and can splash more than a faucet with a longer reach or not as high of an arch. Depends on the faucet, but in any case, I would not blame the water on your counter and at the base of your faucet on your undermounted sink. If the water really bothers you, you may want to look into replacing your faucet, which is not very difficult.

Depends on the faucet.

Depends on the aerator in the tip. Newer faucets have gentler streams. Their aerators do all the high tech work. Costs five or ten dollars. See neoperl.com for examples of aerators. Contact the faucet manufacturer to see what they can do.

There are a lot of dual mount sinks out there, but those that are meant for drop in installation cannot be substituted for undermount installation. They do not have a flat rim, which is 100% necessary in order to undermount a sink. The lip of that sink must fully contact the underside of the granite slab for a successful undermount.

It will be more costly to install a top mount now and then to try to go to an undermount later. The edge has to be cut to fit the sink 100% in an undermount situation, and it also has to be polished. That is why the industry charges an upcharge for that service. Even if it's not indicated on the quote, and you don't know it's there because it's a "one price" situation, it's there. You don't do a lot of tricky extra work for free, even in more difficult economic times.

If you were to choose to go with an toprmount now and attempt to upgrade later, you would have additional plumbing charges as well as additional labor charges from the granite fabricator. And, you'd have one of the worst things of all: cutting your granite on site! That's a nasty bit of business that should be done in a shop if at all possible. Even very careful fabricators can have grit escape their vacuums and granite grit destroys drawer slides and abrades floors and is just generally bad to have in your kitchen.

If it were me in your situation, I would ask additional companies for their quotes, and consider different colors from them as wel. Different granites can have different pricing from different wholesalers, and that can translate into quotes that vary significantly for the same job. But, before I'd be willing to accept a quote from a lower priced competitor, I'd want to physically view some of their installations first and ask several questions. A lower price could get you into your granite counters faster, or it could just give you a huge headache because the lower priced guys were the lower skilled guys as well.

Kris_ma: Thank you. Your explanation of GW seems spot on to me, and I appreciated your personal comments, too. I know it was silly to have been offended -- it is just a internet discussion board -- but I was grateful to see your response.