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chetthomas

Insulation help in Mid-Michigan

11 years ago

I will be insulating my house this year. I have spoken to many "Professionals" and I have heard mixed responses. I will not be using Fiberglass or Open Cell foam on my old house (due to the ineffectiveness of the products). The Studs are bare and will be ready for insulation around fall this year. All of the windows have been replaced with new vinyl Paradigm Double hung windows. The picture below illustrates the rest of the changes. The short explanation is that the house was falling apart all over the place and it turned into a complete overhaul. I don't need Air Conditioning (the roof reflects an amazing amount of heat currently even without insulation) , In the future I will be adding a high efficiency fireplace that will vent to the basement from the living room. Below is a depiction of a contractors suggestion. A majority of the basis for the insulation methods are based on the fact that the old boards in the house need to breathe that is why no exterior insulation is installed. All levels of the house will be used on a regular basis.

[Houzz Poll[(https://www.houzz.com/discussions/insulating-a-1940s-farmhouse-in-mid-michigan-dsvw-vd~2866465)

Comments (14)

  • 11 years ago

    What did the experts say about blown-in insulation?


  • 11 years ago

    I meant, spray insulation...


  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    The 6" Closed Cell (in Yellow) is spray foam. The Basement currently has over 1" of closed cell spray foam on the walls and outer floor joists. He recommended Closed cell spray foam for the ceiling, because of its air sealing properties and suggested against Open cell foam in the walls, because it will not allow that old walls to breathe. He would not suggest Open cell foam for any use, because of the way that it is applied and cut away destroys the air pockets that it is suppose to create, and it does not insulate as well as cellulose in the same thickness because of the cutting of the air pockets. He cited studies by several Universities. I especially like the facts about insulation performance in different temperatures, and over time. Initially I was worried about settling of the cellulose, however this is not a hole and fill procedure, the cavities will be bare stud so the cellulose will be sprayed directly on the walls.

  • 11 years ago

    I just had this conversation with my brother in law who is a contractor. So he was advising me without getting any benefit from our conversation. He said you can get research to support either open or closed. What can not be debated. Closed cell costs twice as much as open. If the roof leaks closed cell will not allow water to come through and open cell will. Having said that, the water leaking with the closed cell will still be getting in and finding its way through your house and you will have no idea it is happening... at least not for awhile until damage has occurred. Both products stop all air flow if properly applied. Both have similar ratings in insulation. My brother in law just built a home last year and used open cell. He says during the hottest months and the coldest months, there is only a 5 degree difference in his unheated attic from the living space of the home. He also likes the fact that he has been able to go up all winter and look for leaks in this first winter- and while he has had none - he is glad for the chance to find them. If I remember anything wrong, I am sure a Houzz person will support and clarify for me.

  • 11 years ago

    You will need something to circulate and filter your air. I personally think a house should breath rather then be closed tight. But that is also the way I think about a house.

  • 11 years ago

    The house will not be sealed tight, no plastic will be applied to the walls, no foam and tape on the outside. Considering the Open Celled vs. Closed Cell debate. Closed Cell formula is very different, and I am not at all concerned with a leak in my roof, If it would leak it would have in the three years that I have had it installed, short of the metal being punctured or rusting away. Through several articles online I can't justify using open cell foam because it has not been proven to be as air tight as closed, It is not my plan to completely seal the house, but I want the roof to be tightly sealed and the basement (already finished) I will most definitely install a whole house air circulation and filter if the need arises. Keep in mind that the walls will breathe because they will have cellulose. What I really need for great insulation debates is Educational (not promotional) material. I called six insulation companies in the area, and they had great promotional material and they could all talk, but only one had educational material not provided for by the product company, but bu individual Universities and Public Labs. A real contention that I have is that the best known installer (I can't name them, but it starts with an R) in our area has the most bad news surrounding their company. They claim to be experts, but three of my relatives used them and had major complaints about the product, all of which released from the studs. All were open cell foam. The product in question has several law suits against it and is not a good example to blanket all spray foams, but rather the "knowledgeable" sales individuals that my relatives thought that they had. For this reason I want all the educational material I can get to justify the insulating techniques for my Old House.

  • 11 years ago

    I've tried to sort out the insulation thing myself. Everybody has a different opinion with data to back them up. That's what makes it so hard for a homeowner/consumer. I suggest talking with an energy rater or "green" building pro who isn't trying to sell you something.


    chetthomas thanked Denice Shuty
  • 11 years ago
    What if you use HRV system in an air tight house.
  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    The house will in no way be airtight if the Closed cell insulation is only in the Basement and Roof. The HRV system would be something to look at if the house needed a new heating system, but right now the system is adequate, and in the future a High efficiency fireplace will be installed (about 2 years)

  • 11 years ago

    Right. If the walls were sprayed that's a different story. The roof needs to be vented from the soffit to ridge vent though or the shingles will be short lived and you could see mold in attic unless air circulates.

  • 11 years ago
    last modified: 11 years ago

    The Shingles are metal shingles and the Attic is non existent. No dead air space, only hard foam insulation will be installed and wood. Also the would be space is under 2ft

  • 11 years ago

    Good luck.

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