I agree it is hard to move an older rose bush but there are ways to make it easier. One way is to take just a piece of the whole bush. It's going to sound funny, but the fastest way to get a bush like grandma's is to find a place on her bush where you can cut away some of that bush with some plant and some roots still attached, and just plant that. It even works for grafted roses, which, after decades, seem to spread their graft buds out on the ground, growing off in maybe three directions with plant going both upward and downward from each of the three spokes. You can chain saw right through an old graft vertically, and it makes no difference. So go take a good look at the plant, and try to envision a place among the tangled mess at the bottom where some of it could go with you. You probably will have to cut back a good portion of the whole plant to see the structure and make those decisions. Kathy

That's interesting, Kathy. I had no idea you can do that. That's great info.

Carol

Hi Carol, Interesting. I was curious, why do you not let it get any light? Is that to prevent it from drying out while it's rooting or some other reason??

I'm not sure, I just noticed that the cuttings I had outside did better when they were in very little light. I tried all sorts of places. They only lived (barely) when they were in mostly shade. So once it got cold, I put them in the basement, and I thought I would try total dark. And they grew leaves!! I've done a few more cuttings since then, and success every time, when they're in the dark. Who knew?? :)

Carol

I've also split a rose and planted a piece of it and it does work. I just took a shovel and sliced into the crown and dug the piece out I wanted. After planting the piece it sulked for a bit but soon took off again.

You say you're north of Phoenix but not what zone you're in. If it's zone 9 or higher you can take cuttings any time. Zones 7 and 8 should be OK if they are protected from frosts and freezes. Any zones lower than that and now is NOT a good time to do cuttings. The roses are already going dormant in those zones so are not in growth mode. You might be able to do some hardwood cuttings and use the burrito method but you'd need to start them inside. Roses are never happy inside and it may be difficult to get them to root and stay alive long enough to get them outside in the spring.

If you go over to the Propagation forum and do a search there are many threads about methods of rooting cuttings. My suggestion would be to take many cuttings so you can try several different methods and see what works best for you. The more cuttings you stick the better your chances of success.

I will try your method Carol. Thanks. Kim's burrito method wraps up the canes, so they aren't exposed to light. The problem though was that I forgot about them. By the time I discovered them a month later, the canes had calluses, but were rotten. I need to set a reminder on my phone and try again.

Good luck. May you have green thumbs :-)

You can find more propagating suggestions at:

http://www.goldcoastrose.org/articles/propagation.pdf

If cuttings from the burrito method look like this after 11 to 12 days, you are well on your way

Oh wow!! That is really cool! I definitely did not see that when I tried the burrito method.

Carol

OK. Try Carol's method. Two weeks ago I took 12 cuttings of Compt de Chambrod and put them in starter pots in wet Vermiculite. Set them on a tray in front of one of the spare bedrooms window. They sat there and promptly dropped all their foliage. 12 green sticks. Then last Monday afternoon after reading what she had to say about putting them in the dark, I put them in the closet. Checked on them this evening and I have new growth and swelling bud eyes on 9 stems. 3 were black. Dead. I'll take this % of success any day. Up next week, Sunny Knock Out. I'll do 12 cuttings and see what happens when they go into the closet right away. Take as many cuttings as you can and put them in the dark for a week and see what happens.

Isn't that weird!!!??? I don't know why it works - but it does!

Carol

When you put them in the dark, does it need to be cold too?

Aha. this is the thread where I saw this about the "dark" propagation! Carol, as you know now, I am trying this with my florist roses. Hopefully it will work. I think it will because I do believe they root better in cold temps. When I had the potted roses in the lizard cage with the fluorescent light on 8-10hrs a day, they got too warm. Being this was a reptile house, it has a thermometer inside, and I could see the temps were reaching the 80s with no added heat inside. Just the light fixture, which is a good 3ft above the plants. The leaves and soil were getting moldy and in turn causing the stems to turn black. I'm sure the warmth is what caused that. Also, the established roses outside stalled somewhat during the summer temps, and are all now coming back to life with the colder weather. Much more growth and new canes popping up. Roses like cold weather... just not freezing temps! So I seriously think the warmth is what ruined the other cuttings. I guess we shall see.

I have a dozen cuttings each of SANTANA and QUICKSAND hopefully rooting in the dark and cold. So far so good. SANTANA has been in there for about 10 days and still look good with budeyes swelling. Same with QUICKSAND after 3 days.

I did try some burrito method last yr in the winter. Only tried florist roses. The very first batch calloused nicely after two weeks, but once I potted them up, they died. None of the subsequent attempts worked. So I quit that method. I suppose regular garden roses might work better, but I just never tried any of them.

I'm just having fun experimenting with different things, and I figure at some point, something has to work!!

SoFl - mine go in my furnance room on the floor. They're not hot, it's slightly coolish there. I think cooler temps would be better.

Good luck and have fun Beth!! I agree, heat would not be a good thing.

Carol

I'm just wondering if I should try putting them in my refrigerator. My biggest problem with rooting is the stems rotting before they can form roots which is why I ask. Maybe the cooler weather will help slow down the rotting.

Also, I have a question about leafing out. You say this causes the stems to form leaves but does it cause them to form roots? I've had many cuttings leaf out before only to find they've formed no roots at all, so I'm curious.

I never checked to see if they form roots. Never thought there wouldn't be roots. That's a good question. I can only say that it's been about a month, and they still look good.

I wouldn't put them in the refrigerator. But maybe you could make an experiment - put some in the refrigerator and others in a cool place in your basement.

Carol

I don't have a cool place (nor a basement LOL) as I live in South Florida. My coolest places are inside the house (77 degrees F. or in the fridge) which is why I ask if I should try the fridge. I think its worth a shot. My fridge is in the 40s. Its in the high 70 outside at night and in the mid to low 80s during the day right now.

Sure. It's worth a shot! It's hard to imagine not having a basement. Everyone here has one - unless you live in an apartment. :)

But if it's just the dark that's important (I'm not sure) - you could put them under a tub or something outside, as long as they're in the total dark. You could try both methods and see which one works best.

Carol

Here is a shot in the dark….

How about using the water your central air conditioner produces while running. The water is cold and is either piped outside or inside to a drain/sump pump tank.

By installing a Tee connector followed by an On/Off valve in the drain pipe that comes out of the A/C unit one could re-route the water flow into a pan that holds the rose cuttings. Once the water in the pan reaches a certain level it would then be routed back into the drain pipe. The roses would be watered and cooled down at the same time. A plumber should be able to do that very easy.

Of course if the water would harm the cuttings then like I said…. shot in the dark….

I also have great luck propagating rose with very little light. Don't know why it works but it does. However I have never tried difficult to root roses. Also need to find a way to keep our raccoons from digging them up.

Cool idea toolbelt (pun intended). I think I'll try both methods and see if I have any success with either. I have my own method that yields around an 80% success rate but its kind of pricey and time consuming. Looking for a better way if possible :)

Mine work very well outside all season on the north side of my house placed behind various shade plant were they total are in shade. When I see a rose flower popping thru they are placed into a pot to grow further.

Glad to see you have taken this to basement Carol. In our short season we can root much later. Let us know how every thing goes. Also very happy to see this has worked for you as well.

As I mentioned to someone else in a hotter area. My rooting area is type of place where astilbe excels moist airy soil. Placed behind perennials where they get no light and the larger plants keep them from getting to much moisture. Most likely very little moisture as we received no rain from June till middle of August. Also placed some cuttings behind daylilies and others roses all took and grew. Can guaranty those behind the daylilies were kept in dryish soil.

In the mean time those in pots and under soda bottles, baggies ect. rotted. To much moisture for here. Maybe the difference for here is our high humidity. So do not know what would happen in arid climates. Even if done over winter perhaps they need that humidity to root this way.

I do so wish I had thought mention on the other thread this humidity issue to her as her area may indeed be to dry. That she may need to find a way to raise the humidity for this to work.

Humidity was the reason why I laid a bag over the roses - I thought it would keep the humidity just a little higher. :)

Good luck everyone!!

Mmarcanti, it's been a week, so if you took cuttings right away and are trying Carol's method, it's time to check on them. The only reason why I remembered mine was because the alarm I had set on my smart phone. Ha. I'm not sure how to tell how my cutting is doing. The bud eyes are swelling. Is that a good sign?

Yes it is, thats another possible success. Jasmine I tend too leave mine alone until they begin to grow little leaves. We'll see what Carol does with hers.

Yay!! Bud eyes swelling is a good sign!! I would leave them in the dark a little while longer if it were me. I agree with Patty, you want to see some leaves.

Yeah, mine are about to pop leaves any day on the first batch. I've been giving them about 2hrs of light once in awhile just so they don't come out white. I'm so excited. Nothing is turning black at all. No mold. Nice moist stems and swelling buds! Potted up some gorgeous FAITH stems a few days ago, and CHERRY BRANDY yesterday! We'll see what happens...

I figure once the leaves do start popping out, I'll remove that batch and put them outside in a sheltered area where they can get a little natural light, and go from there...

Awesome Beth!!! Good for you!!! They look so pretty and green when it works well! Carol