It seems to be an issue in the UK, but not so much here. However, what is often recommended in the UK is to plant the new rose in a cardboard box with fresh soil, then plant the box in the ground. I've never done it, but I know it's done. See link below -- and google "planting a rose in a cardboard box" for more results.

http://www.finegardening.com/give-new-roses-good-boxing-around-roots?tid=7

:-)

~Christopher

It is an issue here in Europe in general, I believe. Here in Italy nurseries say "do not plant roses where other roses have been grown previously. If this is not an option,change the soil..." The recommendations for how large an area must be changed differs; it tends to be an area of about 50 cms squared. I have a sort of hunch that this problem is more serious in the UK,but here it does exist,apparently. Personally I'm not so sure that the box is necessary as long as you change the soil, but I'd advise to take a look at Christopher's link,since even if you don't use the box, it'll give a clear idea of how much old soil could be too worn out/(infected??? ) to be a welcoming environment for the new roses. In any case, add lots of organic matter to the surrounding area as well,I'd say...

The accepted wisdom here, is to grow something else in the spot for at least 2 years or replace a cubic metre of soil, but a rosarian in Sth Aust. uses the method AquaEyes talks about, so I tried it with success. From what I have gathered in these forums it doesn't seem to be much of an issue in the US. How big is the area you are replanting? Melodye

The American Rose Society recently published an article about rose replant disease.

http://forums2.gardenweb.com/discussions/1617691/recent-rose-replant-article?n=2

The full paper for Sato's article about the rose roots giving off an inhibiting chemical is available at:

http://wwwlib.teiep.gr/images/stories/acta/Acta%20697/697_66.pdf

It's not an issue here in Idaho, and I have a few roses that have been preceded by two different roses planted previous to the current ones. I doubt (just my opinion, of course), that it would be an issue in Oregon, either. Out of curiosity, what is supposed to happen in rose replant disease? Diane

Thank you for the tips all. Melodye, the area is about 18 X 15 ft. I really appreciate that thought, that the mycorrhizal fungi could help, Marlorena. Will hope for the best, but I'll try to at least put a box full of new soil and M.F. around each plant. I really don't understand why Europe would be different than the U.S. on this issue, but it seems to be true to some extent.

I cross posted, Diane. I gather roses are supposed to "fail to thrive" and just sit there if so afflicted. In Alaska, in my old garden, that could happen but for a different reason like cold and soil temperature,low heat index, one could assume. With so many variables, it can be hard to establish causality. Here, so far, it is heaven, comparatively, but this will be the first area I "replant".

...best of luck with that Sheila, I hope all goes well for you.... I can't understand why it's not so much a problem elsewhere but to answer Diane's question, if you don't make any amendments then what happens is that the new rose will just sit there and do nothing, it will try to send out a few weak shoots, might get an odd bloom that won't look right, but you can see very quickly it's struggling... I've sometimes dug up a rose like that and moved it to another location and within a short time it's thrived again... also, I have read and found this to be true in that if you plant the new rose a foot or so either side of the centre point where the old rose was growing, then you might get away with it... I've had some success with that..

...I've got a couple of roses that have suffered the whole of this past season as I didn't amend at the time, done absolutely nothing for me, and I know they've got it, but I can already see signs of recovery this early and I'm hopeful they will take off this coming summer... but all my replantings now get the MF, as I feel it's a worthy extra expense for just a few roses here and there.... I wouldn't like to replant dozens...

Yes, Sheila, southern Oregon is indeed heaven, one of my favorite and most beautiful places in the U.S. Thanks for the info Sheila and Marlorena. I kind of thought the symptoms would be as you described. I will watch out for this phenomenon. Diane

Another trick against root nematodes on roses is to grow Mexican tagetes, Tagetes minuta for one season, then dig in the wilted plants. It worked for me when I had to replant a large area where roses had grown for many years. The orange looked terrible next to pink roses but it was worth it. I shouldn't worry if roses had grown only up to 5 or 6 years in one place.

If the syndrome is a result of autotoxic inhibition it shouldn't really matter if it is the US or England, although soil particulars will matter.

That's one of the things that intrigue me - I have wondered but have not turned up so far (although I admit I could probably have tried more diligently) whether differing rootstocks have an impact upon this - all the links I've come across lately have been behind a paywall and right now I don't have academic access unfortunately - and alas the abstracts don't indicate. Anyone seen any reasearch into this?

Never found any research done on this, fduk. Have often wondered the same thing, but nobody I talked to had any ideas on the subject.

Possible factors that, if present, could potentially provide partial explanation of any existing or imaginary discrepancy between different countries / continents:

. Native (and invasive) soil microbial and fungal life.

. Difference in prevalent cultural practices, including monoculture vs mixed plantings and fertilisation practices. Rootstocks used might be an important factor as correctly pointed out above. I note than in Europe (including England) roses are almost invariably grafted and the stocks tend overwhelmingly to be variants of R. canina.

. Different climatic conditions in a large part of one country / continent which affects plant vigour and forms prevailing opinion. If plants grow vigorously due to extended warm periods then any such syndrome might go unnoticed (though not in the context of commercial agriculture).

I point out that 'replant syndromes' seem to be common in many kinds of monocultivation including fruit orchards, vegetable fields and annual crops. Maybe there's more to the age old practice of crop rotation than simple nutrient availability.

According to Peter Beales, the answer is number one. For many years, the organism went undetected. However, it is now known, and has some fancy scientific name that I've never ever tried to remember since it has nothing to do with my life.

According to the Royal Horticultural Society here, and I take it they would be up to date on the issue...

''It is believed to be caused by a build-up of soil pests and pathogens during the life of the first planting. Fungal root diseases and nematodes (eelworms) are favourite suspects....

...........The best evidence in favour of this theory is that the problem is eliminated by soil sterilisation, suggesting a biological cause.''

...it's not a huge problem for us home gardeners as we have several work arounds, already described, if we are vigilant enough... although I've never tried the box route - never seem to have boxes handy...

..but for commercial growers, I notice around here where there are several rose fields in use, after digging them all up for sale in the autumn, they move to the next field which may be just across the road, for the following season, then another and another in following seasons. I'm not sure how many years pass before they return to a field previously used for this purpose.

One thing I also agree with the RHS on is that if you plant a rose then after just a few months decide to remove it for whatever reason, and plant another in its place straight away, the 2nd rose can suffer replant disorder. I've found that to be the case too.

I could never understand how all these supposed pests and pathogens that are 'built up' affect just the new plants and not the old ones not to mention the English roses but not the American ones. More needs to be found out.

PS. I'm sure the phenomenon is to some degree real. It is just that it seems to be so complex and multi-factored (as complex as soil and plant life is..) that defies simplistic explanations.

My roses are overwhelmingly own-root and I've replanted in the same area numerous times and haven't encountered a problem. Perhaps I should amend that because certain roses have just sat there for a season or a year and I just assumed it was because they were bands and would be very slow. I recently put Charles Darwin where Rina Hugo used to be, although probably about half a foot off center, and it will be interesting to see what happens. One side of the new hole was actually rock so that should be even more of a challenge. Sometimes I think I demand too much of my roses....

This is a full 2015 research paper concerning apple replant disease.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4654428/

fduk-- let me know what academic articles you want to access and I will try to get them for you, I'm very interested about this topic as well.