To clarify:

Specifically, is the 3.5% "organic" N in the product produced through what we traditionally consider organic processes (i.e. by soil micriobiological action on a natural occurring organic material)?

One source of "N is Urea and all of the Urea used in fertilizers is man made, synthetic. Another source is ammonia, another synthetic product.

kimmq is kimmsr

Hmmm...methinks kimmsr actually forgot to read something.

Secondarily, anyone who has read what kimmsr has had to say over time knows the answer. First, this is a manufactured product. It cannot, in the world of kimmsr, be organic. Let's forget that the product is sifted, composted poultry bedding...which would explain both the urea and the ammonia. Second, kimmsr has a long record of proudly defending your pocketbook. How dare someone suggest actually buying a product? !!! Silly question!

Hmmm, methinks someone did not read the product description very well. This product is more than just "sifted, composted poultry manure". The product description says the Nitrogen sources are Urea and Ammonia, both man made, synthetic, products.

There may be times when an organic grower may need to purchase a product, but if that grower has made the soil into a good healthy soil and is growing strong and health plants there will be less need to do that.

Organic growing is about much more than simply spending money just as those that practice what is erroneously known as "conventional" gardening.

kimmq is kimmsr

There are times I should know better.

I wish we lived in an era where there was an b easy way access any information you wanted. Doh!

Basic biological chemistry. I make a product that gets secreted from my body. Far from being an industrial process, this is an age old biological process. Organic? Distasteful? Smelly? Actually, if something in my body is messed up, there will be less urea and more of some form of ammonia.

Which brings us to poultry. If only there was an existing body of literature demonstrating what the chemical composition of barnyard manure was, by animal. If only there was an existing body of literature that demonstrated how the by-products of animal husbandry broke down.

Urea is a natural by-product of urine. So is ammonia. If the biological chemistry of a bird industrial in and of itself, then so be it. Can they also be produced in energy-intensive industrial manufacturing plants? No reason both can't be true. But when urea is produced in an industrial plant...what is the nitrogen percentage?

So yeah, I read the entire linked brochure. I also double checked livestock manure management stuff, both technical bulletins detailing the chemistry of livestock manure, by animal, and management plans in field use, detailing how nutrients derived from manure break down in the field/environment.

So when I tell you that the urea and ammonia content are explained by biological chemistry, I i'm just too lazy to scan the documentation sitting on my shelves.

Yes, Urea is a natural product in the urine of animals but it is highly unlikely that enough Urea can be captured from that source to supply the needs of today. Urea is synthesized by reacting Ammonia with Carbon Dioxide, in a factory. No one stands around with buckets to capture the urine from animals anywhere.

Ammonia is also manufactured today, although it does occur naturally. Nature cannot produce enough Ammonia to meet the needs of today.

Both chemical processes have been around for a very long time and are the backbone of the chemical industry. Manufactured Urea has a Nitrogen analysis of 45 percent.

Perhaps this article may be of some help.

http://www.nzic.org.nz/ChemProcesses/production/1A.pdf

kimmq is kimmsr

So a product with a label of less than 5% total nitrogen, derived from both a range of sources, must be produced industrially, because it contains small amounts of source products that are produced both as a result of natural biological chemistry as well as energy intensive industrial manufacturing?

Industrially produced urea fertilizers generally contain 40%+ nitrogen, ammonium is even higher. So if a product has a urea content of 0.15% and ammonia content if 1.1%, there is precisely 0.00% chance that the origination is from manures, as the manufacturer clearly states?

Personally, I'm hoping the question comes from someone who makes the stuff, so they can answer.

Just keep in mind, Wayne, that manufacturers of many products have told us what they made was safe only to find out later that they lied about that and the product was recalled or banned.

kimmq is kimmsr