Yes.

If the market is competitive there - you will have issues finding people that will want to work with you one time - they will likely focus on their repeat customers. Consider a GC for hire / flat fee type arrangement instead of a traditional builder if you want to maintain more control - that way they can bring the relationships and there's no incentive to jack up the price / budget, as the GC gets the same no matter what. (fixed fee / monthly salary, etc)

Just realize that your schedule will be longer than a volume builder because of the above.

This would only work if you already know subs and have worked with them before. I DO understand your desire for control over your project!

No lender will deal with you.

If it's all cash, and time and dollars spent don't matter, sure give it a spin!

FWIW, I can always spot a self-build--two or four times longer and glaring costly errors visible every time you drive by.

I built on one street where three nearby high-end homes were owner-built. My favourite was the one where the restaurant owner/builder leased his own earth-moving equipment and he and his friends were piloting dozers and giant backhoes around the oversized excavation they created. Until their playing in the sand collapsed an adjacent lot, which severed a natural gas line starting a house fire. After the fire department was through, the city issued a stop work order and the entire lot had to be cribbed like an office tower with professionals in charge.

Enjoy!

Unfortunately, "living through an extensive remodel of our existing home" is very different (and simpler) than being in charge of all of the scheduling of workers and materials, coordinating and managing the actual work, evaluating the quality/accuracy of the work and dealing with predictable call-backs.

Jannicone is right on the money when it comes to your challenge in attracting and retaining high quality sub-contractors.

Simple answer to your question: Yes!

Almost anything can be done, given sufficient time and will. However, if you don't have a lot of background in construction (IMO one remodel isn't sufficient to show you the world of exquisite pain that is the essence of construction), then you are going to have a tough row to hoe. You can call it tuition, in the school of hard knocks. ;)

The difficult issues are finding good subs, and knowing what to pay them. If you are saving 20% on not having GC and paying 30% extra for labor and 20% for materials - you are not saving anything at all. Scheduling is not a big issue: you can find Microsoft Project file - scheduler template with the power of google. Banks do not want to deal with owner build also some exceptions can be found.

Builder account and homeowner account give me a significantly different quotes at the suppliers. I had a good luck retaining felons on the run from both CraigsList and Menards contractors list. So watch-out. [they did not rip me off, but did not do a stellar job either]

Building is a big enough headache with hundreds of decisions to make, even if you don't GC yourself. I know I've spent weeks and weeks researching all sorts of things for our build, and we haven't even started building yet. Why would you want to add to the stress by being your own GC?

Additionally, your GC will get discounts you won't. So even though it will cost you probably a 20% upcharge, it may still turn out to be less than if you had to buy it yourself.

1 more thing? Being in a shore town on Long Island means you have to deal also with flood zones and how to build to account for that.

We're doing a self build - listed as the GC on the permits. We also have a bank loan - so the bank issue isn't impossible - but it took some doing.

We also have a GC (the same guy who built our house 20 years ago!) so he's semi retired / only doing GC for hire after the bust an his business failed. He paid every single sub back and is well respected so folks enjoy working with him. We're lucky - he watches out for our money like it's his and we may him monthly for on site supervision, coordination, knowing and scheduling certain subs, miscellaneous things like when we needed 18 sheets of OSB cut into thirds to protect some stuff, etc.

If you are doing self build - you will spend more time, money and energy than simply hiring it out. And unless you are doing something really different - there's little reason to do it yourself.

You can get more creative that the standard 20% contractor uncharge - but, as they say, there's no free lunch.

Thank you one and all for all the input. Can anyone suggest how to go about finding a GC vs. a builder?

I had a good luck retaining felons on the run from both CraigsList and Menards contractors list.

LOL

Once, I had a roofer redoing some flashings. I was up close with him on the roof and remarked on his cut-up hands. "Hazards of working with sheet metal," I said. "No, I just did a number on a guy last night. Beat the s*** out of him. Coppers are lookin' for me." Sure enough, it was on the radio the next day.Glad I didn't quibble over his fee!

LOL

One of the felons defrauded 10th of thousands and we discovered she was on State wanted list with extensive criminal record, countless victims and numerous newspapers stories. She operated company under pretty common name, we paid check to - so no way for us to know. I knew her first name, at the end of the job she mentions her lastname to write quick check to, claiming she needs quick pay. Quick google few days later and it came up few her pictures... She was obviously living in the van, so no address.

Yeah, I was glad I didn't quibble over her fee, and wrote quick check!

IN general been own contractor is not that bad. It is all about doing homework.

We do not use separate excavation company, so foundation is one contractor for all foundation jobs (and two inspections), framers (second all under black paper), [windows installed by framers], next trim and siding third, HVAC, plummer, electrical, [inspection], insulation, drywall [hang team and finis], painting, flooring, finish carpentry.

The biggest issue most face is when sub contractor claims outrageous prices: 160 sq for siding, $40k metal roof [who are they kidding], $25k for framing, 20k electrical [yeah right] ,18k plumbing for 2.5 bath....

Lumber yards also tend to do this as well. Never overpay.

No

Excellent, Mark, except...maybe? Or, perhaps?

I wouldn't say you are crazy for considering it - it is appealing to think that you could save enormous amounts of money and have greater control. But it isn't going to happen that way. I'm from a nice, but less appealing part of the NYC area than you are, and we went through that exercise this past winter ahead of our build. From family, including us, living in the area for decades we have a pretty good network of subs. But we couldn't even get enough concrete bids together from them to move forward - there's just too much work out there for them with GCs to delve into the potential headaches of an owner-build. And from what we saw, our best case would be saving 10-15% (still a lot of money), but the more likely case would have been 0-5%, a substantially longer timeline, and immense amounts of stress. Thankfully our contractor has been great (knocks wood), and has allowed us a lot of freedom in shopping for finishes and using our own electrician (and low voltage), so we've saved a bunch that way.

If you'd like to be on the more involved side and have time, I would ask your contract to not include finishes, appliances, cabinetry, plumbing fixtures, etc. You can spend endless amounts of time researching and shopping for deals on that stuff and save a lot, plus feel that you are putting effort into your home build beyond picking from a catalog.

So, no you are not crazy, but it might be a bit unrealistic. It depends on your motive for doing it. If it is simply to save money you are probably not going to see significant savings, if you are doing it for quality control there are probably better alternatives, but if you are looking at it as an adventurous journey of learning and self discovery (a.k.a. -Mushcreek) then you are perfectly sane.

I personally don't like the typical builder/G.C. model. These can be modified to something I like, pretty easily and many architects and lawyers will be familiar with the modifications.

In short, you want to build the best home you can afford, while the builder wants to keep you happy while making the most profit he can. This doesn't make him a bad person, it makes him a good businessman and the best businessmen have the happiest customers so they do many things right. However, you still have different goals. There are ways to align goals with various bonuses and savings sharing.

The option that I prefer, is to work with a Construction Manager. A C.M. acts as your agent for building a house, from the outside he appears a general contractor and has almost all of the same powers (get bids, sign contracts, etc.) however, he is signing as your representative and not his. The subs all work for you and not him. This removes the profit motive from him, his pay shouldn't be related to sub pay or cost of the job other than small performance bonuses. But C.M.'s have serious problems too, any costs absorbed by the builder, including quality issues, will now be absorbed by you. It is not a cheaper way to build a house but you can get more quality control.

Construction Manager

Even though I was a licenced builder and renovator, I often found this an easier way to do things. I got an agreed-on paycheque. And no endless calculations as owners changed their minds over a build and unexpected costs arose.

On the other hand, as the client, you have to be confident that your manager is working 100% for you and your interests. I knew other managers who would routinely brag of the "tips" that subs were paying them for picking them for a build.

I knew other managers who would routinely brag of the "tips" that subs were paying them for picking them for a build.

I was going to mention this and I know it does happen a lot in the real world. It is, however, a crime in the U.S. and not just a civil wrong, there are statutes in all 50 states and a Federal statute that make it a crime. A lot of times you can discourage this with a notice that you will turn over evidence of kickbacks/bribes for prosecution. This is such a common practice that many people don't realize they are committing a crime and simply informing them can stop a lot of it.

^ I would love to see kickbacks end, but it's so common, so embedded in the system, that people seem to think it's the normal way of doing things, like baksheesh. I could tell the subs all day long that kickbacks are criminal, but I think they'd tell me to take a hike. Using more colorful metaphors, naturally.

Of course, I'm not a lawyer, and if Bry got on their case, such that they thought they might actually get in real trouble, it might carry more weight.

OTOH, it could be because I'm a woman, and also, not very good at rhetorical persuasion. It's a constant struggle to get some of these guys to listen at all, a massive uphill battle, in my experience.

I don't think it has anything to do with being a woman. I suspect you would get the same result if you were their cousin. People tend to look out for themselves and the only way to discourage that is with a carrot and/or a stick. Pointing out that they may get in trouble for doing it is the stick, you can also try to institute a bonus that rewards them for producing quality work under budget. Lots of people are pretty good at doing money math - $1,500 in under the table sub money isn't worth losing a $3,500 bonus.

^ True, unless it's a network of reciprocal kickbacks expected on every job. Tony pays a little kickback to Donny, expecting to get the same treatment on the next job, plus referrals. That adds up over time, "farmed" for the long run, like a policeman taking graft. And if you don't know the guys, you can't even map the network-- it's not a transparent, rational system of pricing.

I'm not saying incentives don't work, but in my experience, the social network connections tend to trump everything else. Unless, I suppose, you were offering enough money to overcome all "scruples," but that would defeat the purpose. In any case, people have been trying to stamp out corruption in construction since forever, and nothing has ever been completely successful, whether carrot or stick.

But that may be my cynicism talking. I'd hire you to be my "enforcer," fer shur. ;)

I guess I must be crazy, and lucky. DH and I built a home last year and did the GC ourselves, mostly me actually. We hired subs for all the big stuff, but I installed the cabinets and built the stairs, we laid all the wood and tile floors, painted, did trim work, etc. I got bids for subs and we had good luck with everyone except the bricklayer--I think he over-committed himself and stopped calling me back when we were getting close to needing him. We found another, and things moved right along. Although several posters mentioned not finding anyone willing to do a small job, we found that being a small job meant they could squeeze us in and get paid fast. I paid suppliers directly for all our materials, so I didn't have to pay any subs upfront (so no one absconded with our money as I'd heard from horror stories!). Our title company cut checks as soon as I submitted them, and I paid promptly. I literally handed a check to our roofer as he climbed off his ladder for the final time, and don't you know when the plumber didn't seal around the vent pipe in the roof correctly and we had a little leak, that roofer came an hour after I called him and fixed the problem :) I worked full-time in my real job while doing this, but had the luxury of just being a few blocks away and could field phone calls pretty easily. It was definitely an adventure, but we loved the experience and love our house.

@chellefnp - where is your new home (roughly)?